Free Republic

I was at the meeting also, and knew nothing about the question boxes until Moran stated that questions would be taken from the boxes instead of directly from the crowd. It really slowed down the process, since Moran had to read the name of the questioner from the paper and then wait for the person to respond and head for a microphone. After listening to Moran and Dean run their mouths for an hour and a half(at least Dean kept it short), there was little time left for questions.

I am Irish and I can tell you that it is not BS. Americans may find these facts hard to believe, but no one in Ireland doubts it. If you don’t believe me google ‘Artane’. These schools were not ordinary schools comparable to American public schools - they were institutional schools where children who were orphans or were delinquents were locked up for their entire childhood, from the time they arrived until being kicked out the gates at 16. The evidence is overwhelming and stomach-turning.

You couldn't be more wrong. Jockeys are incredible athletes. Try balancing on a metal bar and doing one squat per second for 2 minutes-then imagine doing it while trying to control a horse that is moving at 30 mph. They are not just "sitting there and steering". It may not look like they are doing much, but they are using every muscle in their bodies to move with the horse.

I once rode a friend's 2 yr old colt that was being trained for the track in a racing saddle and tried to gallop in the position that jockeys ride in. My thigh muscles were screaming within a few seconds, and I have ridden all my life. It is much, much harder than it looks.

I am curious, though, why he used the gun to hit the assailant instead of just shooting him with it.

I've read the replies above stating that the gun was fake. However, if the gun had been real, and the homeowner had used it to kill his assailant, there is a good chance that he would have been charged with murder under British law. A few years ago a British farmer named Tony Martin was convicted of attempted murder for shooting a burglar who had broken into his home(for the 2nd or 3rd time). He had been harassed by a gang of thugs for months, but when he defended his property, he went to prison. Britain has an astronomically high burglary rate, precisely because the robbers know that their victims are unarmed. Fair play to this man for defending himself!

Been there so many times I could give the tour meself - back when you could just walk up to it instead of the hassle you have to go through now.

I prefer Dowth, it is still in its natural state and very few tourists go there so you are usually the only person there. Not nearly as impressive however.

Irish people should be Roman Catholics.

Why? I'm an Irish Protestant(not C of I, BTW). My wish is that all Irish people would be devout Christians, of whatever denomination. The last few decades have seen a huge drop in active participation amongst all denominations, unfortunately.

Many of these singers were more popular in the USA than they were in Ireland

You're right about that. I remember strolling into a performance by Makem and Clancy in a hotel in Navan in the 80s. My friends and I had been having a session in the lounge bar. We left the bar, noticed that they were playing in one of the hotel banquet rooms, walked in and sat down. We didn't even pay to get in - they were finishing up, but they probably played for 15-20 minutes after we arrived. We thought it was good crack to see them perform, but it wasn't a huge crowd by any means, and was definitely on the wrinkly side. Now if it had been Big Tom performing (an Irish country/western singer) the place would have been packed to the rafters!

You are conflating Sinn Fein/IRA with Catholicism. Ian Paisley does not hate Catholics and never had a problem working with and for Catholics, he has been doing that for years as an elected official. He had a problem recognising SF/IRA because they were an active terrorist organisation and refused to put their weapons down. Once they did that he kept his word and began working with them. Yes, the last 40 years did not have to happen, but the onus for it all belongs mostly on the terrorists and paramilitaries. if they had not gotten involved and turned a civil rights movement into a civil war this step could have been accomplished decades ago. Frankly, I find it deliciously ironic that what the last 40 years got SF/IRA is Paisley as First Minister. Not quite the result they had in mind.

First you posted that your great-grandfather was Irish, now it’s your grandfather. Which is it? Not that it matters - if you’re not born in Ireland, have never lived in Ireland, aren’t an Irish citizen, then you’re not Irish. Winston Churcill’s mother was an American. Did that make him an American? Hardly.

I suspect ,based on your defense of the IRA, that some money from your pockets has found its way into their coffers. Ever contributed to Noraid?

I can look at those numbers and realize their is significant crossover from the Catholic population

Absolutely.There are many Catholics who want to remain part of the UK. That's been my experience, certainly with middle-class Catholics - just as there are Protestants who would welcome a united Ireland. I'm surprised that the number for unification isn't higher than 23%, especially with the vastly improved economy in the Republic.

I don't like your tone ONE bit

Then you’re really going to hate mine.

