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Dispute Arises Over a Push to Change Climate Panel
New York Times ^ | April 2, 2002 | ANDREW C. REVKIN

Posted on 04/02/2002 3:32:39 PM PST by liberallarry

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My emphasis. Italics indicate my comment.
1 posted on 04/02/2002 3:32:39 PM PST by liberallarry
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To: Howlin
Hey! Look here! Yet another thing that "Gore would have also done!" Snort!
2 posted on 04/02/2002 3:35:34 PM PST by Miss Marple
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To: liberallarry
"Chief Scientist of the World Bank" sure sounds like an oxymoron. And why does the World Bank need an atmospheric scientist in the first place?

Anyway, can his @ss before its too late.
3 posted on 04/02/2002 3:39:45 PM PST by balrog666
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To: liberallarry
The current upward trend in global temperatures began in 1700, after three centuries or so of unusually low temperatures. It is cooler now than it was 1000 years ago; it was even warmer than that 3000 years ago. The religious dogma that Sinful Man is Ruining Gaia with His Evil Industry is unsupported and unsupportable.

Barf Alert

4 posted on 04/02/2002 3:41:03 PM PST by Chairman Fred
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To: liberallarry
No doubt we "could" change the climate, the question is are we? Would we have to burn all of Saudi's oil at once, or are what we doing now changing the climate. I've seen nothing convincing that we are.
5 posted on 04/02/2002 3:41:18 PM PST by Shermy
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To: Miss Marple
Oh, yeah....I see exactly what you mean. There really ISN'T any difference, is there?

Har!

6 posted on 04/02/2002 3:44:09 PM PST by Howlin
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To: liberallarry;cogitator
Bump!
7 posted on 04/02/2002 3:44:20 PM PST by alaskanfan
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To: liberallarry
Just because someone's a "scientist" doesn't mean they know anything. And it certainly doesn't mean they are objective and unbiased.

I would nominate a bum from State Street because that would mean there's one less bum on State Street.

Most bums are delusional so I'm sure the one nominated could do a great job with the fake Global Warming(TM) problem.

8 posted on 04/02/2002 3:45:39 PM PST by Duke Nukum
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To: Duke Nukum
I don't know how many times I've seen people criticized for offering "informed" opinion outside their area of expertise. But when the experts offer unwanted opinions then suddenly their expertise is no longer valuable

If the Administration wants to ignore the best scientific opinion - either because it prefers minority views or on economic or other grounds - fine. But it shouldn't corrupt that opinion. That's spin of the worst sort.

9 posted on 04/02/2002 3:54:37 PM PST by liberallarry
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To: liberallarry
All I can say is "thank god for Global Warming". Saved us from a horribly chilly fate.
10 posted on 04/02/2002 3:55:02 PM PST by samtheman
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To: liberallarry
How can the corrupt be corrupted? Isn't that like cleaning soap? Or an eye seeing itself?
11 posted on 04/02/2002 4:06:39 PM PST by Duke Nukum
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To: liberallarry
Yeah, but Newsweek just announced the world is cooling.

I'm sooo confused now.

12 posted on 04/02/2002 4:17:27 PM PST by Rudder
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To: liberallarry
"Dr. Watson is an outspoken advocate of the idea that human actions — mainly burning oil and coal — are contributing to global warming and must be changed to avert environmental upheavals."

The average temp. of the Earth is 18oC. The max temp rise at the current rate of CO2 increase is 1.8oC, in 2100. That's the limit, it's impossible to go beyond that temp rise. In fact the sun seems to be heating up and that's the real cause of the observed Earth temp rise. There is no disaster pending. These folks need to limit their projections and computer outputs to the limits placed by reality. A 1.8oC rise is a 0.6% increase in global energy in the year 2100 and that assumes the Earth itself doesn't suck up the heat. That's an atmospheric temp rise only.

