Skip to comments.Bush praises Islam for its 'morality'
Posted on 12/06/2002 12:33:51 PM PST by robowombat
Bush praises Islam for its 'morality' By Bill Sammon THE WASHINGTON TIMES
President Bush yesterday removed his shoes, entered a mosque and praised Islam for inspiring "countless individuals to lead lives of honesty, integrity, and morality."
For the second time since the September 11 terrorist attacks, the president yesterday visited Washington's oldest mosque, the Islamic Center, where Muslims from 75 nations gather to worship. Mr. Bush marked the end of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan by praising Islam as a hopeful religion of mercy and tolerance.
"Islam affirms God's justice and insists on man's moral responsibility," said the president, flanked by a half-dozen imams. "Islam gave birth to a rich civilization of learning that has benefited mankind." The overture to Muslims came four days after religious broadcaster Pat Robertson said Mr. Bush "ignores history" by not acknowledging that Islam is "violent at its core."
In an interview with The Washington Times last month, Mr. Robertson said he understood the president's political need for support from the Muslim world in the war on terrorism, but said the president should not speak about Islam as a religion and that he "is not elected as chief theologian." The conservative commentator accused the president of succumbing to "political correctness" by praising the religion of terrorists who attacked America on September 11.
Mr. Robertson repeated that accusation on ABC's "This Week." The host, former Clinton aide George Stephanopoulos called the disagreement "a theological dispute which is driving a political wedge between President Bush and some of his conservative Christian allies."
That characterization was disputed yesterday by the White House. "This may be an area where they disagree," a senior administration official said of Mr. Bush and his conservative Christian allies. "But there are areas of agreement."
The director of the Islamic Center, Abdullah Khouj, praised the president's visit and told him that it demonstrated "the value of human tolerance, a virtue taught by Islam and practiced here in America."
The president's visit came one day after a Pew Foundation poll found widespread anti-Americanism in some Muslim nations. With the United States preparing for war with Iraq, the administration is eager to mitigate rising tensions on the "Arab street."
White House Press Secretary Ari Fleischer said Mr. Bush "acknowledged the United States has a job to do and we have to bring people together between the United States and the Muslim world."
To that end, Mr. Bush praised American Muslims for "upholding our nation's ideals of liberty and justice in a world at peace." "Millions of our fellow Americans practice the Muslim faith," said Mr. Bush, a born-again Christian. "They lead lives of honesty and justice and compassion."
Mr. Robertson first criticized Mr. Bush in The Washington Times interview last month. When Mr. Stephanopoulos reminded him of this quote, Mr. Robertson refused to back down from his assessment of the president's view of Islam. "It ignores history," he said. "Any student of history knows that it's not a peaceful religion." "It's violent at its core," he said. "There is absolute virulent hatred of Jews, and the idea that every Jew has got to be killed before the culmination of the age. That's what Islam teaches, and I think that's violent."
Other conservative religious figures have spoken out in recent months against Mr. Bush's frequent statements about the peaceful nature of Islam, including the Rev. Franklin Graham and the Rev. Jerry Falwell, the latter of whom called Islam's prophet Muhammad a "terrorist."
Deputy White House Press Secretary Scott McClellan disagreed. "The president believes that America is a nation that welcomes people of all faiths Christian, Jew, Muslim, Hindu, Sikh and many others," he told The Times. "He's made it very clear that the war on terrorism is not a war about religion. It's a war about good vs. evil."
Mr. Bush is not the only administration official making overtures to Muslims in recent weeks. Others who have participated in Ramadan events include National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State Colin L. Powell, Commerce Secretary Donald L. Evans and Treasury Secretary Paul H. O'Neill.
* Mohammed is estimated by scholars to have had somewhere between 15-25 wives. All agree that he had 9 wives at the time of his death (5 more than the Quran permits for other Muslims)!
* He died at age 63 in the home of Aisha, his favorite wife, and was buried on the spot where he died in Medina.
