[Grampa Dave]

Sounds like the company line adopted in 1995 by the Babbitt Floristry Circus People.

If he restricts the management to burning, not thinning by logging and removal of dead trees for wood uses, this is right out of the Enviral Take Over Agenda of the Forestry Service during the Clintoon/Babbitt era.

[Grampa Dave]

The Oregon Live is into Feel Good Things to do this weekend with no fire updates from yesterday.

This was an interesting article at the KGW Site. Jeff Barnard has done a pretty good job reporting on this fire.

Please post what you hear and see. Again that is the best way to get data.

[E. Pluribus Unum]

Better to burn it at a loss than let people use it and turn a profit from it.

[Grampa Dave]

This is this morning's thread on the fire.

The Brookings area which is SW of the Fire will be cooler today. However, high winds are predicted all day from the North.

There is no real control on the west side of the fire as off yet. This could be a factor.

Appreciate your pinging on this, as it is not important to most Freepers. They had rather argue about esoteric things than the reality of two counties in Oregon being threated with a massive fire. A massive fire that is the result of miss management of burnable materials for at least a decade.

[Grampa Dave]

This is this morning's thread on the fire.

The Brookings area which is SW of the Fire will be cooler today. However, high winds are predicted all day from the North.

There is no real control on the west side of the fire as off yet. This could be a factor.

Thanks for your concern about this fire.

[madfly]

ping

[Grampa Dave]

Here is the forecast for Brookings. The temps are on the side of the fire fighters, but the high winds will not be:

Link to Brookings, Oregon forecast: (Weather forecast for Brookings, Or.)

[archy]

What this country really needs is a *controlled burn* in Washington.

-archy-/-

[Grampa Dave]

Gasquet California residents told to flee

Published: August 9, 2002, Crescent City Triplicate



Gusty winds pushed the Florence fire across a fire line and spread it to the trigger line which prompted the evacuation of Gasquet residents. Dixie Dies, information officer with the U.S. Forest Service, said the winds were causing some problems with the firefighting efforts. "At noon (Thursday) they were having a little trouble with the wind and difficulty flying helicopters because of it," Dies said yesterday afternoon.
The Daily Triplicate, Crescent City, California



By Kent Gray

Triplicate staff writer

Gasquet residents were ordered to leave their homes last night and head for Crescent City when the Florence Fire was suddenly aroused and began marching toward the community.

Fueled by strong dry winds, the fire jumped the fire line north of Gasquet and hit the evacuation trigger point two miles north of Gasquet – sending deputies from the Del Norte County Sheriff's Department door-to-door through the community to order the evacuation.

"The fire began moving south after picking up some smaller fuels," said Lyn Carranza of the U.S. Forest Service, a fire information official for the Florence Fire in California. "Because of the wind, some embers were landing on the trigger line and that's what the Sheriff's Department is acting on."

Captain Doug Plack said the blaze hit the trigger point at approximately 9:10 p.m.

"Sheriff (Jim) Maready said during the meetings in Gasquet that if the fire struck that trigger line we would notify the residents of the need to evacuate," Plack said. "They are being directed southbound on Highway 199 to the Crescent City area."

Although no structures were in immediate danger last night, at 10:30 p.m. Plack said the department decided to implement the evacuation as soon as possible before conditions worsened.

"The reason we are doing it tonight is because of the smoke and the nightfall," Plack said. "It's better to begin the process as early as possible rather than saying, ‘Oh, let's wait and see, and then have to move people out at 2 p.m. or 3 p.m. There is more communication available now and this way we can make sure it is an orderly process."

Plack said he hopes the department is not criticized for acting promptly, even if it is inconvenient for residents.

"People may think that we are being too cautious. I'm sorry, but we are thinking of what's best for the community and for the safety of the residents," said Plack.

Gasquet residents who were not directed by deputies last night should contact the Red Cross stationed at Crescent Elk School at 994 G Street in Crescent City if they need assistance.

The fire increased in size from 23,814 acres on Tuesday to 24,327 acres Wednesday, but until last night most of that increase was in the eastern sections.

Dixie Dies, information officer with the U.S. Forest Service, said the winds were causing some problems with the firefighting efforts.

"We are experiencing an increase in fire activity in the southeast portion," Dies said yesterday afternoon. "At noon (Thursday) they were having a little trouble with the wind and difficulty flying helicopters because of it."

---

When those strong North winds blow down over the burning inferno that used to be the Kalmiopsis Wilderness Area, that will blow ashes, embers and even live fire to the south.

This is what happened yesterday and could happen all day today. The winds are from the North and will be in the 20 to 30+ range all day.

This could spread rapidly down over these small Smith River towns and over the Smith River. Then Crescent City could be at peril.

You think that the Oregon Federal Floristry Circus has some pro fire rules, the Kali Federal Pink Panty Wearing Floristry Circus makes them look like pikers. CDF will do a good job if allowed to fight the fires.

