Feds shun help with firefighting: Forest Service asks for private dozers, then turns them down

When the U.S. Forest Service asked Ron Largent, general manager of a major gold-mining operation in Colorado, for the use of some extra-heavy equipment to fight the Hayman fire, he was more than happy to help.

Cutting strings and red tape, in a matter of hours Largent and his mine operations superintendent, David Tolhurst, arranged for two behemoth bulldozers – Caterpillar D-10 bulldozers, which the Forest Service specifically requested – to be hauled 25 miles north, from the Cripple Creek and Victor Gold Mine near Cripple Creek to Lake George, where a command center for fighting the fire had been set up. With their super-wide blades the "dozers" could cut firebreaks relatively quickly to halt the advance of the inferno that was raging out of control.

But when they arrived, the Forest Service in an about-face decided it didn't need the bulldozers and couldn't find a use for them – saying in effect, thanks, but no thanks.

"It was pretty incredible," says Bill Newman, operations project manager of Ames Construction, the Denver firm that transported the bulldozers to Lake George. "[The Forest Service] had requested that equipment."

Newman recalls, "There was myself and two of the mine's operators and transport drivers, and the chief of police from Cripple Creek, and we were just looking at each other like, this can't be happening; this can't be real. People are losing their homes here, and here is the free use of equipment and they're turning it away."

With 137,000 acres of woodland laid waste by the Hayman fire and 133 homes lost, many residents of the area are scratching their heads over the decision. Others are very angry.

The fiasco began Wednesday, June 12, with a call from a staff person in Rep. Joel Hefley's, R-Colo., Colorado Springs office to Largent. The fire was just 4 days old, but already showing the promise of being Colorado's biggest in over a century.

"He (the staff person) said he knew about us, knew we had equipment and wondered if we would be willing to loan some to the Forest Service," said Largent, recalling the conversation.

Largent agreed, and when an official from the Forest Service contacted him a few minutes later, he gave him a list of equipment the mine could provide. Next morning he learned the Service had selected two D-10s as well as a smaller D-8, which was owned by Ames Construction.

The D-10 is a monster machine. Two stories high, its 16-foot-wide blade can knock down anything in its way, including trees.

"There's not a tree in the forest that these dozers couldn't push out of the way – they're huge," said Largent.

To cut a firebreak, "basically, you would cut a four-wheel drive road. That's where you knock down the trees, take the soil and fuel out of the way and pile it to the side, and dig it down to unburnable material," he said.

Largent further explained that though the damage would be considerable, his company would have been willing to repair the road without charge, replacing the moved earth and replanting the strip. In time, it would be completely restored.

With two D-10s, a firebreak 35-feet wide can be created relatively quickly – and time was of the essence.

Transporting two giant bulldozers along a highway is no simple task. It fell on Tolhurst to work out the details.

Tolhurst and Largent drove to the command center at Lake George the following morning, Thursday, to find out what would be required, where the dozers were to be taken, and what work was to be done.

"We talked to a number of people from ground support to logistics where they coordinate the efforts and resources to fight the fire," Tolhurst told WorldNetDaily. "At that point we left, and I was instructed to make it happen."

Back at the mine site, Tolhurst arranged with Ames Construction in Denver to bring down a couple of special trailers that could haul the D-10s fully implemented with the blades and ripper shank on the rear.

"Normally when they're transported all that stuff is taken off due to the size and the weight," he said. "But it would have taken an extreme amount of time to prep something like that, and once you got them to an area they'd have to be reinstalled."

Everything was coming together. Permits normally required were waived. Red tape was sliced. Tolhurst called on support from the Cripple Creek Police Department to escort the vehicles to keep the road open; Police Chief Gary Hamilton drove the escort car himself.

Nothing was to be left to chance. It was a race against the clock and the wind-driven flames of the fire.

Largent did not return to the command center, but Tolhurst did – the convoy arriving at about 3 p.m.

In his words: "So we secure all this. I get support from the Cripple Creek Police Department to escort us there, and when we get there they took me over to the operations trailer, and the first words out of their mouths are, 'I didn't order these dozers. I don't even want them; they're too big.'"

Tolhurst paused briefly, then continued, "As we got into the conversation, the logic behind the decision was that the dozers were too big and would be too destructive. They would tear up too much ground. They were working the fire with some D-5s, D-6s – they have an eight-foot blade on them, where my D-10s have a 16-foot blade.

