Posted on 04/27/2016 8:41:02 AM PDT by Salvation
Great testimony explaining your salvation. I was saved when I was 8 when a missionary visiting from Liberia was preaching at my dad’s church, then baptized shortly after that.
I also resent being called a “protestant”; we are not.
He used several different editions throughout his life. Several family members kept his bibles after he died. The book I have is a paperback New American Bible, 1976 edition.
A hell bound, lock-up-your-daughters-here-come-the-drug-dealing-hippies, waste of a man that had been successfully sidetracked by the Satanic lure of sex, drugs and rock'n'roll ... and I thoroughly enjoyed it !
Circumstances directed my inner thoughts to my eternal condition and had me in front of Eddie Klein (a Messianic Jew) at his kitchen table, that night of August 18th, 1981
I can identify with that bro. I do not consider myself a Protestant either. I didn't know it, until people in different religious persuasions told me I WAS one. I don't accept it.
You got saved in 81. I got saved in 1970, at Mountain Home, Idaho, 6 months before I became an unwilling participant in the biggest waste of my time, that there ever has been, the infamous Southeast Asia war games. If I could have figured out a way to get out of it, I would have, but hey, I went to the one place that had the best chapel program, and I came home in one piece. I only had flashback, in 1984. Never had one before, never had one after. Others had really bad experiences.
We do, however, press on to the high calling that is in Christ. 😀😆😃 By all means, carry on.
---- Mark Twain
There are some good versions out there. I prefer the American Standard Version. My wife prefers the Bisaya Version.
“..to deny the Sacraments and still claim Christianity is in error and incomplete”
So your organization was incomplete for 1200 years since the seven sacraments wasn’t nailed down or necessary for salvation until the COT. I think you need to study your organization’s history without those rose colored glasses and ask yourself why would that be. The sacraments became absolutely necessary because the reformation. The rcc was hemorrhaging members and the rcc was willing to do anything to keep the paychecks coming in. So they made up some new rules at the COT on sacraments and now you preach the lie that it has always been that way. This history is in open view on the rcc website. I’ll even make it easy so you may cut and paste “ council of trent and the sacraments”.
Amen. Sometimes I wonder if those of us raised in Christian homes (me in a parsonage) can appreciate our salvation as much as those who have come out of very sinful lives. That must add a new, profound, dimension that I know I can’t grasp.
It's on yer dog tags -- P, C, or H for Hebrew, pick one. Ya gotta go to church call, get buried (one in yer mouth and one on yer big toe), or get yer TS ticket punched by the chaplain.(WWII era)
Which is simply on your say-so, while as said, besides apostles, presbuteros/episkopos are the ones charged with teaching and functioning as pastors/shepherds of the flock, to are to care for the church, and be "apt to teach," and "feed the flock," rebuke, exhort," etc.
It looks like your head is so full of equating the two, particularly as they are regularly cross-branded in today's churches, that you cannot see that the functions are different as are the titles. Again and again.
Which again is what your assertions seem to evidence, that your head is so full of imagining the functions of pastor, episkopos, and presbuteros not at all (even "dramatically" not) interchangeable, equivalent, and synonomous, that cannot see that episkopos, and presbuteros are actually used for the very same persons, and who are the only ones besides apostles charged with and described as functioning as spiritual shepherds over the flock.
Peter called himself an elder, not a pastor.
Nor need he to, as the later broadly refers to doing what only (besides apostles) episkopos/presbuteros are charged with and described as doing, functioning as spiritual shepherds.
Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood. (Acts 20:28)
Feed the flock of God which is among you, taking the oversight thereof, not by constraint, but willingly; not for filthy lucre, but of a ready mind; (1 Peter 5:2)
One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?) (1 Timothy 3:4-5)
Deacons assist them.
If you want to get an idea of how one operates, attend a "Plymouth"-brethren-type church, where there are no pastors of the...two-class, clergy-run vs subjugated lay people hierarchies.
That is simply another false dilemma, as if , as clergy-run equates to subjugated lay people as with Rome, and God hates a false balance. For Scripture does indeed clearly charges and describes presbuteros/episkopos are being over the flock, and enjoins conditional obedience - not obeisance - to them, and which are to Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine," and "speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority" sound doctrine, even "sharply" in some cases. (2 Timothy 4:2; Titus 1:13, 2:15)
Obey them that have the rule over you, and submit yourselves: for they watch for your souls, as they that must give account, that they may do it with joy, and not with grief: for that is unprofitable for you. (Hebrews 13:17)
Just a couple of comments on a typical volume, "Reimagining Church," by Frank Viola
Just as i suspected. You have bought into the anti-authoritarian "Christ is the head of the gathering or meeting, and so human heads are required, that "the one who plants a New Testament-styled church leaves that church without a pastor, elders...," ("Pagan Christianity," http://www.victoryseekersministries.com/pdf/VSM%2041.pdf) "the New Testament knows nothing of an authoritative mode of leadership,” (Reimagining Church, p. 198) as if 1 Corinthians 14 does not testify to the failure of pastoral "taking the oversight," which is the other extreme from Romanism. If anything, churches like the S Baptist need more consensual centralized accountability, which is the Biblical model, but by street-level brethren given to hospitality, not lording it over the flock, yet with the superintendence and authority such as Timothy and Titus are charged with exercising. The balance is between such an elevated position that a 1 Cor 14 type meeting never can be realized, as only the pastor ever preaches or shares the word, and the flock can never see how the pastor lives or eat with him at home, or even Roman-type lording, and that of having no head pastoral oversight and authority, and to which leadership obedience is enjoined, and the preaching by such as Paul exampled in Acts 20.