* Earlier, he fell in love with Zeinab, his cousin, and wife of his adopted son Zeid. He then received a "revelation" from Allah that it was permissible to marry the wife of an adopted son. Zeid divorced Zeinab so that Mohammed could marry her.
Sources: Ernest Kellett, A Short History of Religions. New York: Books for Libraries Press, 1971, P. 343, and Washington Irving, Life of Mahomet. New York: Dutton & Sons, 1911, p. 231.
* On his deathbed, Mohammed said: "Do not fear those who disbelieve, fear me" and called for the conquest of Christianity.
Source, Essad Bey, Mohammed. New York: Longmans, Green & Co., 1936, p. 330.
Yeah, I use the number 0 a lot...like when I add up the believability quotient of most leftist leaders. :)
5. Islamic marriage certificates and the Islamic declaration certificates [Al-Shahada] needed for a Saudi Arabian marriage to a foreign wife must first be authenticated by an Islamic center of the respective county or state and then by:
The Islamic Center
2551 Massachusetts Ave, N.W.
Washington DC 20008
And then by:
The Royal Embassy of Saudi Arabia
601 New Hampshire Ave. N.W.
Washington DC 20037
But if you do choose to have your marriage "authenticated" by the Saudis, you must realize that the children are not yours, and can be kidnapped to Saudi Arabia at will, never to return.
Quite right. Only 75% of Arabs oppose our war on terrorism (per Pew). Three quarters evil, one quarter good. No religion involved.
"And I'm happy that they're still just practicing," though the President, "because when they get real good at it, we're gonna have us a Texas-sized problem."
I believe Bush was making a prophetic statement here. Before all this is over, our conflict with them will indeed prove that God is a just God. FNC interviewed Mansoor Ijaz about this speech yesterday. It was great. He said that this makes President Bush the voice of Moslem moderation in this country, which should come from a Moslem voice (he was praising the president). The other guest was left sputtering in anger. I think this president knows exactly what he is doing!
Marriage to Six-Year Old
In 624 Abu Bakr (Muhammads daily companion and one of his first believers and successor of Muhammad) gave Muhammad his daughter Aisha when she was six years old, although the actual marriage was not consummated until she was nine. This fact is uncontested by all Muslim scholars and chroniclers without exception). At the time of their marriage Muhammad was 54 years old (the age of her grandfather) a difference of 45 years in their ages.
Aisha herself testified to these facts:
The messenger of God betrothed me when I was six years old and then married me when I was nine years old.
Source: Sahih Muslim (by Imam al-Mawawy), vol. 3, p. 577.
Islamic law has codified this principle of non-consent for under-age women based on Muhammads precedent:
A father may give consent to have his young virgin daughter married without obtaining her permission, for she does not have a choice, exactly as Abu Bakr El Sadiq did to his daughter Aisha, when she was six years old. He married her to the prophet Muhammad without her permission.
Source: Ibn Hazam (acknowledged by all Muslims as one of the greatest scholars on Islamic Law) in his al-Muhalla (The Sweetened). Vol. 6, part 9, pp. 458-460.
Abd El Schafi, author of Behind the Veil stated in response: These are cruel, hard words and iniquitous Islamic principles which the free human conscience utterly rejects and detests because it is related to the most important subject in the girls life, that is, her body and her future (p. 83).
Polygamy, Concubines, and Mistresses in Islam
No one is allowed to wed more than four women, but he is permitted however, in addition to them, to buy (women), as many as he wants.
Source: Ibn Hazam, vol. 6, part 9, pp. 441, 467.
However, exceptions were made for the Prophet and his successors:
Muhammad had 11 wives and an Egyptian concubine Umar Ibn al-Khattab had 7 wives plus 2 maid-salves
Uthman Ibn Affan had 8 wives
Ali Ibn Abi Talib (cousin of Muhammad) married 10 women plus 10 concubines and maid-slaves for a total of 29
Al-Hasan Ibn Ali (grandson of Muhammad and called by the Prophet the master of the youth of Paradise) married 70 women (and was said to sometimes divorce two women in a day!).
