Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Interview with former Catholic Priests and Nuns on why they left
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIt43tFTmLc ^ | Larry Wessels

Posted on 08/31/2013 3:38:44 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans

Full interview (roughly one hour) with former Roman Catholic priests Richard Bennett (website: http://www.BEREANBEACON.ORG) & Bartholomew Brewer, Ph.D, author of "Pilgrimage from Rome - A Testimony" (website: http://www.MTC.COM) and former nun Rocio Zwirner give glory to God for their exodus from the Roman Catholic Church & into the glorious grace of the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ. (Description from youtube)


TOPICS: Apologetics; Evangelical Christian; General Discusssion; Moral Issues
KEYWORDS: agendadrivenfreeper; rcvsevang; romandamagecontrol; sourcetitlenoturl
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 441-446 next last
To: daniel1212

“Vladimir, it was Manning, not I, who stated “I may say in strict truth that the Church has no antiquity. It rests upon its own supernatural and perpetual consciousness,” “

Again, you did not post what else Manning said:

“And from this a fourth truth immediately follows, that the doctrines of the Church in all ages are primitive.”


161 posted on 09/01/2013 7:39:24 PM PDT by vladimir998
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 153 | View Replies]

To: bkaycee
WOW, I read Vlads screed and thought to myself, What is he talking about? Baseless charge. Loyola would be proud.

"Screed" is an apt description, and he did not even make clear what his objection was so i could address it better.

162 posted on 09/01/2013 7:41:01 PM PDT by daniel1212 (Come to the Lord Jesus as a contrite damned+destitute sinner, trust Him to save you, then live 4 Him)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 142 | View Replies]

To: metmom

“The problem is that the RCC will not let them be married and serve as priests at the same time.”

Maybe you should tell that to two priests I know. One is married with five kids. The other is married with three kids. They’re both former Protestant ministers who thankfully discovered the truth and became Catholics.


163 posted on 09/01/2013 7:41:41 PM PDT by vladimir998
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: narses; metmom
>> Are you claiming the Church FORBIDS marriage?<<

Looks to me like they do,P. In the Eastern Churches a different discipline has been in force for many centuries: while bishops are chosen solely from among celibates, married men can be ordained as deacons and priests. This practice has long been considered legitimate; these priests exercise a fruitful ministry within their communities. Moreover, priestly celibacy is held in great honor in the Eastern Churches and many priests have freely chosen it for the sake of the Kingdom of God. In the East as in the West a man who has already received the sacrament of Holy Orders can no longer marry. (CCC 1579-1580)

164 posted on 09/01/2013 7:42:53 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear

“Looks to me like they do,”

So much for your eyes then.


165 posted on 09/01/2013 7:43:53 PM PDT by narses
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: daniel1212; Religion Moderator

Gee, Religion Moderator, I’m sure you were just about to tell the author of post 162 that he is “making it personal,” like you did to me earlier, right? I’m just saying...


166 posted on 09/01/2013 7:46:16 PM PDT by vladimir998
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 162 | View Replies]

To: vladimir998; daniel1212

167 posted on 09/01/2013 7:50:43 PM PDT by metmom ( For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: narses
>>So much for your eyes then.<<

So the statement in the CCC “can no longer marry. means something different to you?

168 posted on 09/01/2013 7:54:11 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 165 | View Replies]

To: vladimir998; daniel1212
Neither his post 162 nor your post 160 are "making it personal" because neither attribute motives, read minds or make the thread "about" another Freeper, e.g. badgering or attacking the messenger instead of the message.

Both posts claim ambiguity.

169 posted on 09/01/2013 7:55:42 PM PDT by Religion Moderator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear; narses

“So the statement in the CCC “can no longer marry. means something different to you?”

Why do you care if they have chosen to not marry? To be ordained in the West, most men take a vow to not marry. That’s their choice. No one forces them to make it. Why is that a problem for you? Jesus chose to not marry. Does that bother you?


170 posted on 09/01/2013 8:05:48 PM PDT by vladimir998
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear
Here CB. This is the link you should have provided. It's from the Catechism of the Catholic church at the website of vatican.va.

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P4X.HTM

1579 All the ordained ministers of the Latin Church, with the exception of permanent deacons, are normally chosen from among men of faith who live a celibate life and who intend to remain celibate "for the sake of the kingdom of heaven."70 Called to consecrate themselves with undivided heart to the Lord and to "the affairs of the Lord,"71 they give themselves entirely to God and to men. Celibacy is a sign of this new life to the service of which the Church's minister is consecrated; accepted with a joyous heart celibacy radiantly proclaims the Reign of God.72

1580 In the Eastern Churches a different discipline has been in force for many centuries: while bishops are chosen solely from among celibates, married men can be ordained as deacons and priests. This practice has long been considered legitimate; these priests exercise a fruitful ministry within their communities.73 Moreover, priestly celibacy is held in great honor in the Eastern Churches and many priests have freely chosen it for the sake of the Kingdom of God. In the East as in the West a man who has already received the sacrament of Holy Orders can no longer marry.

171 posted on 09/01/2013 8:12:19 PM PDT by metmom ( For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: vladimir998
>>That’s their choice.<<

What does “can no longer marry” mean to you? Please don’t try to insult our intelligence by suggesting that the RCC doesn’t disallow those who have been ordained to get married. It’s rather plain that they don’t.

172 posted on 09/01/2013 8:13:42 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear

What does “can no longer marry” mean to you?

Well, it m,eans very simply the same thin g it always has, if you have a vow that prevents marriage, you “can no longer marry” - a prior marriage to a living woman, for example. Or a vow of celibacy. But that is not at all your claim, as it is IDENTICAL to the Eastern Church view. But you knew that, right?


