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Hitler's faith: The debate over Nazism and religion
Radio Australia ^ | 2012 | Samuel Koehne

Posted on 08/04/2018 5:36:48 PM PDT by CondoleezzaProtege

In 2012's debate between Cardinal George Pell and Richard Dawkins, Pell argued that Nazism and Stalinism were the "two great atheist movements of the last century." Dawkins responded that while Stalin was an atheist, Hitler was not.

However, they both agreed that Hitler represented the "personification of social Darwinism" (Pell) or that certain of what he tried to achieve arose "out of Darwinian natural selection" (Dawkins).

The divergence of opinion between Pell and Dawkins reflects deep divisions among historians themselves as to what the Nazis believed about religion.

The argument that the Nazis were pagans derives from the fact they arose from the ultra-nationalist volkisch movement in Germany, which had a bizarre range of esoteric and mystical religious notions. Hitler was certainly aware of the ideas of one of the most influential authors, Guido von List, who sought to rediscover the lost wisdom of the "Armanen," supposedly a high-caste of the priesthood of the pagan god Wotan (or Odin). He proposed to do so principally through runes and Norse poetry like the Edda.

When the Nazis first celebrated Christmas in Munich (in 1920), they did so as a solstice celebration...

In one of the most complete speeches we have of Hitler's from 1920, he made direct references to some of List's concepts and argued that all Aryans built "cults of light" wherever they had founded civilisations in the world...

In the same speech he disparaged the Bible as too Jewish... Yet at the end of August 1920, he argued the Nazis "supported every Christian activity" and promoted Nazism as a "gospel of German revitalization."

Hitler did voice a great deal of support for an "Aryan" Christ, generally a figure who fitted completely with his own agenda: a violent anti-Semite named Jesus.

(Excerpt) Read more at abc.net.au ...


TOPICS: History; Religion
KEYWORDS: dawkins; nazi; pagan; pell
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1 posted on 08/04/2018 5:36:48 PM PDT by CondoleezzaProtege
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

The paper hanger was a big fan of the Vrill


2 posted on 08/04/2018 5:40:25 PM PDT by BenLurkin (The above is not a statement of fact. It is either satire or opinion. Or both.)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege
Hitler believed he was sent by God to rule the world. That "god" was whatever Hitler thought he should be.

National Socialism was simply Communism for homosexuals. They despised Judaism because of their laws prohibiting sex outside of marriage between a man and a woman. They preferred the Greek notion of the body being beautiful and using it for sexual gratification.

3 posted on 08/04/2018 5:43:25 PM PDT by MuttTheHoople (65 and 12)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thule_Society


4 posted on 08/04/2018 5:44:44 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy (The MSM is in the business of creating a fake version of reality for political reasons.)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege
Hitler's religion wasn't anything I'm familiar with.


5 posted on 08/04/2018 5:49:53 PM PDT by Sirius Lee (In God We Trust, In Trump We MAGA)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

Hitler wasnt Christian thats fer damn sure.


6 posted on 08/04/2018 5:50:26 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: Secret Agent Man

Hitler appropriated any religious or cultural icons as needed, but it was always filtered the lens of National Socialism.


7 posted on 08/04/2018 5:53:53 PM PDT by Arkansas Toothpick
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To: Arkansas Toothpick

Yup, just really paper thin veneers but socialism under it all.


8 posted on 08/04/2018 5:54:40 PM PDT by Secret Agent Man ( Gone Galt; Not averse to Going Bronson.)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege
The following day was MidSummer's Day and Rosenberg proudly announced that he would take us to see the new Nazi version of the Festival of the Solstice in Lübeck's ancient fortress. There, on the circular roof of the ancient keep, stood a circle of identical Hitler Youths, shoulder to shoulder, all of them exactly the same height and shape, fair hair, blue eyes, dressed in their pale khaki shirts and shorts, 'totally Aryan'.

The battlements now echoed, with centuries-old pagan litanies chanted by the circle of Aryan boys. At midday there was a shadowless silence as the sun hung for a moment directly overhead, and then a paean of praise rang out for the Aryan sun-god. The whole performance had been in deadly earnest.


- The Ultra Spy, by FW Winterbotham describes his time pretending to be a Nazi sympathizer before the war broke out.
9 posted on 08/04/2018 5:56:06 PM PDT by \/\/ayne (I regret that I have but one subscription cancellation notice to give to my local newspaper.)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

Hitler never denounced Christianity, but I’ve seen no evidence he ever practiced the faith.


10 posted on 08/04/2018 5:56:39 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: MuttTheHoople
National Socialism was simply Communism for homosexuals. They despised Judaism because of their laws prohibiting sex outside of marriage between a man and a woman. They preferred the Greek notion of the body being beautiful and using it for sexual gratification.

LOL! I agree and can't wait for someone to write a thesis about that.

11 posted on 08/04/2018 5:57:13 PM PDT by VeniVidiVici (All Democrats have to offer is violence, intolerance, divisiveness and hatred.)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

Dinesh D’Souza addresses this in his new movie out this weekend - “Death of a Nation”.

The gist is that Hitler gave lip service to Christianity publicly for political reasons, while privately he criticized it, and planned to do away with it. “Everything within the State, Nothing outside the State” was a Fascist maxim.

When Hitler’s power was consolidated, he did significantly undermine churches, seize properties and imprison clergy. He cracked down hard on Judasim, but Christianity was further down on his hit list. He never did get around to completing his whole program.

By the way, Dinesh D’Souza’s movies are always informative, and this one was too. He is getting better at making movies, with each succeeding one.