The real consequences of the greenhouse gas increase are insignificant and absolutely don't warrent reducing the world to a socialist, stone age serfdom. Folks in the free market will have plenty of time to arrange for other energy sources to replace the fossil fuels that are presently used. There is no catastrophy pending as these folks claim. Their sole purpose is to play Sim Earth and control world economies.

13 posted on 04/02/2002 4:19:18 PM PST by spunkets
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To: liberallarry
Abolishing the IPCC would be the best policy. It is no longer needed.
14 posted on 04/02/2002 4:24:44 PM PST by Number_Cruncher
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To: liberallarry

The Problem with getting your News from the New York Times is they only tell you what these Liberals think you should be told "all the news that fits" their Liberal agenda ... they forget the rest of the story

"Global Warming: Watson Indulges in Scare Tactics... Again

... Mind you, Watson is the same scientist who, in 1992, predicted an imminent ozone hole in the Northern Hemisphere. You remember the event; then-Senator and soon-to-be Vice President Gore called it "an ozone hole over Kennebunkport" (former-President George Bush's summer compound). Watson's (and Gore's) purpose was to stampede the U.S. Senate into a mandate that would reduce chlorofluorocarbon refrigerants. They succeeded, even though the ozone hole never appeared. "

This is Watson's second go at buffaloing a Bush Administration. Big Media's eagerness to go along is breathtaking. The January 23 edition of The Washington Post put this particular global warming story above the fold on its front page! The play could have been bigger only were it in the upper left-hand corner rather than the right.

A model of a model Neither the Post nor Watson mentions that this forecast of extreme warming is the result of a computer model. And not just any model, either. It is a product of the most extreme climate model run under the most extreme set of future emission scenarios. In other words, it's not a model based upon present trends; it's a model of a model! Putting a fine point on it, this particular result was produced by one (that's right, one) of 245 models the modelers ran.

In the backrooms at science meetings, the technique Watson and the IPCC have used in this instance is derided as a "toy model." This is because it treats the world largely as a uniform entity, one devoid of ocean currents, without mountains, and with no thunderstorms. Ocean currents, mountains, and thunderstorms just happen to be the three things that are the major movers of heat around our planet. They generally keep the Earth's surface temperature cooler than it otherwise would be.

It's not that there weren't other computer models available. There are. There were nearly 20 different sophisticated, but still flawed, models tested in the IPCC's TAR called general circulation climate models (GCMs). If Watson were forthcoming, he would have pointed out that the average for those models was a rise of only about 3.8°F--or some 2.75 times less than the extreme value Watson and the Post trumpet."

This is from: Global Warming: Watson Indulges in Scare Tactics... Again

It is a good thing the Bush administration will try to get a biased agitator out of harms way and seek slightly better balance in the IPCC.

15 posted on 04/02/2002 4:29:37 PM PST by WOSG
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To: liberallarry
"If the Administration wants to ignore the best scientific opinion -"

They don't. The facts are in post 13, given the sun keeps a steady output and all the heat goes into the atmosphere. That's the limit and it's nothing to harp and scare folks about.

16 posted on 04/02/2002 4:32:55 PM PST by spunkets
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To: spunkets; WOSG
I'm not arguing the science. That's what experts are for.

...urging from energy industry lobbyists,

If the reporting is accurate, neither is the Bush administration. They want to get rid of Dr. Watson because industry doesn't like him - i.e. the reasons are economic.

WOSG's argument is a little different; Watson is a politician masquerading as a bad scientist. Maybe, but if the Administration made that point, the New York Times didn't report it.

17 posted on 04/02/2002 4:55:51 PM PST by liberallarry
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To: liberallarry
your screen name gives your comment. Leave FR.
18 posted on 04/02/2002 4:59:07 PM PST by rwfromkansas
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To: liberallarry
"if the Administration made that point, the New York Times didn't report it. "

Duh!

19 posted on 04/02/2002 5:01:28 PM PST by mrsmith
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To: mrsmith
If you're saying the Administration made points not reported by the Times, then state those points and show me your source.
20 posted on 04/02/2002 5:23:53 PM PST by liberallarry
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