173 posted on 09/01/2013 8:16:04 PM PDT by narses
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear

What does “can no longer marry” mean to you?

Well, it means very simply the same thing it always has, if you have a vow that prevents marriage, “can no longer marry” - a prior marriage to a living woman, for example. Or a vow of celibacy. But that is not at all your claim, as it is IDENTICAL to the Eastern Church view. But you knew that, right?


174 posted on 09/01/2013 8:16:27 PM PDT by narses
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: metmom

And yet they try to twist it somehow to make it look like the RCC would allow those already ordained to get married but they “choose” not to. The obfuscation is stunning.


175 posted on 09/01/2013 8:17:54 PM PDT by CynicalBear (For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear

No twisting is taking place.

Truth conquers all.

In many dioceses formerly married Protestants ministers who had families, have become priests. If their wives should die, then they cannot re-marry. They understand that when they are ordained.


176 posted on 09/01/2013 8:39:00 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear

If a priest wants to marry, he has to leave the priesthood. I know a man that happened with.

The Catholic church would not allow him to remain a priest if he married.

So, no, the church does not really allow married priests.

If they were allowed, I would presume that people would be seeing them somewhere.

The requirement of celibacy is a man made construct not supported by Scripture. Of course, the whole concept of an official priesthood in the church is a man-made construct. Not referring to the priesthood of the believer, but as a separate clergy, unsupported by Scripture.


177 posted on 09/01/2013 8:47:53 PM PDT by metmom ( For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: daniel1212
I am sure what is worse, that of RCs who are so blindly devoted to defending Rome against anything that disturbs their cherished view of the object of their devotion that they must charge anyone who exposes it as being deceptive or stupid, but in so doing they indict themselves and provide an arguments against Rome.

It is MUCH worse to be a blind follower of a religious institution that has as its primary demand to the "faithful" to leave reason at the door and just swallow whatever you are told as if Jesus, Himself, were speaking to you. I praise the Lord that He answered my diligent search for the truth by showing me by His holy word what the TRUE gospel of the grace of God was and rescued me from the false religious system that preached an accursed gospel.

This is not the first time this has happened, as RCs see what they want in both Scripture and elsewhere, and an apology is in order, but i have yet to see one.

I'd say don't hold your breath. Rarely does anyone see any effort towards speaking the truth in love and respect from certain people much less apologies when false accusations are made or when a broad brush is used to impugn and insult all those not in the same religion. The silver lining is that objective lurkers will see the contrast between abject nastiness because one has no better argument and those who sincerely put forth efforts to back up what they say with research and who present it without the accompanying viciousness and snark. Believe me, people DO notice and we shouldn't forget our obligation to the Lord to speak as we would have others speak to us. I appreciate the work you put into your posts.

178 posted on 09/01/2013 9:42:29 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 138 | View Replies]

To: CynicalBear; metmom; daniel1212
It's indicative of a person who has deep insecurities about his/her beliefs. When our faith is built upon THE rock (the Lord Jesus Christ) we need not fear the storms and battles. Instead, there is a calm assurance that we know the Lord, He knows us and that His Holy Spirit is within us and will be with us through it all. That is the same kind of attitude Peter said we should have when answering one who asks us of the hope that is within us:

    But even if you should suffer for the sake of righteousness, you are blessed. AND DO NOT FEAR THEIR INTIMIDATION, AND DO NOT BE TROUBLED, but sanctify Christ as Lord in your hearts, always being ready to make a defense to everyone who asks you to give an account for the hope that is in you, yet with gentleness and reverence; and keep a good conscience so that in the thing in which you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ will be put to shame. (I Peter 3:14-16)

179 posted on 09/01/2013 9:58:18 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 141 | View Replies]

To: daniel1212; vladimir998
Here is a test, based on the below quote i invite any Prot readers (since they are the stupid one according to vladimir) to tell me if they really think Manning is actually saying what vladimir presents me as having him say, that his church has no actual antiquity, rather than that in a real sense it has none as Rome rests upon its own supernatural and perpetual consciousness.

    It was the charge of the Reformers that the Catholic doctrines were not primitive, and their pretension was to revert to antiquity. But the appeal to antiquity is both a treason and a heresy. It is a treason because it rejects the Divine voice of the Church at this hour, and a heresy because it denies that voice to be Divine.... I may say in strict truth that the Church has no antiquity. It rests upon its own supernatural and perpetual consciousness.

I pretty much ignore the insults as feeble gasps of a dying argument, but I'll give it a try. I read that just as you presented it, daniel1212. It's pretty obvious that some of the dogmas and doctrines that the Roman Catholic Church had adopted by the time the Reformation began had NO ancient witness, NO scriptural basis and NO "unanimous consent of the fathers" to rely upon. That is the EXACT reason why Newman invented the Doctrine of Development in the first place. He had to think up some way to explain that what they claimed they believed and taught (what was always and everywhere believed) was undeniably false. The acorn growing into a mature oak tree was one of the metaphors he created to explain how the church needed to figure it all out over time.

That the Roman Catholic did not need to rest on antiquity, but instead could base his faith on whatever his infallible magesterium told him was the rule of faith, was seen as the way out of the legitimate and truthful charge of the Reformers. If the Catholic's faith rests upon his Church's "own supernatural and perpetual consciousness" rather than what was always and everywhere believed from the start, then this was all the wiggle room they needed to settle the issue (or so they erroneously thought).

180 posted on 09/01/2013 10:29:23 PM PDT by boatbums (God is ready to assume full responsibility for the life wholly yielded to Him.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 153 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 141-160161-180181-200 ... 441-446 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
Religion
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson