Who's Germany? A Study In Irrelevance

Vanity | 12/26/02 | Sparta

[Sparta]

We've been bombarded by leftist media outlets about the fact that many nations oppose President Bush's Iraq policy. These opposing nations are often held up as more enlightened than the United States. One of the leaders of the "don't bomb Iraq" crowd is a little country in Europe called Germany.

For those of you who don't know who Germany is, they are the nation which has started both world wars we've been in this century. Germany was completely and utterly destroyed during World War II. She was then rebuilt in the largest aid package in world history by the nation which led her defeat, the United States. We, during and after the Cold War, stationed thousands of troops to guarantee this nation's security. The United States equipped and trained the new German Bundeswehr when most other conquerers would have found a way to exploit their conquered. (Ex: The Soviet occupation of East Germany.)

Now, Germany has one of the largestest economies in Europe and one of Europe's finest militaries. But, they are no longer the global power they once were.

Germany is trying to get the rest of the world to take them seriously by criticizing Bush publicly. Current Chancellor Gerhart Schroder's reelection campaign focused on anti-American rhetoric. His Justice Minister compared Bush to Hitler. In the end, Schroder was barely reelected.

Now tell me if this is an important nation or a culture that his contributed to Western Civilization. Germany's economy is in a free fall. To attempt to solve this, Comrade Schroder is proposing income tax increases and a wealth tax, among other proposals. His Foreign Minister threw rocks at police during demonstrations against the very American soldiers who protect his country. Also, for your information, the birthplace of Karl Marx was none other than Germany. Germany, outside of Nietzsche and a few others, has been the cultural home for the latest tyrannical and anti-Western philosophies ever devised in history.

What does the future hold for Germany? Germany, through the European Union(Fourth Reich), stands to become the leader of Europe. I think Germany will lead Europe. It will become the first nation in Europe to adopt Sharia(Islamic law). Many of you will disagree and say France will be the first. I happen to have faith in the French that I don't have for Germany. I think France will return to the civilized world and remember the fact they are a nation founded on the promise of liberty for all of its citizens. Germany has no idea of liberty, however. During the Weimar Republic, the main parties in Germany all called for an end to the Republic and an institution of tyrannical government. Germany, after World War II, wrote argueably one of the most statist documents posing as a constitution in the world. So, Sharia should not be much of a stretch for them.

I hope Germany realizes two things. One, that socialism and statism don't work and never will. Two, that Germany will benefit more by being more aggressive against terrorism. Also, Germany would be wise to emulate the United States, not just attacking it. Unfortunately, there are few in Germany who are willing to learn these lessons.

[Sparta]

What say all of you.

[qam1]

Now, Germany has one of the largestest economies in Europe and one of Europe's finest militaries. But, they are no longer the global power they once were.

Finest militaries???? Really????

Didn't they have to borrow a old Ukrainian tug boat to transport token troops to Afghanistan?

Germany is finished..

[RobFromGa]

I work with a number of Germans, and other Europeans. My honest opinion is that they think they are so brainwashed about America by their own liberal press that they haven't a clue.

If you think CNN is bad, try a few straight weeks of CNN International & SkyNews-- you'll be hating America too! I have more faith in Germany than you-- but the EU must be severely reduced in power for Germany to regain her former stature.

[Fiddlstix]

Good Post

[Sparta]

I meant that in a comparison to everyone else in Europe. Also, the Germans cut their military in a time of war this year.

[meenie]

They must be talking a different Germany and France than I knew.When the French beat the Germans at anything that will also be the day. The English will be the first nation to succumb to Sharia law. They are by far the biggest immigrant nation in Europe. They absorbed all the rejects from their abandoned colonies.

[Birdlady]

We have a neighbor kid who signed up for the Army last year.

He is being sent to Germany in a month or so.

WHY do we have troops in Germany at ALL anymore?

It's a European joke? Or what?

