Living dinosaurs

abc.net.au ^ | 9/30/2002

[SteveH]

News in Science

News in Science 30/9/2002 Living dinosaurs

[This is the print version of story http://www.abc.net.au/science/news/stories/s687677.htm]

	Model of Sinosauropteryx sprima (pronounced 'sine-oh-saw-op-te-rix pree-ma')made by Alan Groves working with palaeontologists Drs Walter Boles and Sue Hand.

If we are to believe the message of a new exhibit demonstrating the evolutionary transition from dinosaurs to birds, dinosaurs are not extinct.

Four life-sized reconstructions of ferocious-looking, smart-thinking, flesh-eating feathered dinosaurs – representing 125 million-year-old missing links between dinosaurs and birds – have landed at the Australian Museum in Sydney as part of the Chinese Dinosaurs exhibition.

"The birds we see flying around our backyards are actually living dinosaurs, descendants of prehistoric beasts we all once presumed became extinct 65 million years ago," said museum director, Professor Mike Archer.

"But feathers were evolving as dinosaur attributes long before they became valuable as flight structures," he said.

"Indeed fossils uncovered in the Liaoning Province of China have provided a whole sequence of missing links in the dinosaur to bird story."

Model of Sinornithosaurus smillenii (pronounced 'sine-or-nith-oh-saw-rus mill-en-ee-eye) made by Alan Groves working with palaeontologists Drs Walter Boles and Sue Hand.
 

One of the earlier links is Sinosauropteryx prima. The creature is covered with what looks to be a fine fuzz but are really small barbs – a link between scales and feathers.

"It's a metre-long, meat-eating, ground-dwelling predator, closely related to the dinosaur in Jurassic Park II which ate the little girl on the beach," said Professor Archer.

He speculated these very early feathers were probably for insulation since this group was almost certainly warm blooded.

The Sinornithosaurus millenii (top picture) embodies a later link.

"This is a very vicious little predator about a metre long. But here the feathers are much larger – although they're not fully formed or capable of flight," said Professor Archer.

An interesting characteristic of the creature was its capacity to lift its arms over its head in a flapping motion. Professor Archer said scientists assumed its array of feathers had a purpose – to frighten predators, help capture prey, attract mates or threaten male competitors.

The next stage – the development of feathers for flight – is seen in creatures like the Archseopteryx, a smaller animal than Sinornithosaurus millenii with longer and assymetrical feathers.

While there has been some debate as to whether dinosaurs (unlike other groups of reptiles) are the ancestors of birds, Professor Archer believes since 1996 there has been no strong argument against the hypothesis.

"I don't know anyone who is still holding out on this one," he said. "Other than the creationists of course who don't want anything to be ancestral to birds."

Chinese Dinosaurs is open until February next year. The dino-bird exhibit is sponsored by The Australian Skeptics.

Anna Salleh - ABC Science Online

More Info?

British Natural History Museum Dino-Birds Exhibition

Missing link from fur to feathers – News in Science 27/4/2001

Dinosaur fossil with proto-feathers – News in Science 8/3/2001

Dinosaur-bird theory defended – News in Science 24/11/2000

© ABC 2002 | privacy

[SteveH]

maybe some of these evolved into chupacabras too... :-)

[Revelation 911]

maybe some of these evolved into chupacabras too... :-)

more likely democrats

[What Is Ain't]

When I first glanced at this title I thought it was an article about Babs most recent escape from retirement.

[mcsparkie]

The velcro-covered skin was an advantage during mating.

[bert]

Was the Dodo Bird a dinasaur?

[sinclair]

Do I look extinct to you guys?

[mass55th]

I still think that my cat is descended from the dinosaur..raptors to be specific:

[PBRSTREETGANG]

T-Rex to hummingbird?

Talk about a demotion.

[pabianice]

Theadorus Kennedii in its native habitat in Hyannis, 1998

[SauronOfMordor]

There isn't any way to have an arm evolve into a wing, much less down/insulation feathers evolve into flight feathers.

Flying squirrels manage to glide a bit from flaps of skin attached to their arms and legs

A predator who could reach up over his head would be able to climb up a tree, where he could hide and leap down onto the back of prey passing underneath. A smaller predator could bring down a larger prey if he could jump on it from above and get his teeth into the back of its neck before the prey realized what was happening

A pouncing-from-above predator would get a big advantage from any ability to glide on the way down.

[LiteKeeper]

read later

[mcsparkie]

A pouncing-from-above predator would get a big advantage from any ability to glide on the way down.

This is why squirrels are not to be trusted.

[hopespringseternal]

"It's a metre-long, meat-eating, ground-dwelling predator, closely related to the dinosaur in Jurassic Park II which ate the little girl on the beach," said Professor Archer.

I am really glad I decided to skip that movie. I want to be entertained, not horrified. What a bunch of sick creeps dream up this garbage?

[Wright is right!]

"When I first glanced at this title I thought it was an article about Babs most recent escape from retirement."

Your first thought SHOULD have been about Walter Kronkite.

Michael

[Sabertooth]

((((((growl)))))

[Gumlegs]

Thanks for the ping.

[Pagey]

Jeopardy Question:

Answer: " Living Dinosaurs "
Question: Who Are DIFI,Barbara Boxer and #42?

[SteveH]

See also New Dino Resembles T. Rex, B. Bunny.

[VadeRetro]

Nice compilation. Some of the links are interesting, too. This QuickTime Movie of how what they're now calling "fuzzyraptor" used its feathered forearms, just for instance.

[VadeRetro]

If scientists have found anything at all here, it's a few intermediate steps in some design-change process by which birds were created by scientists or engineers, starting with small dinosaurs.

Yet another astounding case where medved used to say the exact same thing before he was banned and you showed up. How does this keep happening?

[Junior]

The velcro-covered skin was an advantage during mating.

Birds of a feather stick together.

[MeekOneGOP]

[Junior]

You know, Ted Holden used to say exactly the same thing ...

[VadeRetro]

And it's not as if that particular cluster of delusions can be found on every street corner, is it?

[Mo1]

VOTE THE RATS OUT!!

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[general_re]

I try to miss a person, and work up some nostalgia for the good old days, but it's kind of hard to miss someone when they won't leave....

[Sabertooth]

Bunnysaurus Rex...

And I thought my teeth were bad.

[Junior]

Of course, pp will probably claim we're cowards for hiding our identities...

[Virginia-American]

How does this keep happening?

Wasn't one of the former poster's claims that the ancients had telepathy? Maybe it's just an atavism.

[Honcho]

This rare photo of a Hillaryaurus captures the animal in it's most common state, campaign season.

[VadeRetro]

Look at one or two of the images on this thread and ask yourself, assuming any of these creatures ever lived at all, whether you're seeing a glass half full, or a glass half empty.

Or maybe a halfway foreclaw and halfway wing?

[dljordan]

Man! That's GROSS!!!!

[PatrickHenry]

You know, Ted Holden used to say exactly the same thing ...

This new incarnation of Ted is just fine with me. The posts are amusingly nonsensical, and the horrendous torrent of spam essays and whacko links is gone.

[VRWC_minion]

mark

[balrog666]

This new incarnation of Ted is just fine with me. The posts are amusingly nonsensical, and the horrendous torrent of spam essays and whacko links is gone.

So far anyway.

OTOH, maybe JediGirl should re-register as MrsJediGirl (or JediWoman or NewJediGirl or...) and see if the powers-that-be ignore her too.

[Junior]

Losing a complex capability does not involve any violations of the laws of probability or statistics.

Gaining one doesn't either.

[Junior]

...and the horrendous torrent of spam essays and whacko links is gone.

Just wait. Ted can't help himself. He knows he is the sole receptacle of the knowledge of the origins of life on this planet and it is his self-sworn duty to preach the truth to us lesser lights. PP'll be spraying these threads with medvedian malarky within weeks, if not days.

[Ahban]

Don't Archeopteryx fossils show up from 125 million years ago? While they seem more like another offshoot that died out than a direct bird ancestor, they are far more bird than anything shown in the article.

How could these be the ancestors of birds if bird-like critters were already around filling this niche? How do we know Sinowhatchimcallet is not a survivor of the Archeopteryx line that was LOSING whatever powers of flight the line had rather than gaining it? This would be analogous to the ostrich situation.

