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Russia's sham referendums in Ukraine: What does it hope to achieve?
DW ^ | 9/21/2022 | Roman Goncharenko

Posted on 09/22/2022 11:21:30 AM PDT by marcusmaximus

Russia had already declared its intent in spring, and is now going ahead with plans to annex the territories it has occupied in the south and east of Ukraine on a fast-track basis. Simultaneous votes in the Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions have been scheduled from September 23 to September 27. In a speech on Wednesday, Russian President Vladimir Putin suggested that Moscow would recognize the results.

Just as it did with the Crimean annexation in 2014, Russia is making a point of appearing not to be involved. It was local Ukrainian politicians supported by the Russian military who announced the so-called "referendums." As in the case of Crimea eight years ago, the vote has been brought forward from a previously suggested date — that of November 4. Regional referendums are banned in Ukraine. Like in Crimea, there will be no independent election monitoring.

Yes' or 'no'

However, that is as far as the similarities go — there are far more differences.

Russian media are reporting that there will be regional differences. In Donetsk and Luhansk, the ballot will pose a single question, to be answered with a "yes" or a "no," on whether to join the Russian Federation.

In Kherson and Zaporizhzhia, three questions will be asked but only one "yes" or "no" answer will be possible: "Are you for secession from Ukraine, establishing an independent country and joining the Russian Federation?"

Voting will also take place in Russia, where hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians have fled since 2014. The majority of Ukrainian refugees, however — several million — have fled to regions controlled by Kyiv and abroad.

(Excerpt) Read more at dw.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: alexeibayer; dwspam; natoisasham; notasham; notmuch; putin; referendums; romangoncharenko; russia; shamwow; spamfrommucus; spamfromroman; spamwow; thisisembarrassing; ukraine; ukraineisasham; zottherussiantrolls
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To: PGR88

Whatever reasons for dimantling Russia are irrelevant because we are flat broke and in debt to our eyeballs. National debt stands at $31 Trillion and growing $3 to $4 Trillion each year. That is way bigger than our GDP. Which knucklehead besides Brandon wants to borrow more BILLIONS, add to the national debt and ship the money to Ukraine, the most corrupt country in Europe?

Have you got no decency Brandon?


121 posted on 09/22/2022 5:37:42 PM PDT by entropy12 (Trump & MAGA are the only road to kep USA viable.)
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To: Petrosius

Is this why Zelensky has outlawed all opposition parties? Because everyone agrees with him?


122 posted on 09/22/2022 5:43:14 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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To: Petrosius

Russians can’t and have not seceded from Ukraine. Only Ukrainian’s can secede from Ukraine. Luhansk, Donetsk, and Crimea seceded from Ukraine. Revolutions have consequences. Overthrowing Democracy disenfranchises voters.


123 posted on 09/22/2022 5:52:28 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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To: cranked

All the people you quote are just as full of shinola as the rest of the Putinists.


124 posted on 09/22/2022 5:52:40 PM PDT by Vaden (Real conservatives will not allow our wagon to be hitched to fascist Russia)
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To: Vaden

Your counter sources are where?

Thank you for your participation in the game.
The bridge from where you crawled from is assuredly missing you by now....


125 posted on 09/22/2022 5:54:24 PM PDT by cranked
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To: Jan_Sobieski

Your lies cannot alter the facts. RuSSian proxies are responsible for attempting to “detach” parts of Ukraine. RuSSia has been meddling in Ukraine’s affairs for far longer than 2022. RuSSia has been trying to overthrow the Kyiv government and install a Moscow puppet.

But what can you expect from a fascist nation like RuSSia which has zero history of real freedom and has been ruled by a murderous despot for 20 plus years.


126 posted on 09/22/2022 6:04:18 PM PDT by Vaden (Real conservatives will not allow our wagon to be hitched to fascist Russia)
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To: marcusmaximus; Monterrosa-24

Bidenistas support Biden and globalism, NATO and endless war.

The world is done with us for this reason. Say goodbye to the petrodollar and reserve currency. Obama and Biden have destroyed us much much more internationally than expected. Most Americans are clueless...”oh poor Ukraine” is the limit of their thinking ability.They don’t want to have to read the stuff below or think. Just turn on that sitcom and relax.

China just surpassed us in lifespan, the ruble and yuan are stronger than the dollar, and
We spend almost twice as much as Russia and China together on world military spending, yet our weaponry is lagging behind theirs.Our literacy rate is what? Russia had a 99% literacy rate in the 90s. I met a ten yr old boy there who spoke perfect English and was choosing a third language to study.
This used to be a great country. Now the entire world laughs at our demented leader and shows video clips of him, saying he is greeting the ghost of Ukraine.

