'Tiger cage' display in Lower Burrell teaches brutal lesson about Vietnam War a four by 4 cage to live in for years ... severe torture methods were employed, such as rope bindings, irons, beatings, and prolonged solitary confinement
Posted on 08/21/2018 10:38:59 AM PDT by Zenjitsuman
Strange that this misfiled recording of a Vietnamese propaganda broadcast monitored and recorded by the CIA has just surfaced.
McCain got away with Keating 5 and self defined himself as a hero for his Vietnam service saying they never broke him. Of Course he denied he was as some of his fellow POW's called him the "Songbird".
(Excerpt) Read more at youtube.com ...
“I hate his guts but I won’t criticize a man for breaking under the torture that those communist bastards put any of them through.”
I’ll second that. Everyone has a breaking point and it doesn’t take very long.
I leave it to his fellow POW’s to judge him on that...they know what he went through and I don’t.
They were in tiger cages; he was on the top floor of the Hanoi Hilton. Judge for yourself which is which.
Recently some of my navy fly boy friends have stated that they used the same routes and tactics too long even though they were causing loses. Hard headed senior officers wouldn’t adapt. So McCain may not have told them things they didn’t know.
Sen. Jerimiah Denton, of blessed memory, when interviewed not only didn’t break, but blinked out the words torture in Morse code. I had the privilege of talking to the great admmiral and true war hero on talk radio once.
Ought to ship him back to Hanoi for brain surgery since he was so complimentary of the medical treatment he served as a POW
I heard this tape years ago.
McCain’s fellow POW’s know what he did what he did not do. I know quite a number of his fellow POW’s and they have never shared this information with me. Many of my friends say the same thing. Among military professionals, the general understanding is that the POWs lips are sealed. POW’s acknowledge that all of them broke under torture, and some of them made filmed statements.
Songbird did enormous damage to this country and got Obama elected with his feckless campaign!
Undoubtedly. He also may have played with their heads. Who cares, at this point? Sure, being a POW of VietNam was brave. Even if they take away your ability to command your frontal lobe. We are but animals with a gdly spark in us, after all. When I read his book, I understood he had said things he regretted but wasn’t able to control. One shot of certain drugs will do it, one bout of mental illness. It’s not my issue with the man, anyway.
“he’s dying.”
How do we know that is even true?
I do recall hearing or reading the part about the medical treatment, but not the part where he admitted to crimes against the Vietnamese people.
I don’t know if he was subjected to torture, it has been a long time. He may have suffered pain from his injuries, they may have mistreated him getting him out of the water and bringing to the hospital (Stepping on his broken arm, etc) or they may have tortured him before providing treatment.
As far as I know, he was never tortured. If that is the case, to give that kind of recording to the enemy under the threat of torture is not forgivable, IMO.
It has been quite a while since I educated myself on the details of his story, so I may not have it right.
I can’t condemn him on that myself. I don’t know the details, and they do. I respect whatever opinions they might have.
Goodness! I didn’t KNOW I could have picked and chosen!
Hmm. I had a bad feeling about the one where I got blown up a bit. Who do I see about filing for an arrears declination of mission? Would I have to give up the PH and disability or would that add to it, seeing I didn’t know I had a choice ( sarc, of course)?
The man is slime, but it is OK, my grandchildren will know.
Thank you for your service.
What I mean is that people choose to accept the offer to be fighter pilots, seals, army rangers, etc. It is these people who are often tortured because of their value and knowledge they have. A regular soldier has very little intel to offer. McCain also only got to be a fighter pilot because of his name. Ironically it was that name that made him a valuable target for torture.
Does all/any of that excuse “The Keating Five Episode?”
Not to mention the ‘back stabbings” of late.....
That is my understanding as well.
They had to develop their own code to determine when a man would talk and when a man wouldn’t. A one size fits all approach clearly didn’t work, and they knew it. (If the US Military didn’t think their Code of Conduct for POWs was unworkable, they never acknowledged it at that time.)
I am pretty well read on the POWs, and have connections via association to McCain (He was my CO at one point for a few months) and I know that they expected a man to resist where he could, and not judge him when he broke.
The inconsolable grief and guilt that men felt when they broke, even if it took extensive torture to do so, brings tears to my eyes just thinking of it.
Some men broke immediately under torture, some took time, and there were a few who died under torture rather than give in.
Heartbreaking and sad.
What a lonely ordeal that had to be, on the other side of the world, being told your country, your military, your girlfriend/wife, or your family has forgotten you.
From the accounts I have read as a POW, you had only your faith in God, your country, your comrades, and your family to keep you from the blackest of despair. (not necessarily in that order) That was why communication was so vital, and why they risked beatings, torture, and death to communicate with each other, to know they weren’t alone, to buttress each other.
To “Keep a steady strain” as the Navy puts it.
So, in that light, I leave it to the POW’s themselves to pass judgments. I can’t bring myself to do it.
That said, I can pass judgment on his performance as a public official, and my judgement is harsh and unforgiving. I will leave it at that.
>>Because I know myself would break under torture, I would never take a mission where capture by the enemy is a likely outcome. Only a person with an iron constitution should take such missions.
I agree. One of the reasons I chose submarine duty is that you either get back to port or you die quickly.
'Tiger cage' display in Lower Burrell teaches brutal lesson about Vietnam War a four by 4 cage to live in for years ... severe torture methods were employed, such as rope bindings, irons, beatings, and prolonged solitary confinement
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.