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Keyword: southasia
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India has now come full circle — from a nation that was under a high-tech embargo for its nuclear weapons program to one receiving an invitation to join a group of nations that regulate export controls. President Barak Obama says the United States is ending its export restrictions on technology that could be used by India's defense and space industries, according to an article in the AFP. "These actions will open important new opportunities for our companies and governments on cooperating in the defense and space areas," said Robert Blake, the assistant secretary of state for South Asia. These are...
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At a recent event on Pakistan co-sponsored by Brookings and the U.S. Institute of Peace, several panelists cogently stressed the need for greater transparency on the parts of Washington and Islamabad as a necessary step in forging better relations. Inevitably, the sad story of Pakistan's F-16s emerged during a panel discussion. In the early 1980s, the United States agreed to sell Pakistan F-16 fighter jets. This decision was taken when the United States worked closely with Pakistan to repel the Soviets from Afghanistan. The F-16 was the most important air platform in Pakistan's air force and it was the most...
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Goodrich has won a $72 million contract to provide Pakistan with intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance pods and related items for its Lockheed Martin F-16 fighters. The main component of the deal comprises five dual-band DB-110 pods, says the US Department of Defense. According to Goodrich, the DB-110 reconnaissance sensor provides three independent optical fields of view, allowing it to perform the following ISR missions: long-range stand-off, medium-range oblique and overflight, and low-altitude direct overflight. The deal also includes two datalink upgrades to existing pods, plus ground stations, spares, manuals, in-country installation and engineering support. "This supports a Foreign Military Sale...
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In the second such incident within 30 days to possibly probe India's air defence network along the J&K border, Pakistani military aircraft virtually violated Indian airspace in the R S Pura sector near Jammu on Wednesday. Sources said BSF ground-based mobile observation posts spotted two Pakistani ''light military aircraft'' cruising along the border on Wednesday, with some reports even holding the planes actually crossed over into Indian airspace for some time to fly over four Indian border posts. Even if the aircraft did not actually enter Indian airspace, the incident clearly violates the two decade-old agreement between India and Pakistan,...
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India on Thursday said it will continue to take up the issue of Pakistan diverting American military aid against it with the US till the time there is a "final solution" to the problem. Defence Minister A K Antony said the past experience and track-record shows that instead of using the American military aid in the fight against Taliban, Pakistan is diverting it against India. "This is a matter of serious concern. We have already conveyed it to them (US) and continue to do so until and unless we find a final solution," he said when asked if India had...
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Security Pact Remains U.S.-India Sticking Point The Indian air force is exploring upgrade options for U.S. military aircraft that will be handed over without key capabilities in the absence of an agreement governing those systems. The U.S. is withholding several subsystems until India ratifies the Communication Interoperability and Security Memorandum of Agreement, which governs current and future transfers of intelligence systems to India. India is not ready to commit to the security pact and instead is willing to take slightly less capable U.S. systems initially, expecting to backfill the missing features later. The strategy will be tested when the Indian...
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India is co-developing and building missiles and military aircraft with Russia; it is co-developing missiles with Israel. But targeted American sanctions, and a Washington licence raj that stifles the outflow of military technology, has ensured that India's Defence R&D Organisation (DRDO) has never co-developed weaponry with the world's most evolved and high-tech defence industry - that of the United States. The US, in turn - even while selling billions of dollars worth of military aircraft to India - has failed to mine the richest lode of the Ministry of Defence (MoD): Joint development contracts like the Indo-Russian Fifth Generation Fighter...
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US President Barack Obama prepares to visit India, a prominent think tank has said that the two countries would build their strong bilateral defence ties based on the new strategic realities of Asia. The defence relationship is one of the many bright spots in the overall bilateral relationship, said the National Bureau of Asian Research (NBR), a Washington-based think tank. "It is expected that the United States and India will continue to develop a strong bilateral defense relationship, albeit one that looks less like an alliance than a partnership based on shared goals. The US and Indian armed forces will...
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Given the global buzz around the Indian Air Force’s (IAF’s) ongoing $10-billion procurement of 126 medium multi-role combat aircraft (MMRCA), my suggestion to scrap the process and, instead, go in for a straight buy of Lockheed Martin’s F-35 Lightening II fighters is admittedly radical. But consider this: when the F-35 enters service, a couple of years from now, it will comfortably outclass every one of the six fighters that the IAF is currently evaluating. Thereafter, through the entire 30-40 year service life of the selected MMRCA, the IAF will fly a second-rung fighter when it could have gotten the best....