FR thinks Putin is the big bad wolf. Guess again. The wolves are in the white house, not Russia, playing empire games with other superpowers while the streets of our cities are filled with homeless and trash. I guarantee you won’t see that in Moscow. The Moscow Metro is pristine and beautiful, no trash or graffiti anywhere.
Let’s make America better.

https://thesaker.is/russia-and-china-havent-even-started-to-ratchet-up-the-pain-dial/

https://consortiumnews.com/2022/04/15/pepe-escobar-on-the-dawn-of-a-new-global-financial-system

https://thecradle.co/Article/Columns/7385


127 posted on 09/22/2022 6:05:13 PM PDT by MarMema (No bugs for consumption)
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To: ScottinVA

Been watching the upheaval going on over there.

Jury is out.


128 posted on 09/22/2022 6:10:57 PM PDT by sauropod (Unbelief has nothing to say. Chance favors the prepared mind.)
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To: MarMema

You Russkis can’t think in terms of anything but top down. Entirely ignorant of currents of history.


129 posted on 09/22/2022 6:11:33 PM PDT by Paul R. (You know your pullets are dumb if they don't recognize a half Whopper as food!)
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To: MarMema

Equally incorrect are those who state Pooty is solely responsible for Russia attacking. (That would include Biden.)


130 posted on 09/22/2022 6:14:40 PM PDT by Paul R. (You know your pullets are dumb if they don't recognize a half Whopper as food!)
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To: Paul R.

Yet another freeper only able to make a vague generalized accusation. Be specific and point out what you mean. Give examples. Provide links. Discussion will keep your mind active. Insults just destroy your character and credibility.


131 posted on 09/22/2022 6:15:30 PM PDT by MarMema (No bugs for consumption)
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To: Paul R.

Please share more.


132 posted on 09/22/2022 6:16:21 PM PDT by MarMema (No bugs for consumption)
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To: Vaden
Your lies cannot alter the facts. RuSSian proxies are responsible for attempting to “detach” parts of Ukraine.

You are the liar, but you suffer from Dunning-Kruger so you’re blissfully ignorant of it. 50%+ Ukrainian voters voted for Yanukovich. Why would they have a violent Revolution if they could simply vote him out? OR IMPEACH HIM?!
133 posted on 09/22/2022 6:17:01 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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To: lodi90

Do you know that Zelensky is very proficient at jailing and murdering his opponents? Much more corruption than Russia.


134 posted on 09/22/2022 6:18:21 PM PDT by MarMema (No bugs for consumption)
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To: MalPearce

Thanks for a real discussion post. Not a one liner, no insults. Facts and links.


135 posted on 09/22/2022 6:23:45 PM PDT by MarMema (No bugs for consumption)
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To: MarMema

If he’s that bad Ukrainians will throw him out. Obviously, he isn’t.

Russia has spent hundreds of millions of dollars corruptly buying European politicians. Every FOP owns a mega yacht or two. The Russian army has proven to be every bit as corrupt and incompetent as Russian society in general. Russian corruption makes Ukrainians look like pikers. It’s hilarious you can see Ukraine as corrupt and Russia as not.


136 posted on 09/22/2022 6:44:59 PM PDT by lodi90
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To: Monterrosa-24; All

Your point about the displaced population(s) is key. Mariupol, for example, had swung pro-Ukraine in recent years.

BTW, I stumbled into a fascinating documentary about what happened to the defense industry in Ukraine. I knew a few bits and pieces, but this really pulled it together for me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XbpxL5sKzyE

It’s pretty clear to me that with decent investments (could come from future energy sector profits), maybe a few new / young hot shot engineers to add to the remaining old guard. and reduced corruption, Ukraine could have become a very significant source of low cost weapons to its EU neighbors like Poland, those weapons equal to or better than any but the top Russian gear (which Russia has never been able to produce on its own in numbers).

This adds a new dimension to something I’d figured out a while back. It isn’t NATO on Russia’s border that is intolerable to Russia’s leadership. (BS argument anyway, as it wasn’t going to happen.) It is a Ukraine finally able to meet its true capabilities.

There are quite a few excellent comments after the vid, too. The supply chain issues / analysis hold for many non-defense industries also.


137 posted on 09/22/2022 6:52:05 PM PDT by Paul R. (You know your pullets are dumb if they don't recognize a half Whopper as food!)
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To: Jan_Sobieski

Luhansk, Donetsk and Crimea did not secede from Ukraine, Russian backed militias who had ceased power declared that they had seceded. Their declarations have no authority.


138 posted on 09/22/2022 7:32:39 PM PDT by Petrosius
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To: Petrosius
BS! Referendums we’re sponsered by Oblast leadership, and voted on by the people. Yanukovich was extremely popular in all 3 seceding oblasts. Polling in the 80%+ in the previous election. Revolutions do not occur in Democracies! Why? They VOTE THEM OUT! (Or they impeach them)

So why did Obama and the NWO foment a Revolution in Ukraine? Because they did NOT have the votes, nor the legal footing to impeach!
139 posted on 09/22/2022 7:55:21 PM PDT by Jan_Sobieski (Sanctification)
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To: ScottinVA

But you want to play role of world policeman with national debt to your eyeballs? Have you no decency?


140 posted on 09/22/2022 7:58:10 PM PDT by entropy12 (Trump & MAGA are the only road to kep USA viable.)
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