Since this area voted for GW and against Grayout Davis in the last elections, Davis will probably just ignore the fires and hope the whole county gets burnt out. Then, rural cleansing by fire will remove a lot voters against him.

[lobo59]

Delusional enviro-wackos have mislead people too long. Fire is an agent of destruction, not a creative force. The impact of fire is much worse than logging, human use, grazing and all of our activities which have a positive economic empact. The huge costs of these fires fall directly back on us through taxes and deficite spending. It is time to renounce these eco-terrorists and ask if they have been controlling the fires or simply spreading them to advance their pryromanical agenda of destruction.

[Grampa Dave]

Here is what I have been concerned about for a week. The communities SW and W of the Former Kalmiopsis Wilderness, now a blackened and burning inferno, are in harm's way.

This story is from the Oregonian and is talking about the beautiful Chetco River Inn and other homes up the Chetco River NEN out of Brookings:

---

Fire turns toward rural inn, homes

08/09/02

JEFF MANNING, The Oregonian

BROOKINGS -- Normally the Chetco River Inn would be packed with guests this time of year, but the antique-filled bed-and-breakfast in the rugged hills 15 miles east of Brookings is empty.


Co-owner Sandra Brugger hasn't had a paying guest in two weeks, ever since the massive Florence fire prompted officials to close the road leading to the inn and the community of Wilderness Retreat two weeks ago.

Thursday was anything but tranquil for Brugger, despite the dearth of customers, because the tread of heavy boots and the pounding of hammers reverberated through the building.

A crew of firefighters had stormed the roof of Brugger's property in an attempt to save it. They were rigging an impromptu sprinkler system to protect the inn from the stubborn, powerful blaze that Thursday pushed down the Chetco River drainage directly toward Brugger's inn.

More than 5,000 firefighters and support staff are fighting the Florence fire, which covers about 463 square miles in Southwest Oregon and northwestern California. Although favorable weather limited the fire's advance in the Agness area, east winds gusting to 40 mph and temperatures in the 90s gave the blaze new vigor in the steep hills and valleys east of Brookings. Forecasters are predicting east winds could reach 50 mph today.

Fire officials issued a 24-hour evacuation notice to the area's residents Thursday afternoon. Curry County Sheriff Kent Owen met earlier in the day with Brugger and 30 other residents of Wilderness Retreat and other nearby neighborhoods.

"Unfortunately, this thing is getting ready to blow up," said Owen. "It's been sort of idling the last few days. But with the wind change, it could go into high gear."

Leaders of the firefighting team are moving new resources to the Chetco drainage. Thursday, fire officials frantically assembled a new base camp large enough to house 1,000 firefighters on a pasture about five miles downstream from Wilderness Retreat. About 400 multicolored dome tents were set with military precision on one side of the field.

Area residents were first warned a week ago of the possibility of evacuation. Some have already moved their families out. Lonnie Reneman said he moved his wife, three children and pets to a friend's place in Brookings on Wednesday. He returned Thursday for one last effort to fireproof his house.

Like many of his neighbors, Reneman voiced confidence in the firefighters' ability to stem the fire's progress. His kids are enjoying the temporary move, he said, viewing it "as just another camping trip." Reneman is trying to remain similarly buoyant. "You've just got to deal with it," he said. "There's no use crying over milk that hasn't been spilled yet."

Others in the crowd vowed to stick it out and stay with their homes. Though falling ash sprinkled on cars as the folks met, no flames were visible, even in the distant hills, leading some residents to doubt that the situation was really all that grim. Bob Wilhite said he's been building his house for two years and is still doing some Sheetrock and tile work. "I'm not gonna pick up and leave now," he said. "These guys seem pretty good at what they do."

Owen and others urged residents to leave promptly if the evacuation order is given. With current wind conditions, the blaze can move quickly. The gusty wind has led to spot fires -- started by wind-blown embers -- nearly a mile in advance of the main fire.

Many area residents have moved out significant personal items. "We've removed some of the more important pieces of furniture," said Brugger, the innkeeper. "We are so grateful for the help," Brugger says, looking at the three yellow-clad firefighters straddling her roofline. She made homemade ice cream for the workers, some of whom have come from as far away as Yellowknife in the Northwest Territory of Canada.

If Jim Littlepage's structure protection system works, some Wilderness Retreat residents will come back to undamaged homes -- even if the fire does sweep through. Littlepage, former member of the Hillsboro Fire Department, is overseeing fire crews rigging sprinkler systems as a last-ditch method of saving structures.

Crews strung fire hose from the Chetco River up to, over and around Wilderness Retreat homes. A series of portable pumps sends river water through the hoses to the sprinklers that douse the houses and nearby land. For houses too far from the river, they'll feed the sprinklers with tanker truck water.

About 50 houses in all have been rigged with sprinklers.The houses will be wetted down a couple of hours a day, Littlepage said.

"We saved 840 residences in the Rodeo fire in Arizona using this system," he said. "I've seen houses intact even as the fire has swept right over it."