Sources: Biographies such as Ibn Kathirs, Bidaya and the Nihaya, vol. 7 & 8, and Suyutis, Chonicles of the Caliphs.
Marriage to wives of men killed by Muslims, including the murder of Jews
It was standard practice, and made legal by Muhammad, to take as a wife in addition to captives, the wives of men killed in battle (or executed). On one occasion when Muhammad launched an attack on a Jewish tribe he personally witnessed their beheading and then took some of their widows to bed. Semitic scholar and historian A.B. Davidson (a professor at New College, Edinburgh) recorded one such instance:
On one day he caused 800 Jews to be beheaded in cold blood, himself standing by and watching the butchery; and in the evening, to efface the unpleasant impression from his mind, and give a more happy turn to his ideas, he took home the wife of one of the murdered chiefs, and added her to his harem.
Source: A.B. Davidson, Biblical and Literary Essays, ed. J.A. Peterson (London: Hodder & Stroughton, 1902), p. 228.
Sexual License in Islam The Temporary Contractual Marriage
According to all Muslim scholars (especially in Sahih Muslim) the temporary, contractual marriage was made lawful by Muhammad simply to satisfy the sexual passions of his soldiers. The marriage only had to last 3 days, after which the woman could be deserted and left without any rights. Only the fact that it is temporary a marriage separates it from outright fornication and adultery (forbidden in Islam), but there is practically no difference. It was practiced during the beginning of the Islamic era (during the caliphates of Abu Bakr and Ibn Abu Umar) and is continued in practice today by over 100 million Shiite Muslims worldwide.
Concerning this practice the following Islamic authority states:
While in the army, Allahs Apostle came to us and said, You have been allowed to have Muta (pleasure), so do it. If a man and a woman agree to marry temporarily, their marriage should last for three nights
Source: Sahih al-Bukbari, part 7, p. 37.
He has made some amazingly prescient comments about Al Qaida and the Islamofascists, so I make a point to stop and listen to him. But I wonder . . .
Indeed, I have not been able to count any. They are truly countless...
Always keep my eyes open; trust but verify!!
Only while in Saudi Arabia in Arabic can they claim the Jews caused 9/11.
So far from being "morality," such is a surrender to mortmain and to the idea that humans are just raging beasts [sexually] who are not CAPABLE of morality!
Can it be that Bush doesn't know these things? I knew them when I was 12.
If true, at what cost? The imprisonment of untold millions through fear?
Yeah, way more "advanced."
Not enough thanks is thrown around here, so I'll say: Thanks for the info.
Robert Boyle - scientist and chemist
Michael Faraday - physicist, formulated laws electromagnetic induction, did groundwork for making dynamos, electric motors and transformers
James Joule - science of thermodynamics
William Thompson a.k.a. Lord Kelvin - thermodynamics and the Kelvin, temperature scale
Johannes Kepler - laws of planetary motion (more on Kepler)
Carl Linnaeus - botanist, professor
Matthew Maury - leading scientist in oceanography and hydrography
James Clerk Maxwell - electromagnetic theory
Samuel F.B. Morse - invented the telegraph, Morse code is named after him
Isaac Newton - laws of gravity, motion and calculus
Blaise Pascal - invented early calculator, helped discover the theory of probability
Louis Pasteur - invented vaccination, immunization and pasteurization
This is just a small list. Basically, all Islam has to offer the world is terrorism.....the more closely you follow it, the more you hate America, and Israel and the more dangerous to the world you become. It is one of the most useless (and dangerous!) faiths going.
Without Christianity, modern science would not even exist. Even atheists have acknowledged that.
Without Islam, we would not have hijackings, homicide bombings, kidnappings, sniper attacks, blah blah blah. His,
Want to know what the most popular toy is that all these nice peaceful muslims are buying for their kids?
