St. Juan Diego's tilma: "completely outside" science

DeaconsBench ^ | Monday August 24, 2009 | Beliefnet/Deacon's Bench

[Salvation]

St. Juan Diego's tilma: "completely outside" science

Monday August 24, 2009

Take a look:

A physicist who has spent years researching the tilma bearing the image of Our Lady of Guadalupe is affirming that there is no scientific explanation for the phenomenon.

Adolfo Orozco stated this in a presentation given at an International Marian Congress that took place Aug. 6-8 in Phoenix.

The congress, sponsored by the Knights of Columbus, the Phoenix Diocese and the Institute of Guadalupan Studies, was dedicated to Our Lady of Guadalupe.

Orozco gave a presentation on the image of the Virgin imprinted on St. Juan Diego's tilma, stating that it is "completely outside" any scientific explanation.

He explained that due to the humid, salty environment around the basilica where the tilma is kept in Mexico City, the cloak material should have decomposed years ago.

In fact, the researcher noted, this is what happened to a painted copy of the image that was made in 1789, on a material similar to the original tilma.

Although the copy was preserved behind glass, like the original, it had to be discarded eight years later because it was falling apart and the painting was fading, the physicist reported.

The original image, however, which was imprinted on the cloak when the Blessed Virgin appeared to the saint, remains intact after 478 years.

Orozco told his audience that this phenomenon is heightened by the fact that it should have been destroyed twice, once when nitric acid was accidentally spilled on a section of the cloth, and another time when a bomb exploded close to it.

He affirmed that there is no natural explanation for how the image has survived undamaged through time and potentially destructive events such as these.

[marbren]

Thank you both for answering my questions!

Deuteronomy 29:29 (NIV) 29 The secret things belong to the LORD our God, but the things revealed belong to us and to our children forever, that we may follow all the words of this law.

1 Corinthians 13:12 (KJV) For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

I like these verses when I do not know, as my tag line says

I do not know but, Thank God, God knows

I am going to drop my anal questions about demon seed for a while and let God reveal what He wants me to know

[marbren]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAFXJ4JFaDY

I enjoy this perspective. My apologies Alamo-Girl if hearing the video is difficult. Does his appearance reveal his spirit?

[Quix]

Thanks for your questions, commentary and link, Marbren, A-G et al.

imho,

Guy Malone’s excellent panel of scholars available here:

http://www.AncientOfDays.net

&

http://www.AlienResistance.org

make the most convincing case for

1. demons being the spirits of the fallen angels et al who’s bodies were destroyed in the flood.

2. the purported ET’s of UFO incidents to be fallen angels.

Certainly we know from Scripture that not all the 1/3 fallen angels had their bodies destroyed in the flood.

And, evidently they’ve been intent on polluting mankind with sexual contact ongoingly over the centuries since.

Certainly the hybrid business so well reported by so many would fit such a Biblically condemned activity.

Stan Romanek’s case is the best documented with multiple person observations over many years and videos taken while a gathering of friends were at the home seeing the same things; visiting overnight friends and relatives experiencing similar things etc.

http://www.stanromanek.com

There seems to be something particularly devilish about mixing fallen angel DNA with human DNA. Satan has long been wholesale intent on it and God has just as long been fiercely against it.

Certainly there have been plenty of surviving off planet fallen angels whose bodies were not destroyed in the flood to continue to dink around with mankind in violation of God’s priorities and decrees.

Some have postulated that God gave mankind dominion over the earth and perhaps, ultimately, to some extent all creation—shall we not judge angels?—as the NT declares.

Perhaps that is a hint or a clue about the focus of the hybridization hideousness. Perhaps there is some spiritual authority that gets polluted or hijacked or something by the hybridization with the fallen angels.

Certainly the END TIMES delusion that the Bible speaks about will involve the fallen angels declaring that THEY bio-engineered mankind . . . nuking the Biblical narrative about reality and creation. And, so slick will the delusion/deception be that WERE IT POSSIBLE, the very elect would be deceived.

Throw in the globalist determination to tie in buying, selling, food, health care to the Mark of the Beast chip implant and the motivation to swallow the Deception will be intense.

I’m increasingly thankful and convinced by such as

JD FARAQ asserting that The Rapture must be PRE-TRIB

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwrRHl3eaFk

CHUCK MISSLER:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlvvNL4WsHo&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PL26566A6C5D0A2DE5

OTHERS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7g4WAq9zHQU

Satan and his fallen angels are certainly depicted in Scripture as presenting a lot of ‘miraculous’ ‘sound & light’ demonstrations in the END TIMES. The gullible and God hating will have no means, no constructs, no memes, no perspectives on reality from which to do anything in responding to such but compliance.

When it’s all overlaid with a veneer or even deeper structure of the religion of scientism . . . the rebellious against God who worship at the altar of scientism will suck-up to such demonstrations wholesale—cheering an alternative to obedience to God Almighty and His decrees about relationships, sexuality etc.

They will stupidly be unaware that satan requires exceedingly horrible and rigid obedience to far worse orders.

The fool has said in his heart there is no God.

ALICE BAILEY
Globalist Advocate
Of
One World Religion

Just as THE BIBLE predicted
For our END TIMES era.

“The day is dawning when all religions will be regarded as emanating from one great spiritual source ; all will be seen as unitedly providing the one root out of which the universal world religion will inevitably emerge.