[1rudeboy]

One fact that is easily overlooked is that, during the Cold War, our troops were not merely stationed in Europe to defend their host countries, but our interests as well.

As for the current state of affairs, if you believe our troops have no reason to be there, it is useless to explain why they are there.

[caltrop]

We've still got about 75,000 GIs (and their dependents) in Germany in 26 locations. They don't have a mission and, when they had to send tanks to Kosovo, found they couldn't get them there before they could be sent from the states.

The cost of maintaining our ground forces, and their dependents with the necessary schools, medical facilities, PXs, etc. in Germany is gigantic. It's way past time we brought them home.

[caltrop]

Well 1rudeboy, why don't you take a crack at explaining it anyway. I served as a Colonel in our Army in Europe and would love to have your expert, first hand opinion on why our troops should remain in Germany.

[1rudeboy]

You have an interesting tone for a Colonel. How about the doctrine of "forward defense?" Surely you picked it up at West Point.

[caltrop]

Prior to the end of the Cold War the Army had a mission in Europe. At that point, and for the 35 years up to that point, our forces in Europe were there for a reason.

You'll find my tone is fairly consistent among Colonels who don't suffer fools lightly.

[caltrop]

45, not 35, years up to that point.

[Red Jones]

I appreciate your view on germany. However, I don't agree at all with the tone of it. Germany has contributed a great deal to european and american civilizations. does teh name martin luther mean nothing to christians? or to people who remember the making of europe into something special? Germany's had thousands of years of a very important history. Weren't germans among the group that toppled Rome so many years ago? It is true that many rotten intellectuals have come from germany and that two terrible wars were started by the germans. But it would be a terrible thing for the muslims to rule germany. I have faith and hope that this won't happen.

My opinion also is the Germans should shut off new immigration and seek to make their nation prosperous, they should, just like us withdraw from the EU, the UN and the WTO.

The Germans have also been tremendous hosts to the US military since 1945. They have domestic political forces that keep them out of this US led war on iraq. I think we should respect that. Hasn't germany sent troops to afghanistan? I'm sure they had troops in our kosovo adventure from 3 years ago. They have been a good ally for 50 years, it is time to forget those 2 wars from previous that. We should want to see a strong germany, not a damaged germany. The absorption of the east in the last 13 years has been a huge sacrifice for the west germans.

I note also that when patrick henry gave his famous speech in the virginia state legislature at the time of the revolution about a third of the members in that legislature had german as their first language. If germany is so bad as you say, then america must be also because so many americans have german stock in them.

[Sparta]

Our forces were there to check the Soviet expansion into Europe and, frankly, to make sure the Krauts never got the idea of starting a Fourth Reich.

[1rudeboy]

My experience is that Colonels tend to be more circumspect before determining whether someone is a fool, but I like your reply nonetheless.

My comment in #8 was directed to those that feel that our troops need to be returned from Europe as an article of faith . . . they are the ones with which it is useless to argue. As for me, I agree with the Pentagon's current assessment: that future conflicts will be regional; that those conflicts will come from unexpected quarters; and that our forces need to be positioned so that they may quickly respond to any such threats.

[caltrop]

Those are good reasons for our forces to have been there. But they don't need to be there now. We can satisfy our obligation to NATO by leaving our Air Force bases in Europe but the idea that we should leave 75,000 GIs, at huge expense, sitting in Germany with no mission is indefensible.

[Sparta]

First of all, this is not an attack on the German people, this an attack on the German view of the world and liberty. Our ideas of liberty came from three places primarily: Greece, Rome, and Britain. Most the German immigrants have ASSIMILATED into the primarily Anglo-Saxon culture of America.

America is great because we have ignored the statism expoused by Germany and all the other Eurotrash and embraced the Greek-Roman-British traditions of liberty.

[foreverfree]

bump

[Sparta]

I, personally, think that the troops should be redeployed to Poland because I think Russia is NOT our friend like Dubya and many others think.