Pope Joan film sparks Roman Catholic Church row

The Telegraph ^ | 20 Jun 2010 | Nick Squires

[Alex Murphy]

....proponents of the story point out that papal records are almost non-existent in the 10th and 11th centuries and that even male popes are barely documented.

They point to one particularly extraordinary artefact as evidence that she existed – a wooden chair with a hole in the seat which, it is claimed, was used for 600 years to establish the gender of would-be popes in the wake of the Pope Joan scandal.

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[Alex Murphy]

They point to one particularly extraordinary artefact as evidence that she existed – a wooden chair with a hole in the seat which, it is claimed, was used for 600 years to establish the gender of would-be popes in the wake of the Pope Joan scandal.

[Virginia Ridgerunner]

Papal candidates were supposedly made to sit on the 'sella stercoraria', which is today owned by the Vatican Museums, while a deacon prodded their genitalia from underneath to make sure of their manhood.

Yikes!!!

[Virginia Ridgerunner]

Yeah, that was what I was thinking too...

[vladimir998]

“Pope Joan” never existed and there is no evidence whatsoever that she did.

There are no bona fide documents from her - not a single one.

There are no contempory documents which attest to her.

There are no witnesses to her - not a single one.

Only liberals and bigots believe in the story.

[Petrosius]

Are they talking about something like this:

Replica of a marble commode used in the Vatican, Europe, 1601-1900

Credits: Science Museum London

This is a copy of a commode used in the Vatican, the residence of the Pope, who is the leader of the Catholic Church. Underneath the commode, a chamber pot would have been placed and emptied after use. The item was bought from a private collection in 1932 by one of Henry Wellcome’s collecting agents, Captain Peter Johnston-Saint.

An apt place for their "theories".

[Alex Murphy]

Are they talking about something like this: Replica of a marble commode used in the Vatican, Europe, 1601-1900

Try again. From the article: a wooden chair with a hole in the seat which, it is claimed, was used for 600 years to establish the gender of would-be popes in the wake of the Pope Joan scandal.

If "Pope Joan" was elected Pope in 853, the deception uncovered three years later, and the chair not created/used until after the scandal, the Catholic apologist will have to produce a wooden commode that dates 856-1456.

[Titanites]

What’s not a myth is the current practice of ordaining women, on purpose. But it’s not the Catholics who do this but rather the Protestants. You won’t see a sensationalized movie about it though.

[Petrosius]

You try again. I said "something like this." Clearly there was more than one commode in the Vatican, some would be marble some wooden. These items were not too uncommon. As for "it is claimed", who has made this claim and upon what historical evidence?

This story is pure myth. The first of a female pope was by Jean de Mailly in the 13th century and he placed the event in 1099. There are no contemporary citations from the 9th or any other century. An amusing story but only ignorance or anti-Catholic bigotry would insist that it is true.

[Petrosius]

That should have read: “The first mention of a female pope …”

[vladimir998]

No “Pope Joan” was ever elected let alone in 853.

Pope Leo IV was already pope in 853 and continued as such until he died in 855.

[Malacoda]

An amusing story but only ignorance or anti-Catholic bigotry would insist that it is true.

Consider the source of the posting. 'Nuff said.

[COBOL2Java]

Pope Leo IV was already pope in 853 and continued as such until he died in 855.

True, but the anti-Catholics' minds are made up - no use confusing them with facts...

[Alex Murphy]

Consider the source of the posting. 'Nuff said.

Ping me when you talk about me.

[Malacoda]

No.

[Alex Murphy]

No.

But why? I've pinged you every time I've talked about you!

[Tax-chick]

My grandparents had wooden commodes very similar to the marble item in your picture. Even after they got a bathroom in the house, the “thunderboxes” were kept in the basement for emergencies (such as 30 people in a 1-bath house during deer season).

[Cheverus]

I remember some years ago while I was working at the Archdiocese of Boston my boss (the Cabinet Secretary for Institutional Advancement) trying to convince an intern than “Pope Joan” existed.

I complained to Bishop Richard “Tricky Dick” Lennon’s office about what he was doing and was ignored......

[cantabile]

“Pope Joan” never existed and there is no evidence whatsoever that she did.

But the total lack of evidence is, itself, evidence of the cunning effectiveness of the Vatican coverup! Also, everyone knows that prior to 856 there were no privies; people just, you know, squatted wherever and whenever the need arose.

Seriously, when did the Telegraph turn into the Weekly World News?

[Alex Murphy]

I remember some years ago while I was working at the Archdiocese of Boston my boss (the Cabinet Secretary for Institutional Advancement) trying to convince an intern than “Pope Joan” existed.

New-hire prank?

I complained to Bishop Richard “Tricky Dick” Lennon’s office about what he was doing and was ignored......

The same bishop who was moved over to the Cleveland Diocese!
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