The pastor just called me up and asked me, a much unworthy servant, to share the word at tonight's house meeting, and in which time is provided for those present to ask for prayer, and to give a short testimony (which is invited), and worship and corporate prayer follows before the pastor or pastor-appointed speaker (the latter often being the case) gives a message, but i recognize him as the head pastor, and who has unique authority. (I would like to teach on "the devil wants your worship."
You need to unravel in a systematic way until you get back to basics.
Mere bombast, as it is you who ignore what Scripture systematically shows, and insist on reading a foreign ecclesiology into Scripture, as Caths do. I have thus sadly dropped you from my ping list as you represent an opposite detrimental extreme.
Actually, Elsie, catholiciism is far from Christianity with regard to salvation. But the source is a closed tight catholic mind so I don’t bother with that any longer.
What is God’s Gospel of Salvation, TC? You claim to be in Christianity, so what IS what Jesus said to be born from above, born again? What is the ‘work’ God requires to receive God’s Spirit life in your dead human spirit?
Amen! Very similar to what happened to me in 1973, when a close friend got born from above and traveled all the way to Birmingham, AL to witness to me. He was visibly a changed man. I wanted what God had done with/to him, so I asked Jesus to save me, too. It happened that very same night within moments of sincerely asking Him directly. I was so moved that two weeks later I traveled up to East Tennessee to be baptized by the man who led my friend to Christ.
And there is one holy catholic apostolic church, built upon blessed Peter and the other Jewish Apostles and Prophets, with the Messiah (blessed be His name for all eternity) being the chief cornerstone, against which the gates of hell have not prevailed.
First John, Catholic chapter three, Protestant verses thirteen to twenty four,
as authorized, but not authored, by King James
I often state I was saved out of the gutter
The first reading in today’s Mass was from Acts 16. Poor Timothy. Ouch!
That’s great. Were you encouraged to read and study them or were they just there?
The priest gave a good homily on the Gospel reading, which was from John 15. A group of us met after Mass to reflect on where our treasure is, after reading Matthew 6:19-34 and study guides. One of our group is in the hospital, so we gathered in his room. He was looking forward to the meeting all week. A verse from the study guide really touched me: “The order of things must be subordinate to the order of persons, and not the other way around.” Sometimes we forget that people are more important than things.
Peace,
Rich
Thank you for your unbiased observations.
Even further...
1 Now these are the generations of the sons of Noah, Shem, Ham, and Japheth: and unto them were sons born after the flood.
2 The sons of Japheth; Gomer, and Magog, and Madai, and Javan, and Tubal, and Meshech, and Tiras.
3 And the sons of Gomer; Ashkenaz, and Riphath, and Togarmah.
4 And the sons of Javan; Elishah, and Tarshish, Kittim, and Dodanim.
5 By these were the isles of the Gentiles divided in their lands; every one after his tongue, after their families, in their nations.
6 And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan.
7 And the sons of Cush; Seba, and Havilah, and Sabtah, and Raamah, and Sabtechah: and the sons of Raamah; Sheba, and Dedan.
8 And Cush begat Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth.
9 He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD.
10 And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.
11 Out of that land went forth Asshur, and builded Nineveh, and the city Rehoboth, and Calah,
12 And Resen between Nineveh and Calah: the same is a great city.
13 And Mizraim begat Ludim, and Anamim, and Lehabim, and Naphtuhim,
14 And Pathrusim, and Casluhim, (out of whom came Philistim,) and Caphtorim.
15 And Canaan begat Sidon his first born, and Heth,
16 And the Jebusite, and the Amorite, and the Girgasite,
17 And the Hivite, and the Arkite, and the Sinite,
18 And the Arvadite, and the Zemarite, and the Hamathite: and afterward were the families of the Canaanites spread abroad.
19 And the border of the Canaanites was from Sidon, as thou comest to Gerar, unto Gaza; as thou goest, unto Sodom, and Gomorrah, and Admah, and Zeboim, even unto Lasha.
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