Posted on 06/22/2009 7:28:34 PM PDT by Alex Murphy
I won’t put anyone’s name here where they can be ridiculed and mocked. Sorry.
She’s a sinner, saved by grace and delivered from satan by the hand of God. She’s no better or worse than any of the rest of us. We’re all sinners. I thank God she came to know our Saviour and her life was turned around.
And what's this I hear about your pope???
He was having a theological discussion with a cardinal and decided he had to go into the Vatican basement to check out some old archives...
Turns out the Cardinal heard this screaming, bawling and crying and ran down the stairs to come to the aid of the pope...
He got there and the pope had a book open and the tears were running down his face and the cardinal ask 'what is it'???
The pope says, 'it says CELEBRATE, not celebate...
Ahh, that's life in Rome...
God is outside of time but man is not.
Now Jesus is not only true God, He is also true man. Thus, when the Second Person of the Trinity took upon Himself our humanity, He was born into time. He was born "at the fullness of time", as Scripture says.
Jesus is not outside of time by virtue of His human nature. He did not exist from all eternity for it required Mary's "yes" to bring about that union of God and man. Without Mary's "yes", there is no Jesus.
Thus OT times "predate" Jesus. They do not predate the second person of the Holy Trinity who is one with the Father.
I aver that Jesus lives timelessly, He is the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. Even enfleshed, He had life in Himself.
In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. - John 1:1-5
Or to put it another way, the Name which was announced to Mary who was “in” time came from “beyond” time, just like the Name which was announced to Moses who was “in” time came from “beyond” time.
And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you. – Exodus 3:14
Thus we shall not agree on the point – in your understanding, the Name Jesus had a beginning "in" time – in mine, His Names are not time bound because He is timeless.
Though I hasten to add, that Jesus' being enfleshed was how He chose to create and sacrifice His own Blood - timelessly, as God - for our redemption. The blood of a mere created being - whether ox or man - would not do.
Nevertheless, thank you for this opportunity to enter my testimony!
God’s Name is I AM.
No traditions of man, just traditions of God, like the scriptures are — we don’t come up with our own flawed interpretations like those outside The Church do. When you have sola scriptura you have Jehovah’s witnesses, Gene Robinson and Mormons as the ultimate end — oh, and also Unitarian-universalists.
Thanks for the post, I found it quite interesting. I find all Church history interesting, even the “dark” portions, as it shows how the Church *must* be protected by God or else would have failed long ago.
IOW, I don’t think it’s in dispute by any serious historian, that there have been many Popes throughout history that have not acted with the appropriate dignity afforded the office. This shows the Hand of God on the Church, despite the failings of men in Her Magisterium.
Father McBrien may have a theological axe to grind here, but the history cannot be denied. Nor should it, for the reason stated above.
For this reason, and perhaps also given the nature of some posts on this thread, I think it’s important to point out the salient point for all on this thread to read: Simply because a person has some personal faults, in no way diminishes any theological truth they may enjoy.
“Guilt” via character assassination is for the liberal. Let’s all remember that.
That's a odd statememt...Morman aren't sola scripture...They created their own bible just as you guys created your catechism and tradition...They are more like you than anyone...And just as relavant...
great posts as usual...thanks...
So without Mary, there'd be no Jesus, eh??? The fact that this was prophesied a few years in advance shows that it was a done deal...
Mary's permission wasn't needed at at...In fact, her knowledge of the operation wasn't even necessary for it to happen...
If Jesus' only role was to be the head of the body, the church, it could have been any girl and she wouldn't have to know she was carrying God's child...Some young fella coming up claiming to be God and performing miracles like Jesus did would probably be enough for the church to believe in...
But Jesus came as the Messiah to the Jews, something they had been promised for years...And for that role, certain things had to happen and some rules had to be followed, ie, the lineage thing...
You guys got it wrong...Mary wasn't blessed because she said 'I do'...She was blessed because she was born and chosen for the role well ahead of time...
Well said, Iscool.
He doesn’t seem to belong to an order; he is a secular priest (no pun intended). But he is not incardinated in South Bend; he is a priest of the archdiocese of Hartford.
So you keep insisting.
That would be me....and Aquinas.....and numerous Church councils in every age.....and Bernard.....and Bede....and Basil.......and.....well you get the picture!
Duffers one and all!!
BTW, I find posts like your last one hugely entertaining.
The complete lack of self-second guessing with which you dispense your half-baked theology is truly appealing....:-)
Yep, I found that out and posted that in a later post. :)
***Well, we are not an esoteric secret gnostic meeting of folks.***
Not to hear the opposition. Except of course, when they find out that the Church is not secret, they simply blow it off and claim that it was formerly secret and that the Vatican vaults contain all the proofs that their little cults have always claimed.
***Don’t want to upset those who do belong to such groups (and they are inevitably OUTSIDE The Church)***
When you are your own Pope, you create your own church. And therefore everyone else is outside your church. Neat, eh?
They may be outside the Catholic church but not outside the universal catholic church, the body of Christ, which HE founded, not mere man. I thank God they ARE outside the Catholic church.
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