'End Times' Religious Groups Want Apocalypse Soon (IT'S LATER THAN YOU THINK...)

The Los Angeles Times ^ | 6/22/06 | Louis Sahagun

[Quix]

You might recheck the contexts and the root meanings of the words.

[ccmay]

I'll buy you a drink in 2013.

-ccm

[ConservativeMind]

Nothing liberal about my stance.

You see, Christianity for 1950 years thought Christ could come at any time.

Only liberals would have the audacity to tell God that Christ has never been able to come back to date, and He can't for a number of years until we've been able to help Israel enough to rebuild the Temple.

So, you tell me if you are a liberal.

[Quix]

LOL.

Actually, I prefer iced tea and fruit juice.

Haven't (locally) been able to find a wine I like--low alcohol (3-6%) slightly sweet; fruity; low tanin.

[small voice in the wilderness]

Paul instructed Timothy to "Drink no longer water, but use a little wine for thy stomach's sake and thine often infirmities." -1Timothy 5:23

[Quix]

Only liberals would have the audacity to tell God that Christ has never been able to come back to date, and He can't for a number of years until we've been able to help Israel enough to rebuild the Temple.
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imho, some off-the-wall assumptions are inherent in the above statement.

1. We Pentecostal, Charismatic, Evangelical folks convinced that these are the end times are ACCEPTING GOD'S MESSAGES TO US in Scripture and otherwise. We are NOT telling God anything about such. We sit at His feet.

Where do you sit?

2. We read the Scripture in faith believing when Christ declares that The Father ALONE knows when Christ will return.

I don't know what kind of mental gymastics are involved to assume that we disbelieve such Scriptures.

3. We read the Scripture in faith believing when Christ declares that no one will know the day nor hour of His return. We do note that He also indicates that we should watch with discernment and know the season, perhaps the year because of HIS analogy with watching the skies to discern the impending weather.

I gather you rationalize such Scriptures away as having no particular value for our era.

4. I don't know that it's crystal clear IN SCRIPTURE about the timing of Christ's appearing in the air and saints being caught up to meet Him in the air. I could imagine it before or after the Temple is rebuilt.

I SUSPECT it will be after but LIKELY, THE FATHER ALONE KNOWS.

In any case, it could easily be a moot point. Thke Temple is evidently prefabbed and will even be assembled off site for quick dismantling and reassembly on the Temple Mount. Certainly it is clear that the Temple will be rebuilt in the same era wherein the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob return to the Covenant lands from the dispersion in 70 AD.

Certainly it is clear that the Temple will be rebuilt in the same era wherein the children of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob become a nation again in a day in 1948 precisely as Scripture predicted.

But perhaps you have some handy rationalizations for those rather plain Scriptures, too.

[Quix]

Correction--wrong word used.

I meant that prohibition--total abstinance--is not PREscribed in Scrpture except, perhaps for Nazarenes--those taking a Nazarene vow.

Otherwise, Paul's exhortation about wine for the stomach problems would be an error in Scripture.

[DaveMSmith]

According to Swedenborg, the Last Judgment took place in the spiritual world during 1756-1757 and the Lord's Second Advent was completed on June 19, 1770 with the publication of Swedenborg's Heavenly Doctrines which include the Internal or Spiritual sense of the Lord's Word.

The Word is written in representatives and correspondences beyond the literal sense. The Spiritual sense reveals the nature of the Lord, His heavenly Kingdom, His Church and the nature of man's spiritual life such as regeneration and preparation for the next life.

As far as the article, I think the whole state of Israel thing is way out of hand. I side with replacement theology in saying after Jerusalem was destroyed in AD 70, the nation of Israel was scattered and they became gentiles. Currently, the State of Israel is a large US political lobby who are liberal in the social politics and even if it is a democracy - elects nutjob PM's who want to destroy the planet -- because they fuel the HATE.

Swedenborg teaches that in the internal sense, the commandment thou shall not murder also refers to hatred, because hatred is continuous murder. Jesus taught the same in Matt 7:12 Therefore, whatever you want men to do to you, do also to them, for this is the Law and the Prophets. I realize there's enough hatred on both sides over there fueled by messiah prophecies wrongly interpreted IMO. The 'wars' in the Word refer to spiritual warfare - truth over falsity: I wish the US would stop fueling Israel's military.

Everyone will face their own Last Judgment in the next life. Theology and doctrine doesn't have to be sophisticated so long as we follow the Lord's commandments in Matthew:
37 Jesus said to him, "'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.'
38 This is the first and great commandment.
39 And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'
40 On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."

[ConservativeMind]

but LIKELY, THE FATHER ALONE KNOWS.

Uh, I believe those who have read Scripture have no doubt. Of course only our Father alone knows.

However, for everyone in Christ, anything having to do with the arrival of Christ should have absolutely no bearing on what we do or seek. We were always to follow God, and we are always to follow God. It's that simple.

The end times, in some form, have been in effect since Christ died. Christ could have come back at any time and still can--with or without some 'pre-fab Temple' that you suspect might be out there.

Bizarre.

[Jeremiah Jr]

Speaker: Kepha
Subject: Yeshua

Acts 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

Restitution / Tikkunim – Restoration of all things…

Deuteronomy 20:19 When you lay siege to a city for a long time, fighting against it to capture it, do not destroy its trees by putting an ax to them, because you can eat their fruit. Do not cut them down. Are the trees of the field people, that you should besiege them?

Fruit bearing trees are not cut down during wartime. Yeshua cursed the tree that had no fruit.

Matthew 16:4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign shall be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah.” And He left them and departed.

Wicked, self explanatory.
Adulterous, Jezebels table

The wicked are to be removed, there is no rapture.

[HonorInPa]

You claim that even Jesus does not know the time of His return. You must have a far different understanding of the Trinity than I - one divine being - Father Son & Holy Ghost.

[Quix]

Christ could have come back at any time
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Not congruent with how I read my Bible according to His own words.

But you certainly are free to see things your way!

[Quix]

Have long suspected that the wicked would be the ones removed.

Nevertheless, the Scripture about being caught up to meet Him in the air must also be fulfilled somehow at some fitting point in time.

[Junior]

I prophesy that the Sun will go nova in about 5 billion years and totally consume the Earth along with the other inner planets.

Just you wait and see!

[pcottraux]

But do most people drink just a little bit for their stomach's sake, or do they do it to get drunk?

[pcottraux]

I did. I'm still right.

[Quix]

So, then, you must judge St Paul to be wrong.

[pcottraux]

Yeah, I try to avoid doing that.

[Quix]

Yeah, I try to avoid doing that.
- - - - -

It's an automatic thing with your construction on that reality.


Either St Paul is wrong and made the New Testament a partial lie

or

you are wrong.

Can't really have it both ways on this issue. Paul was very clear.

[Calpernia]

That was an opera, right?