Bin Laden toy a 'must have' in Muslim world
December 06, 2002, 07:17 AM
There is one toy for sale in the festival markets of Karachi that catches the eye as Eid approaches. It is a distinctive, bearded figurine, riding 'shotgun' in a military jeep, and its proving to be a big hit with mothers and fathers buying holiday presents for their youngsters. Toy crazes are a common theme in the build up to Christmas holidays in the west with certain 'must have' presents disappearing off shelves in a flash, parents queuing up for hours or even coming to blows to make sure their offspring has the latest thing. The story is no different in the Muslim world as Eid approaches but one of this year's 'must haves' would probably be banned from sale in many parts of the west, an Osama bin Laden action figure complete with military jeep and bodyguards. "As you know Osama is very popular in the whole world, the same thing is happening in Pakistan, people like him and he has become a celebrity now," said Imran, a young boy eyeing up the goods on offer at a Karachi toy store. "Children like Osama's car. They want to buy toys like Osama's cars or Osama's guns," echoed Eram, a young girl showing an equally keen interest in the toy. According to a toy stall holder, Naseer, some parents were even paying up to $4 in advance to insure they could become the proud owners of one of the dolls.
Need I say more???
Too bad you are still HALLOWING it, but I will just keep on HOLLOWING it, and we will see who beats it first.
Oh, wade a minnit, you are BUILDING IT UP!!!
[mutters under breath]nuther ex christian
Wrongo! What you and Bush are espousing is a fundamentally false, revisionist-apologist history of Islam, when he praises the 'learning' of Islam. The ACTUAL history shows that it was a number of subjugated Christians and Jews who provided the overwhelming examples of 'learning' from Math to astronomy and architecture that were touted by apologists as 'Islamic'. These conquered peoples often had to produce some intellectually advantageous product to keep them around...and without slit throats. And even then it didn't always work.
Bush is also reticent about acknowledging how many people would LEAVE Islam if they ONLY COULD. Maybe the majority. Who knows for sure. After all, Murderous retaliation awaits the ones who try it. Witness Salman Rushdie. Witness the fatwah's even today by Muslims in Britain! So instead of a 'billion' people finding 'comfort' in Islam, its that they HAVE NO CHOICE. Either you say you believe, and stay quiet about critizing anyone more devout than you, or you will die. We used to say in the conservative critique of the Democrats was that they saw no emenies on the left.And the 'moderate' Islamics only cover up for the REAL, authentic, and true-to-the Koran version that is going to be ultimately implemented in EVERY nation...as it has in EVERY other nation already under Muslim dominance. So to be piteously and obtusely blind to what we are up against, doesn't jolly along the enemies of religious freedom in the listed countries....it just persuades them (particularly since the Islamo-immigration flood is unstemmed in any degree) that we are too weak to oppose their FURTHERING the terror campaign, and encouraging them to continue the charade over 'moderate islam'.
So the only interest which is advanced long term is the jihadists, while the U.S. security is undermined, both domestically and abroad. And I can just see Rove and Card bamboozling the Prez into thinking that these kinds of stunts are 'win-win' and without any actual national security cost.
The Holocaust says nothing negative about OUR society. It was the result not of OUR Judeo-Christian society, but the anti-Christian, atheistic Nationalist Socialist Party of Germany. Adolf Hitler hated Christianity with a passion. Typically, it is the lamest of Marxist misrepresentations to contend the Holocaust was somehow Christian, (typically because the Vatican caved in to Hitler's/Mussolini's threats and stayed silent). In fact, of course, It was OUR Judeo-Christian society which clobbered the NAZI's and rescued the surviving holocaust victims. Meanwhile, the NAZI's found fertile country in the muslim countries, even having auxilary units among them, such as Turkey and Bosnia-Herzegovinia. And where do we find even today the fevered belief in, and television shows based on the NAZI-created anti-jewish hoax 'The Protocols of the Elders of Zion'? I'll Give you three guesses. Who do you think is demanding a renewed holocaust today?
And who is standing four-square against it? Only us.