I gave you examples of how the Catholics were denied rights, and you scoff at that and at the 1916 Uprising.

I’ve got news for you sunshine – the Irish have moved on. It’s not the 19th century anymore. You will never see an actual Irish person on these threads whinging on about the Famine or the Easter Uprising or the Penal Laws – but there are plenty of Irish American plastic paddies who do just that at the drop of a hat. Your rantings are so far removed from current realities in Ireland as to be laughable. You spout the usual 'Brits Out!' rubbish, but if that were to happen, the same problems would exist that do now - because the problems are between the Protestants and Catholics, and neither group is going anywhere. The only difference would be that the Republic of Ireland would be dealing with the nutjobs instead. And that's a task it has no desire to take on.

That shows your lack of knowledge about the History of Ireland

You do realize that elc grew up in Ireland, and has no doubt forgotten more Irish history than you will ever know? And, since we're talking about ignorance of history, Catholics got the right to vote in 1793, not at the end of the nineteenth century as you posted. Catholics (and Presbyterians) got the right to sit in Parliament in 1829. Looks like you’re the one who needs to learn some history

I think you are softhearted toward the Ian Paisley and his Orange murderers

Ian Paisley doesn’t have any “Orange murderers.” The DUP doesn’t have and never has had an illegal paramilitary wing at its back– unlike Sinn Fein. I’m sure you won’t believe this, but Ian Paisley is actually quite popular amongst his Catholic constituents, because he works for them and with them. He’s certainly opposed to Catholicism, but he does not hate Catholics. But since you hate him so much, it must really anger you that he is going to be First Minister in a few weeks. Thirty years of terrorism, and what did it get the IRA? Ian Paisley heading up the government, that’s what! Not quite the outcome they or their plastic pat fundraisers and gunrunners in New York and Boston expected, is it?

Never thought I'd live to see the day when Brownie and Big Ian would be rubbing elbows at Stormont and looking so chummy about it...makes me think the Second Coming is imminent...

Guess we won that round elc, since yer man did not respond to any of the facts you and I stated...see all the fun you're missing I_T!

Just curious, how would a massive minority of protestants change their society? I was under the impression that the Republic was fast becoming a secular society.

The issue is not religious per se, it is a matter of suddenly having to deal with the problems posed by a large group of people incorporated against their will into your country. That is why the Republic of Ireland is not too keen on a united Ireland, in spite of their official statements. The problems would be enormous unless the majority agreed to the change, and it would all be the Republic's problem, instead of being mainly the UK's problem as it is now. It would be like giving California back to Mexico, to draw a rough analogy - how happy would most of the Californians be about it? Not very.

No, the IRA killed 517. All republican paramilitary groups combined killed 738. Since we are talking stats, it pays to be exact. My numbers come from the Sutton Index of Deaths on the CAIN website - it contains crosstabulations of all deaths related to the Troubles. Well worth a visit for anyone interested in the topic. I would post a link if I knew how off the top of my head:)

Many more innocent civilians were killed by Loyalist Paramilitary Groups than by the IRA

The IRA is responsible for the single greatest number of civilian deaths, at 517. The closest loyalist paramilitary civilian death count is the UVF at 359. Even when civilian deaths are totaled by Republican Paramilitary versus Loyalist Paramilitary, the civilian death count for all the loyalist groups is only slightly higher, at 873 to 738 – and the reason is that there were at least 5 loyalist groups operating independently, whereas the IRA was responsible for the overwhelming majority of republican paramilitary civilian deaths. To claim as you seem to be doing that the IRA’s hands are not as bloody as the loyalist paramilitary groups is flat wrong.

Thanks for the ping - no surprise that DUP and SF have agreed to put off the date to go into government together. All is sweetness and light in the statements issued by Paisley and Adams, if they can maintain this attitude devolution will no doubt be a reality in May. The main issue left hanging is the water rates, and it's a good sign that something so mundane is the focus rather than sectarian squabbling.

Microchips in wheelie bins...if this weren't in a news article I would have a hard time believing it. The UK should take the funds they are wasting on this nonsense and spend it on the health care system, which is falling apart...apparently they literally have money to throw away.

fly-tipping is simply dumping your rubbish/trash by the side of the road. 'Tip' equates exactly to the US 'dump'.

Happy St. Patrick's Day to you and I_T, and would you tell him to catch himself on and get back on FR! I miss his pings!