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"I am a contented man. My childhood dream has been fulfilled," gushed President A P J Abdul Kalam after his 30-minute joy ride in the rear cockpit of a fighter aircraft (SU-30 MKI Flanker) on Thursday. This feat has made the President the oldest Indian to fly a fighter aircraft. As he was helped out of the aircraft by "co-pilot" Wing Commander Ajay Rathore, after it touched base at the Lohegaon Air Force station, the President's eyes gleamed with excitement. So affected was Kalam by the experience that he kept smiling with childlike glee. Clad in the flying gear of...
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As part an upgrade and to evolve new tactics in aerial warfare, Indian Air Force’s (IAF’s) Gwalior-based Tactics and Air Combat Development Establishment (TACDE) will for the first time receive frontline fighters Sukhoi-30MKI by the end of this year. Gwalior is essentially a base for French Mirage-2000 fighters. TACDE is an aerial warfare training institution which devises combat tactics for its top 1% fighter pilots. The Sukhois will replace MiG-27s, which will go back to their original bases in Kalaikunda, Hashimara and Bagdogra in the east. A source said the new Sukhois being manufactured by Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) will...
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The 1971 Indo-Pak War was over and the Pakistan Air Force did not perform as well as in the 1965 war with India. The American technology which our brave pilots and engineers had absorbed and put to its maximum performance in the previous war let us down in the 71 War. The Korean vintage F-86 Sabers, F104 Star Fighters and B-57 Bombers along with their Missiles and Avionics Suites had out-stretched their operational lives and were now lingering along in our inventories to be counted in numbers. All the smart alecks on the payroll of the PAF in the mid...
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F-16 aircraft to the Government of Pakistan from the United States during an induction ceremony today at Shahbaz Air Base near Jacobabad, Pakistan. "The induction of these advanced F-16s is a historic milestone for U.S.-Pakistan relations - both a symbolic and tangible demonstration of our strong partnership and the U.S. intent to stand beside Pakistan over the long-term as an important ally and friend," said Amb. Anne Patterson, U.S. Ambassador to Pakistan. "These aircraft underscore the promise made by the United States to support Pakistan to achieve our mutual goals of defeating violent extremists and establishing peace and security." U.S....
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President Obama fired his commander in Afghanistan after the general and his staff made intemperate comments about administration officials that appeared in a magazine article. But what was behind the disparaging comments? They may be symptomatic of a deeper frustration with the conduct of the U.S. effort in Afghanistan. By themselves, the comments by General Stanley McChrystal and his aides, made in the presence of a reporter from Rolling Stone magazine, are harsh. One aide calls National Security Advisor General James Jones a clown. Another rude comment is directed at Vice President Biden. General McChrystal himself speaks disparagingly of special...
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Adding potency to PAF’s fleet, three most modern F-16 aircraft would be inducted at the newly upgraded base under the Southern Air Command of the country on Sunday.Delivery of Block-52 type of F-16 aircraft, especially designed to ably meet with the country’s present and future needs is a part of goodwill gesture by the United States.Pakistan is the second country after Israel to get these state of the art aircraft from the US. Total 18 aircraft, equipped with Modern Electronic Warfare gadgets like Sniper Pods, Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance (ISR), Threat Warning System (TWS), Beyond Visual Range missiles, and Night...
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China will reportedly make a statement on its decision to supply two more nuclear reactors to Pakistan during the meeting of the Nuclear Suppliers Group this week in New Zealand . The Indian government has suggested it will be trying to call Beijing's bluff by exposing the underlying flaws in China's argument in support of such a deal. New Delhi has also made its reservations known to Beijing through diplomatic channels. But should it really come as a surprise that China is trying its best to maintain nuclear parity between India and Pakistan? After all, this is what China has...
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India’s military might is expected to take a big leap early next year when it test-fires the over 5,000-km-range nuclear-capable Agni-V missile. Agni-V is the country’s most ambitious strategic missile project, and a successful culmination of the test stage will propel the country into an elite club of ICBM-capable nations. ``Work is progressing satisfactorily on the development of Agni-V, which is expected to become a reality next year. With this, the DRDO would have given India a comprehensive indigenous strategic capability, available with only a few nations of the world,’’ DRDO chief V K Saraswat remarked while speaking at the...
