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Potheads, puritans and pragmatists: Two marijuana initiatives put drug warriors on the defensive
Townhall ^ | October 18, 2006 | Jacob Sullum

Posted on 10/23/2006 5:03:34 PM PDT by JTN

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To: robertpaulsen
If so, then you would agree that the BOR only applies to the federal government, leaving these issues (eg., guns/speech/religion) to the purview of the states?

I might entertain a debate on the issue in the proper context. It seems rather OT on this thread.

501 posted on 11/05/2006 7:10:27 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: robertpaulsen
If federal department A has to share dollars with federal department B, I'd be willing to bet good money they're in favor of eliminating department B.

They might be in favor of it based on arguments that department B is unnecessary.

I seriously doubt they'd support arguments of eliminating department B on grounds that it's claimed Constitutional authority is flawed if department A claims authority on the same basis.

502 posted on 11/05/2006 7:13:42 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic
SampleMan asked:

It is most likely in today's environment that you'll either get legal drugs and illegal guns/speech/religion or legal guns/speech/religion and illegal drugs.

What's your best case scenario?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Our rights to guns, speech, religion, intoxicating substances, consensual sex, and helmet-less motorcycle riding cannot be infringed.. - Even by a super-majority. -- That's the Law of the Land, not a 'scenario'.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Tacticalogic:

Best case scenario is that we get legal guns/speech/religion, and the drug question is left up to the States, where it belongs. --- Public health issues seem to have been intended to be the purview of the States."


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Naturally your answer gets the majority rule faction all aflutter, as it seems to agree that the BOR only applies to the federal government, leaving the issues of guns, speech, religion & drug prohibitions up to the states..

Would you agree that the 14th amendment must apply when States write legislation that regulates on life, liberty, or property?
503 posted on 11/05/2006 8:17:38 AM PST by tpaine
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To: tacticalogic
"They might be in favor of it based on arguments that department B is unnecessary."

Necessary. Unnecessary. Whatever. If department B goes, there's more money for department A.

"I seriously doubt they'd support arguments of eliminating department B on grounds that it's claimed Constitutional authority is flawed if department A claims authority on the same basis."

I'm in favor of reducing or eliminating departments even if they're constitutionally sound. Aren't you?

The bottom line is that government employees may favor a reduction in government and/or a reduction in government spending, as long as it's not their department.

504 posted on 11/05/2006 8:21:12 AM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: tpaine
Would you agree that the 14th amendment must apply when States write legislation that regulates on life, liberty, or property?

Generally, yes. Again, I think that whole discussion may be a OT on this particular thread, and would rather not open a door to having it hijacked to peripheral issues.

505 posted on 11/05/2006 8:39:36 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: robertpaulsen
The bottom line is that government employees may favor a reduction in government and/or a reduction in government spending, as long as it's not their department.

If they may, then they also may not, so the fact that they may is not the bottom line.

506 posted on 11/05/2006 8:41:13 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: tacticalogic

Then you have no problem changing your statement to, "I think (some) people who work for the federal government (may) have a conflict of interest when it comes to determining the appropriate limits of the power of the federal government"?


507 posted on 11/05/2006 9:02:24 AM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: robertpaulsen
Then you have no problem changing your statement to, "I think (some) people who work for the federal government (may) have a conflict of interest when it comes to determining the appropriate limits of the power of the federal government"?

Not based on any arguments you've submitted. "Appropriate limits of the power of the federal government" is not the same as "appropriate distribution of federal tax money". I'm not going to change my opinion about one based on arguments about the other.

508 posted on 11/05/2006 9:09:24 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: JTN

The initiatives are consistent with the spread of all manner of vice and crime i.e. perversion, adultery, perjury, greed, the giving and acceptance of bribes, treason, sedition etc. etc. No suprise if they pass.


509 posted on 11/05/2006 9:09:58 AM PST by AEMILIUS PAULUS (It is a shame that when these people give a riot)
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To: AEMILIUS PAULUS

You forgot gluttony.


510 posted on 11/05/2006 9:29:03 AM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: JTN
Nevada had better do something to distinguish itself in the face of ever expanding Native American owned/operated casinos appearing in nearly every state of the union.

No longer does one who enjoys the sin of "gambling" have to board a jet & fly to sin city, not when a little piece of sin city's in their own back yard.

Decriminalization -- I sincerely believe -- will be Nevada's only chance to continue attracting the hordes seeking to do all the things they cannot do anywhere else.

...time'll tell.

511 posted on 11/05/2006 9:30:05 AM PST by Landru (That does it, no sleep number for you pal.)
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To: Landru
Decriminalization -- I sincerely believe -- will be Nevada's only chance to continue attracting the hordes seeking to do all the things they cannot do anywhere else.
...time'll tell.

