Is Prayer/Veneration/Worship to Mary Biblical?

self | 12-14-14 | ealgeone

[ealgeone]

The reason for this article is to determine if the worship/veneration given to Mary by the catholic church is justified from a Biblical perspective. This will be evaluated using the Biblical standard and not man’s standard.

[Mark17]

I wouldn’t discuss with Catholics here if it weren’t for those lurkers who need to see the truth which counters Catholicism.

Affirmative sir. They ARE watching. Preach it brother. Just don't discuss it with the INC. Your head could explode.

:-)

[Mark17]

With pleasure! ;-)

Thank you. Actually, I think the Tiber is too wide and cold, so I wouldn't make it across, if my eternal soul depended on it. Actually, my eternal soul is precisely why I quit swimming in the Tiber in the first placer.

:-)

[Mark17]

there is no such thing, and like most other prodigal children, you'll be back!!

LOL, ok, if there is no such thing as a former catholic, then I am an ex catholic? If there is no such thing as an ex catholic, then I guess I am up the creek, but that is OK, as long as that creek is NOT the Tiber, otherwise Gamecock has his marching orders, right GC?

[terycarl]

The Catholic Church claims that the apostles, and even Jesus, were present at Mary's end and witnessed Jesus taking her to heaven. For one that would make an extra visit by Christ to earth which He said would not happen.

No they don't

[af_vet_1981]

Was the Holy Spirit upon Peter who cut off a soldier's ear? Was the Holy Spirit upon Paul who was in favor of the stoning of Stephen? Was David called a man after God's own heart? A simple yes or no to each question will suffice.

Yes, yes, yes

Your questions were not precise.

1. Peter, in the presence of Messiah who was filled with the Spirit without measure, was attempting to defend the Messiah at an inappropriate time, in an inappropriate manner, yet his actions were not inherently evil. He might have overreacted, or perhaps not under different circumstances. He was not expressly inspired by the Spirit to defend Messiah because Messiah said no. Yet the Spirit was upon him because he obeyed Messiah and put up his sword. No harm, no foul.
2. Had you qualified your question with a "when" then the answer changes to no. The Spirit was upon Paul, but not when he was consenting to the martyrdom of St. Stephen. The Spirit was upon Paul after Ananias laid hands on him and baptized him with water.
3. It is interesting to look at the scriptures dealing with the matter, the Septuagint vs Masoretic considerations notwithstanding, neither translation matches the Greek in Acts exactly.

   The following is a table of New Testament (NT) quotations of the Old Testament (OT). The left column carries the NT citations, the middle the Septuagint (LXX) and the last column the Masoretic (MT). The NT and MT traslation is the Authorized Version, the LXX, Brenton's.
   
   Acts 13:22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the [son] of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will.
   
   I Samuel 13:14 But now thy kingdom shall not stand to thee, and the Lord shall seek for himself a man after his own heart; and the Lord shall appoint him to be a ruler over his people, because thou hast not kept all that the Lord commanded thee.
   
   Psalms 88:20 I have found David my servant; I have anointed him by my holy mercy.
   
   1 Samuel 13:14 But now thy kingdom shall not continue: the LORD hath sought him a man after his own heart, and the LORD hath commanded him [to be] captain over his people, because thou hast not kept [that] which the LORD commanded thee.
   
   Psalms 89:20 I have found David my servant; with my holy oil have I anointed him:

[metmom]

I found my way *back* and it was to Christ, not a religious organization that claims to have ownership and eternal power over people’s souls.

Only one Person owns me and that is Christ. He broke all the other bonds of religiosity that held me in bondage for my life up until then.

And the stain of sin and all other marks on my soul have been erased by the blood of Jesus. It is pure and spotless before Him and IN Him.

[terycarl]

Oh what a tangled web they weave! It’s rather comical to watch actually. And this present pope is surely adding to the popcorn sales.

Popcorn sales should be way up...he drew 6,000,000 people to his Mass.....at $1.00 per box, that's a lot of money if they each ate only 2 boxes each.!!

[Gamecock]

Ever seen the Tiber? It is muddy and turbulent.

A fitting metaphor for Rome.

[Gamecock]

Got your back.

[terycarl]

What I find pretty ironic is that NOBODY here, other than the elitist FRoman Catholics, is recruiting people to join "their" church.

nobody else has the authoriity to do so. The Catholic church is the true church of Christ and thus, anyone recruiting people to another church would be leading them astray. There can only be one Holy, Catholic and Apostolic church on Earth and the Catholic church is that one. Wheen we recruit peopple to the Catholic church, we are recruiting them TO Christ, not some man made vaariation of what the true church is...

[terycarl]

Too bad that M-ry didn't die...

She didn't????? I'm a Catholic and noboby EVER taught me that.

[aMorePerfectUnion]

placemarker

[imardmd1]

Even if this is true, ol' Pete was STILL teaching ERROR later!!!

Poor Ignatius!

[imardmd1]

I think you’ve qualified for excommunication—a Roman BCD. I guess you can no longer be classified as a RCC veteran, eh?

[CynicalBear]

>>No they don't<<

According to catholicism.about.com they do say that.

All of the apostles, having been caught up in clouds by the Holy Spirit, were transported to Bethlehem to be with Mary in her final days. Together, they carried her bed (again, with the aid of the Holy Spirit) to her home in Jerusalem, where, on the following Sunday, Christ appeared to her and told her not to fear. While Peter sang a hymn, the face of the mother of the Lord shone brighter than the light, and she rose up and blessed each of the apostles with her own hand, and all gave glory to God; and the Lord stretched forth His undefiled hands, and received her holy and blameless soul. . . . And Peter, and I John, and Paul, and Thomas, ran and wrapped up her precious feet for the consecration; and the twelve apostles put her precious and holy body upon a couch, and carried it.

The apostles took the couch bearing Mary's body to the Garden of Gethsemane, where they placed her body in a new tomb: And, behold, a perfume of sweet savour came forth out of the holy sepulchre of our Lady the mother of God; and for three days the voices of invisible angels were heard glorifying Christ our God, who had been born of her. And when the third day was ended, the voices were no longer heard; and from that time forth all knew that her spotless and precious body had been transferred to paradise.

And this "so Christ descended with a multitude of angels, and received the soul of His beloved mother." can be found at newadvent.org

Are you that unaware of what your church puts out on the internet? Those are Catholic sites aren't they?

[Gamecock]

How bizarre!

[Mark17]

I think you’ve qualified for excommunication—a Roman BCD. I guess you can no longer be classified as a RCC veteran, eh?

Yep, got my RCC bad conduct discharge. I will survive and proper 😄

[CynicalBear]

Verily I say they had their reward.

[CynicalBear]

It’s interesting that they slipped that extra visit by Christ to earth isn’t it? And that after Christ told the apostles He wouldn’t until His return at the end of days.

[imardmd1]

Peter was not saved, not even converted (Luke 22:31-32) at that evening; and, similar to his ability to be prompted by Satan as in Matthew 16:22-23, Satan had Peter, was sifting him, and used Peter’s inability to master his stupid lashing out at Malchus in order that Satan might work through him to create a situation which would cause Jesus to be killed through rebellion, thus preventing Jesus from being sacrificed on the cross.