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Pakistan's arms supply relationship with North Korea dates back to 1971 when the late Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, then foreign minister under the late General Yahya Khan, visited Pyongyang and sought North Korean arms supplies to strengthen the Pakistani armed forces in the face of a looming war with India. Pakistan then did not have diplomatic relations with North Korea. The visit led to the signing of an agreement on September 18, 1971, 10 weeks before the outbreak of the war with India, for the supply of North Korea-made conventional weapons to Pakistan. Under another agreement signed the same day, the...
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With the Indian Air Force embarking on modernisation, the skies over different parts of the country will witness yet another high-profile test with evaluations of attack helicopters due to start this summer. Seeking to get off the mark, Boeing is fielding the AH-64D Apache helicopter for the trials, Dean Millsap, regional director, Asia Pacific International Business Development, told a group of visiting Indian journalists here. Mr. Millisap said an IAF team was due to arrive in the United States and thereafter dates for the trials in different weather conditions would be finalised. Boeing is among the international companies that responded...
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A core group of US and Pakistani officials met and reviewed the status of American military equipment deliveries to Pakistan, including the new F-16 fighter aircrafts, aimed at strengthening the country's security capabilities, an official statement has said. The meeting that was held on May 5 in Rawalpindi, was co-chaired by Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary of State for Political-Military Affairs Thomas M Countryman, Deputy Director of the US Defense Security Cooperation Agency Jeanne Lynn Farmer, and Major General Nasir Mahmood, Additional Secretary, Ministry of Defense Production. Among recent developments, the Working Group discussed the April 30 delivery of US P-3C...
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India intends to integrate a variant of its Nirbhay long-range cruise missile on the Suhkoi Su-30MKI Flanker strike aircraft, following the weapon’s initial development in the ground-launch configuration. The addition of the Nirbhay to the Flanker’s weapons inventory would give the platform a long-range—and potentially strategic—strike capability. While details on the Nirbhay program remain scant, Indian officials have suggested the weapon will have a range of 800-1,000 km. (500-620 mi.). An air-launched derivative of the Nirbhay would be a candidate platform for the air force element of India’s strategic nuclear triad ambitions. Packaging of a warhead in the constrained space...
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India's defence minister cautioned the United States on Friday against military supplies to rival Pakistan, saying the hardware could be diverted to target India. The warning came after the US in March said it would deliver unarmed drones to Pakistan and less than a month after it unveiled plans to transfer 600 million dollars to Islamabad to pay for anti-militant operations. A. K. Antony told reporters in New Delhi that India's concerns had been conveyed to Washington. "Even though the US is giving equipment to Pakistan to fight against the Taliban, we feel there is every possibility of (Pakistan) diverting...
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The Pentagon on Thursday said Pakistan would decide when to move against extremists in North Waziristan and that it was not Washington's role to dictate timing of military operations in the country. US officials have long urged Pakistan to take its offensive against Islamist militants to North Waziristan, home to an array of extremists including Al-Qaeda and the so-called Pakistani Taliban. Revelations that a foiled car bomb plot in New York City may have been linked to the Pakistani Taliban have added fresh urgency to US requests for action by Islamabad in North Waziristan. Pentagon press secretary Geoff Morrell repeated...
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Eight experienced Pakistan Air Force pilots, who have flown the F-16A/B, recently learned to fly the newer C/D model aircraft at the 162nd Fighter Wings, international F-16 training unit at Tucson International Airport.The graduation ceremony will be held at Pima Air and Space Museum on Tuesday, May 4. Guest speakers include Air Marshal Waseem Ud Din, the Pakistan Air Force deputy chief of staff, and Brig. Gen. Lyn D. Sherlock, the director of regional affairs, Office of the Deputy Under Secretary of the Air Force for International Affairs. The pilots are the first to train in the US since the...
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The United States appears to have realised the importance of strengthening Pakistan’s conventional defence while also enhancing its capability to fight extremists. In doing so, senior US officials also recognised Pakistan’s concerns about India and conceded that Washington’s growing ties with New Delhi were a cause of concern for Islamabad. “We must continue to reassure Pakistan that as it combats the terrorist threat, it is not exposing itself to increased risk along its eastern border,” said Under Secretary of Defence for Policy Michele Flournoy while explaining why the United States needed to strengthen Islamabad’s conventional defence systems as well. “Although...
