Who Am I?

Reason Online ^ | 11/01/02 | Reason Online

[correctthought]

I'm a .25 caliber pistol—a so-called Saturday Night Special—made by defunct gun maker Raven Arms. Although I'm an inanimate object, I've been found legally culpable in the 2000 classroom shooting of a West Palm Beach, Florida school teacher.

More specifically, a jury has just found gun distributor Valor 5 percent guilty in the tragic murder, which occurred when a 16-year-old student stole an unloaded version of me and some bullets from a family friend and then killed his teacher. The local school board and the family friend—though not the actual shooter—shouldered the rest of the blame. In the first trial in which a gun company has in any way been held responsible for a murder, Valor is supposed to pay $1.2 million to the victim's widow. The school board is supposed to pay $10.8 million and the family friend $12 million.

The plaintiff's lawyer was Bob Montgomery, best known for representing Florida in its $11.3 billion victory over tobacco companies. The case charged that I was "unsafe, defective and lacked features that would have prevented a minor from using it." Valor's attorneys countered that I wasn't a piece of "junk" and that I had legitimate uses, including self-defense, which is how most guns get used.

All the defendants are appealing the verdict which, given the way municipal cases against gun makers have fared, is likely to be overturned. As the legal battle in Florida moves into the next round, it's worth asking how far we really want to travel down the product-liability road when it comes to guns—and many other things.

[Leisler]

I bought a bunch, twenty years ago. Gave'm out as gifts. Took mine out, loaded it up, and it cracked off no problem, no jambs. It was (?) the bic lighters of handguns. Matter of fact, if things keep going, especially here in New Socialist England, cheep, unregistered throw aways are the way to go. You carry it and if you need to defend your self you say it was his, or you found it, or nothing at all. Ya,ya I know .25 is a punk round, but 99% of criminals are stupid and cowardly punks. Were not talking a charging Marine squad, just some loser out-and-about.

[pgyanke]

This is jury's brain. This is a jury's brain after more than 40 years of socialist indoctrination. Any questions?

[newgeezer]

I fail to see what relevance this has to the price of tea in China or to this case.

My post had total relevance to the (irrelevant) one-liner to which I replied. Here we have the story of a lowlife punk who killed a teacher, and some slimy, liberal morons who sued the gun manufacturer, and all this guy can say is, in effect, "what a puny excuse for a gun." I thought it deserved a reply. So, shoot me.

But don't make the mistake of assuming I'm any less pro-Second Amendment than you. The chances of that are extremely slim.

[Gordian Blade]

Yes, that's true, dead is dead and even a pellet gun can kill under the right circumstances, but it's a matter of odds. The fact is, your probability of a one-hit stop to center-of-mass with a .25 is pretty low -- about 40% with the best defense ammo, down to 25% with average ammo. I personally have a 9mm and even that's only barely 90% with +P hollow-point ammo.

Here are some stats if anyone is interested:
http://www.powernet.net/~eich1/sp.html

[VERYProGun]

"My post had total relevance to the (irrelevant) one-liner to which I replied. Here we have the story of a lowlife punk who killed a teacher, and some slimy, liberal morons who sued the gun manufacturer, and all this guy can say is, in effect, "what a puny excuse for a gun." I thought it deserved a reply. So, shoot me.

Point taken. Personally I thought the comment was funny, but agree it too missed the point.

"But don't make the mistake of assuming I'm any less pro-Second Amendment than you. The chances of that are extremely slim."

I never meant to imply any such thing. If you took it as such, please accept my apologies.

VPG

[eyes_only]

I bought a bunch, twenty years ago. Gave'm out as gifts. Took mine out, loaded it up, and it cracked off no problem, no jambs.

 

I bought one a few years back, just to have one in my collection.  I've had no problems acquiring my sight picture and punching a few (10 ring) rounds @ 7yds into my target.  No jams, no problems. Considering I own Glocks, Colts, Springfields of various calibers, the Raven was a pretty good buy.  Just my 2¢ ....

[newgeezer]

Yes, I would be among the most staunch in agreement that a .25 is ill-suited to most self-defense situations.

Again (see #43), my point in #14 had nothing to do with the merits of the .25 caliber handgun. It was nothing more than a direct response to #4 (as you might've guessed, after you clicked the "To 4" link below it).

[F.J. Mitchell]

You don't sound like a defective product to me, Cal Pistol, when that little thug pointed you and pulled your trigger, you put a hole in the target, just as you were intended to. It is not your duty to select the target, that responsibility belongs to the one you are serving, normally a rational, responsible, human being who's life may depend upon you functioning just as you did in this instance. You don't get to pick your master.

Personal claims lawyers don't seek justice, they covet money and go after whoever has some, the more the better, juries of idiots aid and abet them in their rape and pillaging of the justice system and the productive and profitable industries of America. The young Murderer who misused you, has no money and neither does anyone else found financially responsible- only your creator has any money to speak of, so the lawyers stuck him/her and you with the bill.

[WFTR]

Hey, Luv...this is, after all, FLORIDA...and West Palm Beach at that!

In other words, maybe they intended to give the right verdict and circled the wrong word on a form somewhere?

WFTR
Bill

[teeman8r]

next time i am assaulted by a thug who has a rap sheet as long as my arm, i will sue the lawyers that got him released from jail. then i will sue the parole board and the state for not allowing me to carry a weapon to protect myself as police officers do. i will use their arguments against them and their tactics of financial harassment to destroy them...

but i probably won't be able to find a lawyer that will take my case.