"We went back and forth. … There were some people in favor of it; there were others that were not in favor of it. I truly felt like I had slammed into a little bit of an empire-building program going on – like, 'if I didn't request them, I'm not going to use them. Who sent these without my approval and my blessing on them first?'

"I explained that we were there to support them, that I was prepared to bring mechanics, fuel trucks, service trucks to maintain and do everything required to support the dozers. They said, 'Well, if we choose not to use you we'll pay you for your time and everything else.'"

But, in Tolhurst's view and that of the company, it's not a matter of money, and he tried to explain this: "There are 200 team members here at the mine that are affected by this fire. We're here to do our part. Tell me what I can do to help you, and we'll do whatever we can."

The Forest Service officials had a suggestion. Though they couldn't use the dozers near Lake George, perhaps they could be taken up to an area called Deckers, where more equipment was needed. Newman, who was in charge of the transporting, checked the maps and saw that there were several bridges that would have to be crossed, but which could not support the weight of the bulldozers.

"Each of these dozers weighs well over 200,000 pounds," Newman pointed out. "You just can't haul them anywhere."

So he made an offer. The Forest Service had six smaller bulldozers at Lake George.

"What we can do," Newman told the officials, "since the transports and dozers are here, we can unload them here, and you can use them for whatever you want, and we will take two of the smaller dozers that you have here now – and we will transport those for nothing up to Deckers where they need more equipment."

With officials unable to reach a decision that afternoon, Tolhurst left the dozers overnight, returning the next morning at 5:30. Nothing had changed.

"It was just the same thing," he said. "Nobody knew where to take them; nobody really wanted to use them. They were concerned about crossing the streambed. There were some sensitive plant issues – they thought I might destroy some plants if the dozers went through. At that point in time I suggested that if they weren't going to use them, I'd better take them back.

"And they said, 'that's probably the best.' So I had them hauled them back to the mine site."

Neither Largent nor Tolhurst could recall the name of the incident commander who was in overall control of the fire-fighting operation. It was Kim Martin, who has been transferred to another fire.

WorldNetDaily asked Frye if he could provide any insight on why the D-10 bulldozers were refused.

"I don't think they were refused," he said. "My understanding is that when the bulldozers arrived here they asked where they were to be used and what their assignment would be, and once they had a chance to look at where that assignment was they realized that they couldn't get the transport vehicles that the bulldozers were on [over] to the location. They would have to walk the bulldozers a couple of miles at least to where they were asked to work."

That is, Frye explained, the dozers would have to be taken off the transporters and driven through the woods to the starting point.

"The decision was made that it didn't make good sense either tactically or logistically," he said. "So there was no refusal of the offer. It was more that the tool didn't fit the job."

Frye added that the kind of equipment preferred is "much more mobile, nimble, able to move around trees and up and over rocky ground." Small dozers, such as those already in use.

"I think that there's a perception that in this case bigger is better, and that is not necessarily the case," he said.

Frye said he was not aware who had made the initial request or if that person were fully aware of the size of the bulldozers that had been requested. He said he did not know why the request for bulldozers that large had been made.

Contacted for comment, Press Secretary Sarah Sheldon in Hefley's office – which had conducted the original liaison work between the Forest Service and Ron Largent – said that the congressman agreed with the Forest Service and the incident commander's decision "absolutely."

"We suggested that the mine provide trucks to take equipment up and assist in the fire, and when the trucks got there they were told by officials that the trucks were just too large, that to get into the forest they were simply too large to be used," Sheldon said.

"And that's fine with us. These people have been brought in because they're professionals and they know how to fight the fire. And if they say that they can't use that [equipment], that it can't be used – that's fine," she said.

WorldNetDaily pointed out that the idea was that the equipment requested by the Forest Service was for cutting a wide firebreak, but that the idea was scuttled by the incident commander on the grounds presumably that it would tear up too much ground.

"And we totally backed him up on that," said Sheldon. "He (the incident commander) was called in because of his expertise in fighting fires. And the congressman respects that judgment. He is on the ground and knows what is needed and what is appropriate. So the congressman absolutely backs him up."

But Biff Baker, a former U.S. Army Airborne Ranger and Libertarian Party candidate who is challenging Hefley in the upcoming election, is not so sanguine about the refusal of assistance.

"The miners and families in Cripple Creek are justifiably angry over the wasted effort, knowing they could have helped but were stymied by the U.S. Forest Service," he said. "But the problem isn't because of the ordinary employees within the Forest Service and the firefighters; it's with those in its higher-level management. That's where mistakes tend to be made."