Durant gets it backwards. First, no western society was more tolerant of religions than the Romans and Greeks, who were essentially polytheists. The Greeks even built the statue in Athens to the 'Unknown' God in case they had forgetten any. As to the sciences, this is perhaps the apologists of Islam's lie that is almost as great as "islam is a religion of peace." The Islamic world merely stole these ideas from the Christian and jewish intellectuals who they subjugated. The Mullahs and Caliphates themselves did not encourage intellectual progress. They kept the jewish and Christian intellectuals around so long as it was convenient to keep them around, and profit from their inventions. Your ideas about taxation are also off base. The empire of Islam grew at the explosive rate it did because it taxed as spoils all of its victories on the field of battle. And it continued to tax all those at 1/5th all those who refused to convert. It stripped the wherewithal of the populace to resist. Gross poverty ensued wherever the Jihad's armies went. Vast wealth resided in its sultans, who were then lauded by Islamic apologists as depicting the condition of the people. The prophet, and later the Caliphate, funnelled much of the spoils all back to Mecca. And the jihadists, also getting a lot of earthly spoil, were promised to be at the Prophet's hand, and to have their own 72 virgins in Heavan if they 'martyred' themselves in the cause of holy war.
Unfortunately for you, I have this book on my shelf and I just took a look at it. (The) Muhammed isn't indexed at all. Islam is in a few places, and all or most all of the references might get Durant a fatwa (That's such a nice word, isn't it?) were he still alive. He talks about the poor treatment of women. He talks about the bloodthurstiness of the men. The only neutral treatment Islam gets is when Durant considers Akbar the Great. ("He had quite discarded the dogmas of Islam." Maybe that's what made Akbar great?) So this is your first misrepresentation. There is nothing that I recall, or that I could easily locate, in Our Oriental Heritage that in any way touches on "how much the Islamic World advanced mankind."
To be fair, I should point out that Durant's major treatment of Islam occurs in The Age of Faith which is the fourth volume in his Story of Civilization series. There's probably some nice things said about Islamic Scholarship, Science, Medicine, Philosophy, Literature, Art, and Music (all ToC topics) but I couldn't find them when I skimmed that section quickly.
Now since you seem to like to read, maybe you might try La Fallaci's Rage and Pride. It's a quick read. You'll learn some things.
Especially amazing is the initial spread of the Islamic Empire throughout the Middle East, Africa, Andalusia(Spain), Asia, and eastern Europe. It spread just as every other great Empire (the Roman, British, French) spread. ...
Now it's interesting that you mention this. I am in the habit of sitting in on classes at one (and soon two) of the nation's top universities. Last year I sat in on a Western Civ Lecture which just happened to be about the spread of Islam that day. The professor started off by comparing the spread of Islam to the spread of Christianity, 100 years vs 300 years to become well established. After he was done with the real students, he and I chatted for about a half hour mostly about this idea. The reason Islam spread so much faster than Christianity, I suggested, is that Islam was spread via the Sword. Christianity was spread via the Word. (That missing S makes a BIG difference.) The professor largely agreed with me. Comparing Islam with political empires on your part, which are usually military empires, just reenforces the point.
This Islamic Empire changed forms throughout the years, but in its height in the form of the Ottoman Empire, it held lands greater than Rome and easily toppled the Eastern Roman Empire, almost taking Europe along with it if it weren't for the brave slew of Europeans warriors from Russia, Serbia, Austria, Germany, and France.
Holding territory, again, is an evidence of military strength. I am not aware of any region that willingly accepted Islam without compulsion.
The sciences and politics benefited the most from a large Islamic Empire, which one could argue was far more tolerable of other religions than Western society was before the United States. Leaps in Astronomy, Medicine, physics, mathematics, chemistry, art, language, and music all were brought in from the Islamic world to our own.
Gee. Really? I know they named many of the stars, but what else did they do? I have degrees in the sciences, and many courses I took started out with an historical overview. I just don't rememeber anyone ever crediting an Arab for anything. Music? Please! Don't they kill people for singing?