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The Pentagon says the impending sale of F-16 fighter aircraft to Pakistan is a sign of burgeoning relationship between the two countries, that has clearly been evolving week by week. "The F-16 sale is a sign of this burgeoning relationship between us and increased defense cooperation between our two countries. So the personnel that are going there in advance of the arrival of those planes is to assist the Pakistanis so that they can operate these sophisticated warplanes," said Pentagon spokesman Geoff Morrell. Morrell also noted the "great strides" made over the past few weeks to try to accelerate reimbursement...
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The United States will soon transfer 600 million dollars to Pakistan to reimburse the government for military operations against militants, the Pentagon said on Thursday. The move marked an attempt by Washington to address complaints from Pakistan over protracted delays in US payments, press secretary Geoff Morrell said. "There has been some concern on the Pakistanis' part about the rate at which they are reimbursed for coalition support funds for their efforts in the war on terror on our behalf within their borders," Morrell told reporters. "We have made great strides over the past few weeks to try to accelerate...
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The scheduled arrival of 50 additional U.S. military personnel to Pakistan in June, accompanying four new F-16 fighter jets, will increase the official number of American boots on the ground there by 25 percent. It is enough to make the Pakistani government shudder with trepidation. Exaggerated tales of U.S. soldiers and spies flooding the country are regular front-page fare in Pakistan, and cause for strident political criticism of Western intervention that sometimes erupts into violence. Pakistan's military and intelligence services remain highly suspicious about the motives and methods of their U.S. counterparts, a wariness mirrored in American attitudes toward Pakistan....
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The Pakistan Navy has rebuked reports that it is acquiring an over 30-year old guided missile frigate from the United States for a whopping 64.77 million dollars, saying Pakistan would be getting the warship free of cost. A Pakistan Navy spokesman said that the transfer of USS McInerney, a Oliver Perry class frigate, is being done under the Foreign Military Funding, according to which Pakistan would ‘not have to pay a single dollar for the frigate.’ The naval frigate will be handed over to Pakistan on August 31 following which it would be refurbished according to the Pakistan Navy’s requirements...
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The United States has assured India that it is keeping a close watch on the weapons supplied to Pakistan and, will investigate if there is any 'misuse' of the weapons tramsferred to Islambad. Buzz up!Addressing reporters in New Delhi, US Ambassador to India, Timothy Roemer, said:"There are allegations of misuse of weapons given to Pakistan for other purposes. We will investigate it, Congress will take the issue seriously." The American assurance came just days after Indian Prime Minister Dr. Manmohan Singh met US President Barack Obama on the sidelines of the Nuclear Security Summit in Washington, where he reportedly expressed...
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Last February, in a speech at the annual Munich Security Conference, NATO Secretary General Anders Fogh Rasmussen argued that the Alliance should turn into a consultation forum for global security issues. Such a role, he argued, would require the transatlantic security alliance to develop closer relations with all major global players, including India and China. Only a few years ago, any mentioning of India and China as potential NATO partners would have led to raised eyebrows not only in Delhi and Beijing, but also in many NATO member countries. Not this time. In the days just after the Munich conference,...
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The armies of India and Pakistan are mobilising for separate large-scale war games on either side of the international border this month to experiment with concepts they will employ in the event of a war with each other. Each side has informed the other — as is normally done in peace time — that it is conducting military exercises near the international boundary and that the movement of troops, tanks, guns and fighter aircraft is not a sign of aggressive intent. Pakistan Air Force combat aircraft landed on and took off from a motorway on Saturday in an exercise named...
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Pakistan is scheduled to get 18 of the Block 52 F-16 fighter aircraft and Oliver Hazard Perry Class frigate from the US by fall, and is expected to receive Shadow Drones within a year, a Pentagon official has said. Islamabad is set to receive all this military help under the enhanced US-Pakistan strategic cooperation. "I would like to think that we would get them (Pakistan) within the year," the official said on Tuesday. "Shadow (drone) is one of the things that they had asked for, and as we expanded and talked about other UAV platforms to be able to use...