12 posted on 08/04/2018 6:00:04 PM PDT by BeauBo
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To: MuttTheHoople
Hitler believed he was sent by God to rule the world. That "god" was whatever Hitler thought he should be.

Why Hitler and Hillary are so similar:

The following is an account as told to Washington Week by Lurleen Stackhouse, who approached President and Mrs. Clinton at the pre-inaugural prayer service held at the AMEC church in Washington D.C., on Inauguration Day (1993):

"When the service concluded we were asked to stay seated until the President and Mrs. Clinton departed for the White House. However, as they walked down the aisle I stood and reached out for Mr. Clinton. `Mr. Clinton, America must stop killing babies.` He looked at me with a blank stare on his face. I repeated this statement to him.

"Hillary (not hearing my comment) then came to give me a hug and I said (in a voice only audible to her), `Hillary, it's against God's law to kill babies.` She stepped back, shaking and trembling, and then grabbed my arm. Her countenence transformed from a pleasant demeanor to the appearance of being possessed. Her eyes were enraged as she replied, `It is God's law to kill babies.`

"I drew back in shock at this blatant and revealing statement. I fully expected her to say, `It is God's law for women to have a choice,` or other pro-death rhetoric. But no, she was bold and blatant. I would not have believed it if I had not heard it with my own ears. I walked out with General Colin Powell. As the Clintons got into their limousine I approached the car. Through the glass I continued to plead with Mr. Clinton to stop killing babies. Again he had a troubled stare.

"But the killing will continue so long as there is no understanding among church people about holiness. It will continue song long as Hillary Clinton and company have their feminist agenda enforced. It will continue as long as Christains continue to be apathetic and non-resistant. It will continue until God released his hand of judgement upon our nation. But in the end it must stop. Until it does, the voice of unborn babies will cry out for justice."

13 posted on 08/04/2018 6:00:22 PM PDT by Slyfox (Not my circus, not my monkeys)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

http://religionandpolitics.org/2017/10/24/the-supernatural-pseudoscience-of-nazi-germany/

Hitler’s Monsters: A Supernatural History of the Third Reich
By Eric Kurlander
Yale University Press, 2017

“Some of the details in historian Eric Kurlander’s new study of Nazism and the occult, Hitler’s Monsters, sound more like plot points from a Captain America movie than facts from the historical record. Kurlander writes about Nazi scientists hunting for death rays, and about a government team that tried to suss out submarines using a map of the Atlantic and a metal cube on a string. SS officers studied runes, compared themselves to a Hindu warrior caste, and traveled to Tibet in the middle of the war, looking for a lost Aryan tribe. The second most powerful Nazi leader, Heinrich Himmler, was an avid reader of the Bhagavad Gita and had a personal astrologer. There were biodynamic farms at Dachau and Auschwitz.

This isn’t what Americans are accustomed to hearing about the Third Reich. We’re used to understanding Nazis as cruel automatons, and their regime as the horrific triumph of secular rationality and bureaucratic efficiency. Kurlander is documenting something zanier, more particular, and somehow more frightening. His book is a grim museum of Nazi exotica. But it’s also a reminder of the deep connections that sometimes appear between illiberal politics and certain kinds of occult or supernatural beliefs. And it’s the story of what can happen when a fragile democracy, under the strain of economic collapse and rapid cultural upheaval, sees its leadership abandon civic traditions, indulge in vivid fantasies, and lose any stable sense of reality.

Kurlander, a historian at Stetson University in Florida, starts this story in Vienna, in 1909, in the offices of a self-published occult magazine, Ostara. Even back in 1909, Kurlander writes, the little magazine was preoccupied with some now-infamous themes: “the importance of ‘Nordic’ blood purity and the dangers of racial miscegenation; the monstrous perfidy of the ‘Jew’; the deleterious effects of socialism, liberalism, and feminism; and the mystical power of the Indo-European swastika.”

Decades later, the publisher of Ostara, Jörg Lanz von Liebenfels, would claim that a young Adolf Hitler had shown up at his office and ordered back issues of the magazine. That story might be apocryphal. But the point stands: Somewhere in the borderlands of folklore, biology, science fiction, parapsychology, and occultism, a handful of fringe thinkers were cooking up a potent, and lethal, political brew.

Kurlander is far from the first scholar to note that Germany in the early twentieth century was a hotbed of unorthodox spiritual exploration.....


14 posted on 08/04/2018 6:05:44 PM PDT by Pelham (California, Mexico's socialist colony)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

He was a new-ager just like hilary.


15 posted on 08/04/2018 6:12:02 PM PDT by Migraine
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To: colorado tanker

I’m pretty sure he was raised a Catholic, and even sang in the choir.


16 posted on 08/04/2018 6:29:43 PM PDT by Calvin Locke
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To: Secret Agent Man

Two types of socialism. Like Bloods and Crips fighting over turf.


17 posted on 08/04/2018 6:35:45 PM PDT by reg45 (Barack 0bama: Gone but not forgiven.)
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To: Slyfox
Through the glass I continued to plead with Mr. Clinton

Is there video of that?

18 posted on 08/04/2018 6:38:21 PM PDT by wastedyears (The left would kill every single one of us and our families if they knew they could get away with it)
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To: CondoleezzaProtege

Unfortunately, the Left which owns history departments and Hollywood will never admit that WW-II was a religious war started by the pagan Nazis and Shinto Buddhist Japanese.


19 posted on 08/04/2018 6:57:24 PM PDT by fso301
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To: Calvin Locke; colorado tanker
I’m pretty sure he was raised a Catholic, and even sang in the choir.

He had no choice in who his parents were.

20 posted on 08/04/2018 7:00:36 PM PDT by fso301
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