[yoswif]

They're not really the Forest Service anymore. It's more like the US Dept. of Arson for Profit. Their motto is "the more trees we burn, the more green we earn".

Solution; get rid of the USFS and let local citizens manage our forests through their local school board. Congress can give us a single page of regulations subject to change by 2/3 majorities of both houses (normal size typing paper with normal spacing and print size) and we'll manage our forests in the best interests of our local economy and our local environment.

[Grampa Dave]

From the Oregonian at the Oregon Live site:


Wildfire News
A Special Report with The Oregonian
More From The Oregonian

Wildfire News
Two Oregon wildfires become one giant inferno

08/09/02

R. GREGORY NOKES

AGNESS -- Driven toward the south by strong winds, the Florence and Sour Biscuit wildfires burned Thursday as one mammoth blaze more than three times the size of the city of Portland.



Fire officials said they would henceforth consider them a single fire, called the Florence, burning 296,133 acres in both Oregon and California. Portland, a city of a half-million people, is 89,628 acres.

Southwest Oregon communities were threatened in nearly every direction: Agness on the north, the populated Illinois Valley on the east and, potentially, Brookings -- 11 miles west on the Oregon coast. Smoke has been heavy in Brookings most mornings this week.

Agness and the Illinois Valley remained under evacuation alerts: 24 hours' notice for Agness and eight hours' notice for the Illinois Valley. Fire spokesman Tom Valluzzi said the fire line protecting the Illinois Valley had passed its first significant test against strong overnight winds Wednesday.

"We're feeling better about the Illinois Valley," Valluzzi said from the eastside fire headquarters in Cave Junction.

The wind also blew the fire away from Agness at the confluence of the Rogue and Illinois rivers, about 20 miles from Gold Beach on the Oregon coast. The Curry County sheriff's office has a contingency plan to close the Rogue to popular jet boat and rafting traffic, in the event of a full evacuation, said Agness Fire Chief Bill Scherbarth.

No other fire in recent memory has closed the Rogue River to boat traffic, according to the Bureau of Land Management. The agency issues permits to 120 people a day to float the wilderness section of the river -- a four-day trip.

While the situation had improved to the east and north, concern mounted to the west that the blaze could burn along the banks of the Chetco River to Brookings, a city of 5,400 people. The fire had approached within two miles of Wilderness Retreat, a 20-home community east of Brookings, and residents there were told to be ready to evacuate.

While officials preferred no wind, they said winds out of the north Thursday were the best of a bad deal because the fire lines on the south were the most secure around the fire's 202-mile perimeter. The wind on the east side was clocked at 10 mph, gusting to 20 mph on ridgetops.

Fire officials divided the blaze into three weather zones because conditions varied greatly over the 463-square-mile fire.

Valluzzi said smoke was blowing into Redding, Calif., about 120 miles south.

[Salvation]

"The most important thing we can do in a good part of the West is doing some thinning and reintroduce fire back into these fire-dependent ecosystems in a controlled manner," Bosworth said.

Bumpo. And maybe they will even allow road-building and the re-introduction of logging into the Oregon economy.

OK, I can dream, can't I?

[marsh2]

Spent yesterday in a truck going around the backroads of border California (Happy Camp) near the tip of the Sour Bisquit fire. About 40% of the forest (mostly pines) is visably dead and dying. There have been no harvests here (not even salvage) since 1997. Prior (healthy tree) harvest levels were basically cut off in by 1990 with the listing of the northern spotted owl, marbled murrelet, and coho salmon. You can just drive by and see the dead gray all up and down the mountains.

Fire season in this area actiually starts in very late August and early September when the lightning strikes come in. Fires will sometimes burn until winter storms put them out. Lightning will strike a dead tree and circle down the trunk exploding in flame. The fire will then be carried rapidly from dead tree top to tree top climbing up steep mountain walls. Then each tree burns down sending flames rolling down the hills to light everything else.

We are going to lose this massive old growth forest if small operators are not allowed to go in and cut out the dying and dead trees which cause the lightning rod effect. This deadwood is not small diameter trees. Because salvage has been prvented for so long, many of these dead trees do not have saleable wood. There is little market for biomass or chips. We are now at the point that either healthy trees have to be thrown in to allow the remaining small loggers to make a secure modest profit, or we will just have to pay them to whach and stack the deadwood. We are no begining to see one or two slavage operations offered around airport areas and no one is bidding on them as there is not enough secure profit to guarantee costs.

All of this salvage is in addition to thinning of the small diameter plantation trees that will be dying in acres soon because of density pressure on nutrients and water sources.

This needs to start yesterday. The process needs to be sheltered from analysis paralysis. Costs need to be streamlined by eliminating costly appeals and lawsuits intentionally used by extreme environmetal groups to delay and prevent management. It is not stewardship to have hundreds of thousands of acres of habitat sterilized in seering flame.

One of our local rangers has wisely given up on "prescribed burns" for prevention. The forest fuels are loaded at too dangerously high a level to burn. He is using a "masticator" that shreads the wood remaining after thinning and leaves it on the grown.