Then there will be neither Christian nor heathen, neither Jew nor Gentile, but simply one great body of believers, gathered out of all the current religions.” —Alice Bailey & Djwhal Khul

“Alice Bailey who channeled the words “points of light” in the book Externalization of the Hierarchy which was published by the Lucis Trust, incorporated originally in New York as the Lucifer Publishing Company. Lucis Trust is a United Nations NGO and is actively involved in U.N. summits. Assistant Secretary General of the U.N. Robert Mueller credited the creation of his World Core Curriculum for education to the underlying teachings of Djwahl Kuhl via Alice Bailey’s writings on the subject.”

“The purpose of modern education is social engineering designed to program students into accepting this new world religion of global government. In 1947 John Dewey, the father of American public education said that education must teach “...establishment of a genuine world order, an order in which national sovereignty is subordinate to world authority... “

In 1947 National Education Association Associate Secretary William Carr writes in the NEA Journal that it is the job of teachers to:

“... teach about the various proposals that have been made for the strengthening of the United Nations and the establishment of a world citizenship and world government.”

Simultaneously, the technology of mind control is advancing as quickly as computer technology or biotechnology.

In 1948 in his book Walden II behavioral psychologist B.F. Skinner proposes “a perfect society or new and more perfect order” in which children are to be raised by the State, rather than by parents or the family. (This is the purpose of daycare starting at 3 years old ) According to B.F. Skinner, who was photographed keeping his daughter in a box, children are trained or programmed from birth. Skinner’s theories on behavior modification or the brainwashing of children would be widely implemented by educators in the 1960s, 70s, and 80s as Values Clarification and Outcome Based Education.

As the momentum of this coming one world religion has increased the current Laodecian Church in America has been blind to both its reality and implications. In 1974, The World Conference of Religion for Peace, is held in Belgium. At that convention, Douglas Roche presents a report entitled “We Can Achieve a New World Order” which states, “The U.N. calls for wealth redistribution [QX UNTHANKS OTHUGA!]: In a report entitled New International Economic Order, the U.N. General Assembly outlines a plan to redistribute the wealth from the rich to the poor nations.”

above from:

http://www.paulmcguire.org/articles/articles_babylon_basra_hgwells_new_world_order.html

[marbren]

Thank You Heavenly Father for the wisdom presented in Quix’s post. Thank You Lord Jesus Christ for providing the solution.

[Quix]

BLESSED BE THE NAME OF THE LORD.

BLESSED BE THE WORD OF THE LORD.

BLESSED BE THE LORD GOD OF ABRAHAM, ISAAC AND JACOB.

PRAISE GOD FOR THE RETURN OF THE KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.

[narses]

A tiny peak into Quix and his type of thinking:

1. demons being the spirits of the fallen angels et al who’s bodies were destroyed in the flood.

2. the purported ET’s of UFO incidents to be fallen angels.

And, evidently they’ve been intent on polluting mankind with sexual contact ongoingly over the centuries since.

[Quix]

Actually, IIRC, a fair number of RC scholars and investigators have documented such, as well.

And, as Alamo-Girl has pointed out . . . so does the Book of Enoch—a book respected by Christ and the Disciples as Scripture indicates.

If you think you have a better explanation for the evidence, please offer it! LOL.

[narses]

[Quix]

Thankfully, a number of RC’s on FR know that said gif is a very apt description of your perspective on such issues and topics.

[Quix]

Though it would be more fun to say to you what so many of you and cohorts are so fond of saying to Proddys . . .

PROVE IT.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

I don’t think many orthodox Catholic posters here disagree with Narses on much. On this particular post he is absolutely correct.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

Forgot to ping you to my last post. This is the first time using my new iPhone to post on free Republic. I’m still trying to figure it out.

[narses]

:)

[MarkBsnr]

1. demons being the spirits of the fallen angels et al who’s bodies were destroyed in the flood. 2. the purported ET’s of UFO incidents to be fallen angels. And, evidently they’ve been intent on polluting mankind with sexual contact ongoingly over the centuries since.

Cartman is of like mind.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

I had voice recognition software years ago for medical dictation. It just never worked. I’m using it on my iPhone now to post these posts. The accuracy is just stunning. If my voice dictation software for medical transcription had been this effective back then I never would have gotten rid of it. If it is this good on a handheld cell phone I’m going to have to look into it again for medical records. The technology must be light years ahead of what it was a dozen years ago. We are remodeling my office and I just threw away the boxes for the IBM voice dictation & the DragonDictate system. I only had to make three or four corrections on this particular post just now.

[Quix]

Sadly, he is thoroughly wrong.

I’d MUCH RATHER he was 100% correct. That would be WONDERFUL.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

I’m fairly certain you’ve been told to keep your UFO theories off this forum?

If you think the Miracle of the Tilma is some kind of demonic deception, or in some way related to UFO activity, you’re deluded beyond any human hope.

You need to seriously reassess how and where you are spending your time online.

You have lost any sense of Christian discernment you may have ever possessed in this regard.

Your search for “enlightenment” has sucked you into a gnostic hole from which you are unable to explicate yourself.

You are unable to discern Truth from error in your obsession over UFO activity, and it colors any post you make on the Religion Forum now.

Get away from it before you lose your soul. You obviously are not strong enough to sort this stuff through in your mind.

[Quix]

Due to our considerable friendly and mutually respectful back channel dialogues, I’ve long considered you a genuine Christian Brother.

I’m saddened to see you working so hard to shred that perspective.

[Brian Kopp DPM]

I’m saddened to see you continue this demonic campaign against true Christian miracles.