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Atzlan Native Community...?

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1 posted on 05/16/2008 6:15:16 AM PDT by george76
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To: george76

someone should have kept the Buffler offin his land. Sounds like he was just protecting his interests on his land.


2 posted on 05/16/2008 6:20:01 AM PDT by Vaquero (" an armed society is a polite society" Heinlein "MOLON LABE!" Leonidas of Sparta)
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To: george76
--sure does put this incident in a different light than anything I've seen in the Denver Pest or Rocky Mountain News--
3 posted on 05/16/2008 6:22:23 AM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the MSM tells you about firearms or explosives--NRA Benefactor)
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To: george76; girlangler

ping to follow up on buffalo killing creep.


9 posted on 05/16/2008 6:32:10 AM PDT by Grammy
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To: george76
From the Article...The guy had up a legal fence and the Bison kept knocking it down and doing other damage. The Bison kept intruding so he authorized people to come shoot them. I don't see a problem here unless he killed them on other people's land.

In a civil lawsuit filed in early March, Hawn claimed the Downare's bison walked all over his property.

"On numerous separate occasions, herds of buffalo have broken through the fence and stampeded onto the Property to graze on the grass. The damage that the defendants' buffalo have caused to the Property is staggering. The fences are damaged and/or destroyed in more than fifty locations. The bent poles and broken wire has compromised the integrity of the entire fence. Additionally, the Defendants' buffalo have killed hundreds of trees on the property, including many trees near to the home that Mr. Hawn had professionally installed within the past year."

The lawsuit also states that the bison "knocked the TV and satellite Internet dishes off line" and caused additional damage to solar panels.

The lawsuit states that Hawn had a legal fence around his property at the time of the trespasses.

25 posted on 05/16/2008 6:58:48 AM PDT by Malsua
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To: george76

It seems this Atzlan Native Community in Gardner, Colorado calls itsself the Turtle Tribe. On their website they state that they especially welcome the “Xicano tribe” which is a way some militant Chicanos spell it. So it seems they may be more La Raza, reconquista types than a real native american indian tribe. I wonder what the association was between Hawn and this suspicious sounding group?


33 posted on 05/16/2008 8:25:00 AM PDT by MtnClimber (Obama pledges to give every typical small town white family a possum sandwich)
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To: george76
Atzlan Native Community...?

aka the Advanced Guard to the Main Body (AGMB) in cold war military speak...

36 posted on 05/16/2008 8:36:26 AM PDT by TADSLOS (The GOP death march to the gravesite is underway.)
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To: george76

I guess in Texas it’s the rancher’s job to maintain fences for his animals, and in Colorado it’s the neighbors job. Ok, I can understand why the guy who moved there from Texas was frustrated by that, but you have to follow the law in the state where you live even if you don’t like it, and shooting a man’s cows is pretty low.

He must’ve known shooting them was totally illegal too, since he got a bunch of Mexican immigrants to do it instead of himself.


38 posted on 05/16/2008 8:38:36 AM PDT by CatherinePPP
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To: george76
Having read the entire Flume article, I construct in my own mind the following chain of events that appears to be logical from the article.

1) Jeff Hawn has had a problem with Buffalo intruding upon and damaging his property.
2) He has a fence on his property that is in dispute as to legal status, but was incapable of keeping the buffalo out.
3) Hawn had filed civil lawsuit against the principal owners of the buffalo and has received a countersuit.
4) Based upon his ownership of the land and his view of his rights, he invited an organized group to hunt / capture buffalo on his land and provided maps to show boundaries of same.
5) Law Enforcement investigators have found matching characteristics between rifle slug, cartridge casing and a personal rifle of Jeff Hawn.
6) The cartridge was found off of the landowner's property in Forest Service Land.
7) Buffalo carcasses have been found in many locations with majority off his property with death estimates scattered over an indefinite but several week period.
8) At the time of the actual hunt in question Mr Hawn was not at the property, however some of the earlier buffalo kills were clearly visible from his residence.

From this it looks to me that Jeff Hawn became impatient with the course of the lawsuit as his property continued to suffer damage and the buffalo owners could not or would not stop these incursions. He had killed at least 2 buffalo himself and there may be evidence pointing to suspicion of one kill off of his property.
He then opens his property to a non-professional group of hunters to remove the intruding buffalo by death or capture, providing same with property maps. When informed by [telephone?] that more money would be needed by this non-professional group, he responds with a single week timeline before he would hire others to remove the buffalo for a fee.

From the facts presented, it looks like these amateur hunters went 'off reservation' and killed outside the property line. This would probably make Mr Hawn civilly responsible for damages there but I don't see the criminal case for the hunter's actions especially since he was not present for the hunt. If he can be positively tied to making a personal kill off of his property, then under Colorado's 'free range' provisions he may be both civilly and criminally responsible.

In any case this appears to end up being a rather foolish and very expensive exercise on Mr Hawn's part. He will now be facing both criminal and civil proceedings as a 'foreigner' (Texan) in a Colorado Court with local adversaries. It would probably have been cheaper to maintain the document trail of damages for his civil suit already filed.

46 posted on 05/16/2008 9:02:58 AM PDT by SES1066 (Cycling to conserve, Conservative to save, Saving to Retire, will Retire to Cycle.)
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To: george76

Sounds like Hawn needs a decade or so in the slammer to further his knowledge of Colorado law, and get his attitude adjusted.

More money than good sense.


74 posted on 05/16/2008 3:14:41 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Jimmy Carter is the skidmark in the panties of American History)
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