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American aerospace giant Lockheed Martin has assured India that the F-16s being offered to it would be "much more advanced" than the fighters provided to Pakistan. "I can assure you, the Super Viper is much more advanced in all aspects than the F-16s being given to Pakistan," Lockheed Martin's Vice President-Business Development (India) Orville Prins told a group of visiting Indian journalists here on Monday. The assurance comes in the wake of reports that India was concerned over US supplying a new set of F-16s to Pakistan, a decision which could be a crucial geopolitical factor when the Indian Air...
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Lockheed Martin, the American aerospace specialist on Monday said the F-16 aircraft being offered India would be “much more advanced” than the fighters provided to Pakistan. Speaking to visiting Indian journalists in Dallas, Texas, Orville Prins, Vice-President, Business Development (India) said, “I can assure you, the Super Viper is much more advanced in all aspects than the F-16s being given to Pakistan.” Mr. Prins' assurance comes in the wake of reports that India was concerned over the U.S. providing Pakistan with a new set of F-16 aircraft, a decision which could be a crucial geopolitical factor when the Indian Air...
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As the Pakistan-US strategic dialogue and its accompanying hype wound down in Washington, US briefed India about the content and scope of the discussions between the two sides. US national security adviser, Gen Jim Jones called up Shivshankar Menon, national security adviser, to bring him up to speed on the talks, while US undersecretary William Burns briefed his counterpart, Nirupama Rao. Specifically, the conversations were intended to allay any Indian apprehensions of “secret” understandings reached with Pakistan. As the joint statement made clear, there was no reference to India or Kashmir in the document. Even on the water issue, the...
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The prospect of a nuclear deal for Pakistan gives India less sleepless nights than the fact that the US, in an attempt to "incentivise" Pakistan, is piling on sophisticated military equipment that have little to do with counter-terrorism but more to do with targeting India. With the first lot of 18 F-16C/D Block 50/52 combat aircraft due to be delivered in the next few months, India is raising the diplomatic pitch against the transfer of such equipment to Pakistan. While defence minister A K Antony has articulated these concerns, this has been the subject of a lot of diplomatic traffic...
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The Indian Army is arming its infantry soldiers with a medium range loitering missile that can strike at a target after hovering over it for 30 minutes and sending in critical data on the enemy installation. The army has issued an open Request for Information (RFI) to major global defence companies seeking to know if they can supply a missile system with such operational characteristics. "The RFI has been issued earlier this month. The loitering missile is basically an unmanned aerial vehicle which can transmit data after hovering over a target undetected for about half-an-hour and later self-destruct on the...
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The Obama administration is trying to play catch-up in its relations with the country that could become its most important long-term ally. But it may be leaving it too late, after India last week agreed a $7 billion deal in arms, nuclear reactors and space technology with Russia. India's strategic importance can hardly be exaggerated. More than just the other Asian economic giant after China, India is a democracy where English is an official language. It shares with Washington the same love-hate attitude toward China, hopeful but deeply suspicious at the same time. And with a much healthier demographic profile...
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): With an eye to develop a full fledged multi-layer Ballistic Missile Defence system, India is likely to test-fire its indigenously designed and developed Advanced Air Defence (AAD) missile from the Integrated Test Range (ITR) off Orissa coast today. The AAD missile is capable of destroying any hostile ballistic missile at low altitude situation, defence sources said on Saturday. Range integration work at the ITR for the proposed trial is complete and the test is likely to be conducted today, they said. The target missile, a modified indigenously built 'Prithvi' posing as an enemy missile, would first be lifted off...
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India and US will hold another joint military exercise called “Shatrujeet” focusing on counter-terrorism, in California next month, a media report said. Indian soldiers numbering around 150-200 will soon be leaving for US to take part in the exercise from April 1 to 19; the Times of India quoted defence ministry sources as saying on Thursday. India had hosted the largest-ever ground combat exercise with US, called `Yudh Abhyas', at Babina last October, where US had showcased its Stryker infantry armoured vehicles and Javelin anti-tank guided missiles (ATGMs) during the combat manoeuvres. The deployment of the Stryker armoured fighting alongside...