"Decriminalization' [which is just a return to the pre-prohibitional freedoms of our 19th century Republic] -- will be Americas answer to the big brother style 'Democracy' being practiced now by both political parties.. -- I sincerely believe.

512 posted on 11/05/2006 10:05:15 AM PST by tpaine
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To: Landru
"Decriminalization -- I sincerely believe -- will be Nevada's only chance to continue attracting the hordes seeking to do all the things they cannot do anywhere else."

Right on! And if that doesn't do it, I say they should legalize heroin and cocaine.

I mean, c'mon. We have a tourism industry at stake here!

513 posted on 11/05/2006 1:21:04 PM PST by robertpaulsen
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To: robertpaulsen
"Right on! And if that doesn't do it, I say they should legalize heroin and cocaine."

Sounds like you agree with my prediction the deriection NV pols will take if they [ever] get desperate enough, bob.

"I mean, c'mon. We have a tourism industry at stake here!"

Yea.

...they do. ;^)

514 posted on 11/05/2006 2:08:45 PM PST by Landru (That does it, no sleep number for you pal.)
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To: tpaine; robertpaulsen
"Decriminalization' [which is just a return to the pre-prohibitional freedoms of our 19th century Republic]..."

Yea.
That's what it is, in reality and "legally", alright.
So what.

It'd happen in the one *spot* in the entire nation where antisocial behavior's already expected, the "anything goes" mentality necessary to entertain a legalization/decrim effort abounds and there wouldn't be a lot WA could do, would there.

LV Jaycees like to say, "What happens in Las Vegas, stays in Las Vegas." & they'd sure have a splendid opportunity to prove it if their backs were against the way?
If legalizing/decrim'g certain dope was the difference between LV et al continuing to prosper, or, turning into a ghost town.
Wanna guess what direction the Nevada taxpayer will direct their politicians to go -- all of 'em -- & to hell with yours or anyone else's legal and/or moral argument(s).

"...-- will be Americas answer to the big brother style 'Democracy' being practiced now by both political parties."

We Yanks are *creative*, huh.
Always been weird like that here in the good ol' USA trying to live with her dichotomies, paradoxes & contradictions.
Ain't it great.

Americans do what they want to do.
When American's properly motivated get outa the way *&* to hell with the Constitution, BoRs or anything else impeding their pursuit of a buck. {~now there's a surprise}

Besides, they got the guns & *want* the money, Professor. :o)

"I sincerely believe."

HA!!
Right.

tpaine on one side & robertpaulsen on the other.
Jesus, is it a full moon or what.

Why one'd think given how fast the two never fail to show up on these threads they're one in the same.

...God forbid.

515 posted on 11/05/2006 2:37:57 PM PST by Landru (That does it, no sleep number for you pal.)
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To: eleni121
I don't want THC users living next door to me or my kids. Or anywhere in my neighborhood.

So, you're OK with living in an enclave of drunkards, as long as they don't use pot, or do you favor a return to Prohibition like we had in the past?

516 posted on 11/05/2006 2:50:14 PM PST by Aarchaeus
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To: USNBandit
<...the pro-dopers (sic) were dealt a blow right before the election. A journalist from the Las Vegas newspaper got killed by a driver who was stoned out of his gourd.

The journalist's death was not caused by the smoking of marijuana. It was because somebody was "driving under the influence of..."

Different crime, different law.

517 posted on 11/05/2006 2:55:17 PM PST by Aarchaeus
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To: Landru
Decriminalization -- I sincerely believe -- will be Nevada's only chance to continue attracting the hordes seeking to do all the things they cannot do anywhere else. ...time'll tell.

"Decriminalization' [which is just a return to the pre-prohibitional freedoms of our 19th century Republic] -- will be Americas answer to the big brother style 'Democracy' being practiced now by both political parties.. -- I sincerely believe.

"I sincerely believe." HA!!
Right.
tpaine on one side &
'he who must not be named' on the other.
Jesus, is it a full moon or what.

Why one'd think given how fast the two never fail to show up on these threads they're one in the same.
...God forbid.

I work for our Constitutional freedoms, not against them, -- so I gotta be fast..
Unfortunately, I'm loosing a lot of races these days to FR's young whippersnapper prohibitionists. -- It's hell to get old.

518 posted on 11/05/2006 2:57:39 PM PST by tpaine
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To: Landru; y'all

Speaking of 'sides' to take.


Goodbye Justice, Hello Happiness
Address:http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1732867/posts


519 posted on 11/05/2006 3:29:08 PM PST by tpaine
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To: JTN

The Puritans, as best I can tell, were users of wine, beer and distilled spirits. Wish folks could stop knocking those Puritans with a zillion petty slanders that are all absent of any real history.


520 posted on 11/05/2006 3:40:54 PM PST by bvw
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