Don't you need bird ancestors to show up BEFORE birds do?

[VadeRetro]

Because you want to wish away an ever-growing pile of evidence, you lawyer the knowledge gaps as somehow showing that we don't know what we do. We don't know exactly which if any fossils are on the exact line of descent of modern birds. We don't have an immediate precursor for Archaeopteryx, which is earlier than the Chinese feathered dinosaurs. That seems a bit out of order, but the fossil record is sparse for fine-boned animals and you have to remember to expect a branching, not linear, structure.

That does not help you with what we do have, which is a fine display of feathered dinosaurs and reptilian birds showing just about every possible intermediate character. It's the same thing you see with other transitions: things that don't intergrade now blend almost imperceptibly into each other as you go back in time, until scientists disagree over what bin in which to cast a certain specimen.

More examples here.

[scripter]

Index ping

[gore3000]

Of course, pp will probably claim we're cowards for hiding our identities...

No need for that Junior. I will say that you and your fellow evos are a bunch of cowards who go around attacking someone personally while hiding behind your pseudonyms. Of course, evos being atheists have a ready excuse for not practicing what they preach or following the golden rule. Evos practice the motto of all atheist tyrants - might makes right or if you can kill your opponent, who's to complain?

[gore3000]

Is the picture on top supposed to be a wing? Did you forget to put on your glasses?

[VadeRetro]

I will say that you and your fellow evos are a bunch of cowards who go around attacking someone personally while hiding behind your pseudonyms.

Oh, will you? And your real name is what, exactly? Anyone can click on my profile and find out that I'm Doug Kalbaugh from Keyser, WV. Who the hell are you, little man? Where's the courage of your convictions now?

Put up or shut up!

[f.Christian]

Geologic columns/dating...what about the massive canyon on mars---no water/erosion!
The size---circumference of the Earth has gotten smaller(although at certain pts. it could have been changing/variable).

During initial collapse(center heating/condensing) large ridges---mountains(large rocky...vast/fast soil erosion) would protrude upwards!

Land wouldn't form evenly...continents would remain at higher levels above water level then plates would dry out(releasing water/moisture/rain)---shrink producing cracks/fissures---then layered-canyons/basins/ravines...via cooled and hot sediments would form(rise/uplift) as the shrink/sink-ing would continue...producing more mountains/hills(slight-no erosion)--'volcanoes' continously---to fill the receding excessive gaps/holes!

At the Grand Canyon older sedimentary levels are at the top and the fresher/newer ones below...those straight up 'buttes' came out of hole--soft spots in the plates like cake decorations---Ayre's Rock like a bubble in a blown tire.

All that erosion/sedimentary crap old age of the Earth is hooie-dooie!

There is not enough dust on the moon to support an old earth dating system!

[gore3000]

Because you want to wish away an ever-growing pile of evidence,

Drawings are not evidence. A five year old child can draw a picture, that is not evidence of something existing. The bones you showed - without mentioning what they were - have nothing to do with the present article. You parade them on every occassion where birds are discussed. There are no wings on your pictures and there are no wings or feathers on either of the DRAWINGS in the article. Of course the article, as is usual on evolutionist articles, does not bother to show the bones which supposedly inspired the drawings. They do not do so because it would mean revealing the fraud they are trying to perpetrate.

[f.Christian]

D. Axelrod, Science 128:7-

"One of the major unsolved problems of geology and evolution is the occurrence of diversified, multi-cellular marine invertebrates in Lower Cambrian rocks on all the continents and their absence in rocks of greater age."

"their absence in rocks of 'greater' age."

The 'greater' age in layers exists if you think the layers formed from the top!

At one pt. the whole of the Earth was hot cooling from the surface in successive layers from below---outward!

Nothing missing in those layers---no mystery!

These invertebrates can only exist above ground level...in water/air---not underground!

[VadeRetro]

And the answer is . . .

Anyone who clicks on your home page sees something whiter than white. You don't even have a location. Your posting history has been too shameful to be inflicted upon any particular state or country.

[teresat]

Your cat looks exactly like my cat...well except my cat weighs 21 lbs...