Replies

those who imagine the works they do contribute to their justification or that the sacrifice of Jesus Christ was insufficient to save us to the uttermost.

The question is not whether we "contribute to our justification." Nor is it whether "the sacrifice of Jesus Christ is sufficient." The question is whether Jesus' sacrifice saves us with working faith or non-working faith.

Let me illustrate with a question:

What save the firstborn of the Israelites in Egypt?
A. The sacrifice of the lamb
B. The work of putting the blood on the doorpost
C. Both
D. Neither

Which element was unnecessary?
A. The sacrifice of the lamb
B. The work of putting the blood on the doorpost
C. Both
D. Neither

What say you?

Genuine, life-changing faith WILL result in good deeds, but these deeds cannot and DO NOT save us.

You're absolutely right that good deeds do not save us. Those works of obedience are what make a saving faith. Without them, whatever "faith" one may claim is as dead as a corpse.

Let's take baptism, for instance - since it's the "work" commanded by God that's most often objected to on FR. Not only is it commanded by God, but it is assigned a purpose by Him. Without it, faith accomplishes no more in us than would have been accomplished at Jericho without the marching.

The marching was faith in action for Joshua and the Israelites, just as baptism is faith in action for the believer. For the Israelites, that working faith did what non-working faith couldn't, and the walls came tumblin' down. For the believer, working faith does what non-working faith cannot: it kills and buries the sin-slave, and resurrects a free man (Romans 6), it washes away sins (Acts 22), it's where Jesus performs the life-saving heart surgery (Colossians 2), etc.

So you see, the question is not whether works of obedience to God justify us, but whether they make a justifying faith, a perfected faith, a living faith, a fruitful faith. Because without that kind of faith, with any other kind of "faith" one may claim, the sacrifice of the Son - sufficient as it is - avails us nothing.

The question is not whether we "contribute to our justification." Nor is it whether "the sacrifice of Jesus Christ is sufficient." The question is whether Jesus' sacrifice saves us with working faith or non-working faith.

But that IS what you are implying whether you realize it or not. We are saved by grace through faith apart from our works. I can show you dozens of Bible passages that say exactly that. In your illustrations you give, the answer is obvious that faith is demonstrated by what we do/our works. The Israelites, by their actions, exhibited that they had faith in God's promises. That is how a genuine faith behaves. When Abraham willingly put Isaac upon the altar in obedience to God, he did so trusting that God was able to STILL fulfill His promises of making of his seed a great nation. Abraham reasoned that God could even raise the dead... (Heb. 11:19)

Read Hebrews chapter 11 and you will see ample proof that genuine, soul-saving faith is the kind that brings forth fruit - is demonstrated in action. But, the question to you is, did the works these men and women do contribute to their justification? Or, was it by their faith they were justified? God said it was their faith. And that is what has been repeatedly defended here with good reason because it is what God says. We can claim no glory or boast of our works in the plan of salvation. ALL the glory goes to God, we can claim none of it. We are saved by grace through faith and kept saved by that same grace. Grace is undeserved, unmerited, unearned favor. It is freely given to us through Christ and we receive it by faith. AFTER that, then the Holy Spirit works in us to bring us into conformity with Christ.

Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! In his great mercy he has given us new birth into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, and into an inheritance that can never perish, spoil or fade. This inheritance is kept in heaven for you, who through faith are shielded by God’s power until the coming of the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time. In all this you greatly rejoice, though now for a little while you may have had to suffer grief in all kinds of trials. These have come so that the proven genuineness of your faith—of greater worth than gold, which perishes even though refined by fire—may result in praise, glory and honor when Jesus Christ is revealed. Though you have not seen him, you love him; and even though you do not see him now, you believe in him and are filled with an inexpressible and glorious joy, for you are receiving the end result of your faith, the salvation of your souls. (I Peter 1:3-9)

>>Let me illustrate with a question:<<

You've tried that before and it still isn't going to work for you. I'll remind you of the answer by referring you here

>>Those works of obedience are what make a saving faith.<<

Wrong. That's completely backwards. It's a saving faith that produces works.

>>The marching was faith in action for Joshua and the Israelites, just as baptism is faith in action for the believer.<<

Once again see the link above. It seems that Catholic reasoning is always built on a false premise.