Upon learning of the Forest Service decision, Kent McNaughten, a resident of Crystola, declared, "I'm a homeowner in the area threatened by this fire. The Forest Service calls it a 'monster.' I'm incensed that the Forest Service has decided to fight the fire with one hand tied behind their back. They're fighting a bear with a peashooter. They needed a rifle, and when it was offered, they declined it."

Asked if he thinks building a firebreak would have saved homes and large areas of forest, Largent replied, "It's hard to say if you'd have saved one or 20 or 10 – it's just so difficult to say if it would have helped. I could be wrong. I'm not a fire professional, and I don't know. … Maybe we could have saved one; maybe we could have saved a bunch. But I'm not going to criticize the Forest Service people; I don't live in their shoes. I don't have the facts as to why they made certain decisions.

"But from a personal point of view and from what I've heard, which are just rumors, it does seem that there are assets that are not being utilized."

No, it's not so unbelievable. When my son was in the Army there were all kinds of restriction on the tank training. Be careful of this tree, watch out for that plant, blah blah, and be careful not to disturb the woodpecker nests............AAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHH

What is it going to take.........????????????

What you say can be as complicated as a real agenda to dehumanize areas, or as dumb as an agent of the government not knowing his shoes from his socks. Who can tell anymore, and who cares?

D.C. is broken, it cannot be mended, the States need to repeal the Amendments to the constitution that took their power and take authority back from D.C.

The only thing that is going to save the Republic at this late date, given our razor thin time frame, is not Judical appointments, but disbanning Judical courts and bleeding the power away from D.C.. It can be done if enough people get off their hind ends and demand it on the steps of their state capitals.

It is once more evidence of the takeover of the forrest service by envirornmentalist idealogs who do not consider the consequences of their actions.

Isn't Bush the Commander-in-Chief?

it does seem that there are assets that are not being utilized."

Why does that not surprise me? They are merely a mirror image of corporate America who are now struggling to make a profit. Bogged down by bureaucratic BS., decisions being made by managers who are afraid to make decisions without first consulting their superiors and thus creating an atmosphere of an ineffectual cluster %&$*! The ones who know how to truly deal with their problem are hard at work with the shovels.......

Pardon the double pings, but this is the same story as the thread that was pulled.

Thank you for the ping, even though it was a double.

Exaclty! I am completely dumbfounded that someone would refuse the solution because they thought it would cause too much damage.

Duh! As if the fire wasn't going to cause any damage.

Some people don't even have the brains of a rock, let alone an animal.

Much the same thing happened a couple of years ago on S.R. 24 about 2 miles West of the Hanford Gate here in central Wash. State. A lady apparently had a heart attack, crossed the center line and collided with a truck. A brush/grass fire resulted.

It so happened that another truck with a back-hoe in tow came upon the accident a few minutes later. The owner offered to unload the back-hoe and put a line around the fire since it hadn't grown very large at that point. The Marine-Fisheries-Wildlife guy, who was on hand with all the other feckless bureaucrats wouldn't let him because they didn't want vehicle tracks on this pristine wasteland.

The result was that the fire got away, burned over a hundred-thousand acres, twenty some-odd buildings, countless animals and especially elk who were trapped by an elk-fence some 50 miles to the East. Plus, habitat that is just now starting to recover.

So much for the Harvard/Yale educated fools that these bureaucracies hire. Very Stupid!!!!!!

"You are about to enter a place in time beyond all human reason. You have just entered the Twilight Zone." This is surreal. I'm expecting the credits to come on screen any minute now.

It's not only surreal; it's dumb. Who better that mine-construction workers to know the terrain and the best ways to meet the challenges? Or Army tank personnel who are trained to solve access problems very quickly?

Wise government officials (oxymoron?) would be using the construction equipment and engineers, and the Army assets in the neighborhood, and fighting this national emergency. Instead of trying to blame the tree huggers for the fire, they should just get in there and deal with it.

I believe a big part of the problem is that these forest lands are in the hands of the Federals back in DC. The Bureaucrats know that they will have no consequences for their actions. They will be protected by the 'crats at HQ, transfered somewhere else, retired with full salary or whatever.

The States need to take over these lands in their States to put some accountability back into the scene. Local politicians will feel the heat and will come down on the bureaucrats. Of course, the real solution is to privatize the land. Whatever it takes to get it out of the hands of the Feds.

Notice that these fires over the past few years do not occur east of the Mississippi, where the Feds hardly have any land. Co-incidence? NO!

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