One of Ronald Reagan's favorite men to quote, Ibn Khaldun, was probably one of the greatest political minds to ever live. I suggest you people read more about him, too.
I never heard of Khaldun. (Not even during any of the dozen or so political philosophy classes, I sat in on during the past few years.) Is he like Aristotle? I'll try to check him out, but I hope you'll understand my negative attitude going in.
Take it easy, and realize that while we have a lot to be proud of, other societies have contributed much to our own, and that the MAJORITY of Muslims are not bad people.
I prefer not to take it easy when I am being attacked. Other societies have contributed to ours, but it's hard to think of any other historical group which has contributed less than the Muslims have. (Okay. Maybe the Hittites? But I've seen it suggested that the Hittites never existed, which would seem to put them at a big disadvantage.) You suggest the the majority of Muslims are good people without a scintilla of evidence. I suggest that the majority of politically active Muslims are active enemies of ours. I say this based upon the ease with which one can find "Death to America" type websites, and the near impossiblity of finding Islamic websites that think it might be okay we retained our English-Judeo-Christian heritage.
Slavery still exists in the Islamic World, today, now.
When pro-Islam spokesmen talk about the achievements of Islam, the speech is always preceded by the phrase, "Eight hundred years ago..." If Islam was conducive and promotive of intellectual advancement, it would never have regressed backwards to the barbarism we see today. We instead should have seen perpetual progress and stimulation and intellectual ferment, such as in the Western Renaissance.
What we in fact find is that the oft-touted achievements of Islamic civilization are all on the far corners of the Muslim world, and were products either of non-Arab peoples long ago(the mosques of Sinan in Turkey; the poetry and painting of Persia; the Taj Mahal in India) or in synthesis with other peoples (as with the Muslim/Christian/Jewish culture of Moorish Spain). "Arabic numbers" are a misnomer, are actually of Indian/Hindu origin, inclusive of the concept of 'zero'. Arabs merely provided the 'bridge' to the West, after having invaded both cultures by force.
If there were even the slightest bit of truth in that idea then islamic societies (of which there are many) would not be some of the most backward, medieval, and cruely inhuman societies on earth. All are restricted and held back by one common demominator: islam. Healthcare, sanitation, jurisprudence, social and political conditions, in islamic societies all of these are screaming proof that islam is a burden and a hindrance to human advancement. Your claim has as much validity as one who would say that having AIDS makes one healthier. Look around, you can probably find a book or two that says it. Most of the contributions to ancient society claimed by muslims were actually contributions by the Persians, who are not arabs, and who were advanced themselves by interaction with other non-islamic peoples, such as Jews and Greeks. Their few contributions were made in spite of islam, not because of it.
As the different tribes and nations of people who were living throughout the land were conquered, their taxes were lowered, they were given a stable common currency...This is the guiding principle of Supply Side economics.
Their taxes were lowered IF they converted. If not, additional taxes were levied on those that weren't murdered. That doesn't sound like supply side economics to me. BTW, Silver and Gold had been stable common currencies long before islam tried to enslave the world.
Leaps in Astronomy, Medicine, physics, mathematics, chemistry, art, language, and music all were brought in from the Islamic world to our own.
Nazism can claim more contributions to all these things than islam can and how long was it around? Oh come on, some mathmatical theories of the Persians can be honestly claimed, along with a few Persian astronomical concepts, but that's about it. ART? yeah, right. Islam has destroyed and hindered art more than any despotic blight that ever cursed the face of the planet. Just ask all those greek statues that had their noses broken off. Just ask all those paintings and tapestries that were destroyed and forbidden to be recreated. Islam is the ultimate enemy of ART. The only contributions ever made by "islam" were PERSIAN contributions, not islamic contributions. And those would not have happened either, if the Persian empire had not interacted with so many different cultures BEFORE falling victim to islam.
If some mullah suggested this idea for our women, the mullah would be beheaded.
As far as a vision of heaven is concerned, Heaven is what you choose it to be if you're worthy. Bliss may be carnal for some, and intellectual for others.
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