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India signed a deal with Russia on Friday to buy 29 MiG-29 fighter jets, further cementing Moscow's role as New Delhi's principal arms supplier, the plane maker said. "According to the contract, supplies will start in 2012," said Mikhail Pogosyan, the general director of both Russian plane makers RAC-MiG and Sukhoi. He estimated the value of the deal at around 1.5 billion dollars. The deal is on top of 16 MiG-29 planes New Delhi already agreed to buy for deployment on an aircraft carrier it also hopes to obtain from Russia. Pogosyan was part of a large business delegation accompanying...
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Pakistan's navy successfully test-fired a series of missiles and torpedoes Friday in what it called a message to "nefarious" forces — an apparent reference to longtime rival India. While the two nuclear-armed neighbors have taken slow steps toward restarting peace talks, they also have a history of using weapons tests as a form of diplomatic saber-rattling. The tests occurred in the Arabian Sea and employed various aircraft, submarines and ships. It was not immediately clear if the missiles were capable of carrying nuclear warheads. Both countries regularly test their missile systems, and usually notify each other ahead of such launches...
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A Pennsylvania woman known to authorities as "Jihad Jane" was charged with conspiracy to provide material support to terrorists, conspiracy to kill in a foreign country, making false statements to a government official and attempted identity theft. The indictment, unsealed Monday, charges that Colleen R. LaRose, and five unindicted co-conspirators recruited men on the Internet to wage violent jihad in South Asia and Europe, and recruited women on the Internet who had passports and the ability to travel to and around Europe in support of violent jihad.
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Pakistani air force joins U.S. counterparts in joint maneuvers over North America using the F-16 Fighting Falcon in late 2010, sources said Monday. Sources to the Pakistani newspaper The National said U.S. and Pakistani teams would participate in defense maneuvers in the United States. "The joint exercises have been planned in the wake of the quality performance of the Pakistani air force in air raids in the tribal areas as part of the war on terror as well as the recognition of its air power in South Asia," the source said on condition of anonymity. Pakistani military officials said air...
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Government expressed serious concern over the US equipping Pakistan army with modern weapons and asked Washington to ensure that they were not used against India. "United States decision to provide sophisticated weapons (to Pakistan) is a matter of serious concern to India. The US should ensure that these weapons are not targeted against India", Defence Minister A K Antony told reporters here Saturday. Noting that the issue had already been taken up with the US defence weapons, Pakistan , US, army Secretary during his visit to India recently, he said the American explanation that Pakistan army has to be strengthened...
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ndia and Pakistan held their first formal talks in 14 months yesterday, seeking to put their volatile relationship back on track after it was derailed by the devastating 2008 Mumbai attacks. Indian Foreign Secretary Nirupama Rao and her Pakistani counterpart Salman Bashir met for three hours in New Delhi for talks that offered little hope of a breakthrough, but carried vital importance for regional peace and stability. Arguments over the agenda and a brief exchange of fire between Indian and Pakistani border guards before the meeting augured badly for major progress, with the probable best-case scenario an agreement to keep...
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India successfully conducted its fourth, and final, pre-service test of its Agni III IRBM (Intermediate Range Ballistic Missile) on February 7th. The fifty ton, two stage, solid fuel missile reached an altitude of 350 kilometers before heading down towards its target. A 2006 test was a failure, but tests in 2007 and 2008 were successful, as was the latest one. Over a year ago, India began preparations for putting the Agni III into service. This missile has a 3,500 kilometer range. Currently, the Agni series consists of the Agni I, with a range of 700 kilometers, and the Agni II,...
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The Defence Minister Shri AK Antony today said the private sector will be allowed to play an increasingly greater role in the modernisation of the Armed Forces. Speaking at a meeting of the Consultative Committee attached to his Ministry on the subject ‘Ordnance Factories’, Shri Antony said Defence Public Sector Undertakings alone will not be able to meet all the requirements of the Armed Forces at the pace and time – frame envisaged by the Government. He however, ruled out corporatisation of the Defence arms industry saying “minus corporatisation, we will give more room to the private sector”. The Defence...
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When I heard the India Air Force Chief Air Chief Marshal P V Naik admitting last year that India lacks the air power to meet the myriad terror threats facing the country, I didn't blame him. He was and is still right. When you have identified adversaries in all geographical directions and just 29 operational squadrons in your air force, how can you claim to be a strong and sovereign nation? Can you protect all of your borders let alone airspace, cities and strategic installations? Can you even contemplate using the air force to launch a counter strike and a...
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