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Soaring soyabean price stirs anger among poor(enviros: the enemy of the masses)
FT ^
| 01/18/08
| Raphael Minder, John Aglionby, and Jung-a Song
Posted on 01/17/2008 11:35:09 PM PST by TigerLikesRooster
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To: Rummenigge
Tell me again how option trades are a positive sum trade.
61
posted on
01/23/2008 6:58:35 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
Now first you tell me where on earth you saw a trade that is zero sum. (That’s why traders trade isn’t it ?)
62
posted on
01/23/2008 7:28:35 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: Rummenigge
Now first you tell me where on earth you saw a trade that is zero sum. Futures and options trades.
63
posted on
01/23/2008 7:33:20 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Rummenigge
Then theres those trading the options to buy on a certain date on a cerain price. These guys make the most of the money nowadaysOption traders as a group do not make money. Is that clear enough for you?
64
posted on
01/23/2008 8:29:17 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
only that it means nothing if you are discussing the theory of weather or not the market for innovative financial products (nice name - it speaks to you) derivatives is driving the costs of the underlying goods or whatever is underlying.
And my sinister plan was to start a discussion on that.
65
posted on
01/23/2008 8:34:53 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: Rummenigge
derivatives is driving the costs of the underlying goods or whatever is underlying. You'll have to explain how that works. Last time I looked, the buyers and sellers of derivatives were in balance.
66
posted on
01/23/2008 8:38:46 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
And the emitting institutions ? Are making money - the faster the market the more.
And the hedge fonds - drive the market by having to buy after selling short - creating volatility thus driving the value of their options. (options are climbing on increased Alpha)
And if they are going long ? It’s getting to expensive to buy calls for the customers in real need for the underlying bean. So putting them on stock gets a cheaper alternative. Buying and selling increases with the hedge fonds in control of the cycles.
Volatility is expensive for those who have to buy a good.
Options are traded with high leverage and with borrowed money and with increasing speed - maybe it’s all meant to be symmetric but you can sell one side of the ballance and hold the other one and cover your debts from yesterday with the turn over of today because the derivative market is convex.
I have not understood all the details - but it all looks like a giant chain mail. (they are better the more complicated they are)
67
posted on
01/23/2008 9:11:57 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: Rummenigge
And the emitting institutions ? I'm not familiar with this phrase. Please explain further.
68
posted on
01/23/2008 9:14:21 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
69
posted on
01/23/2008 9:18:45 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: Rummenigge
The issuer of the option?
70
posted on
01/23/2008 9:26:23 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
look up SG3R3N - it’s a call option on the nickel future of the LME - emitted by societe generale.
71
posted on
01/23/2008 9:30:51 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: Rummenigge
The profits (if any) of the option seller is offset by the losses (if any) of the option buyer.
72
posted on
01/23/2008 9:32:33 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
then how come you have to buy for a higher price then you would be paid when you sold in the same moment ?
73
posted on
01/23/2008 9:33:57 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
To: TigerLikesRooster
Doing the bio-fuel boondoggle turns out to be not be such a smart holy cause.
74
posted on
01/23/2008 9:36:17 AM PST
by
AmericanVictory
(Should we be more like them, or they like us?)
To: Rummenigge
That’s a bid ask spread and it doesn’t change what I said.
75
posted on
01/23/2008 9:42:05 AM PST
by
Toddsterpatriot
(Why are protectionists so bad at math?)
To: Toddsterpatriot
It certainly is the nature of every deal between two people that the sum of money in their pockets remains the same.
76
posted on
01/23/2008 9:59:55 AM PST
by
Rummenigge
(there are people willing to blow out the light because it casts a shadow)
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