Posted on 05/11/2018 8:40:34 AM PDT by Lera
Somewthing to ponder, regarding this ‘did not leave the Earth objection: was the being who wrote upon the wall in Palace Party Central (Daniel 5) on the Earth? ... and what are we really inferring when using the phrase ‘upon the Earth’? Was there an aspect of the supernatural in the two events of Noah and Lot? Whence came the foreknowledge to warn those men?
Of trumps 1-7, which one is the President?
None ... Although, he sure has caused the unbalanced left, to drool... But, the 'left' are not done, yet. They still have a few tricks up their selves to perform. Perhaps, those that recognize movement of the nations, would take the time to find out what actions, the sounding of the trumps would announce.
We Christians are taught we are in a spiritual war. We are also taught to watch constantly because we know not the day or hour ... Paul may well have been referring to that meaning of last trump.
In 1 Cor 14, Paul is discussing things using military analogies. So the trump reference in 1 Cor 15 is likely to this ‘last trump’ of military use.
Paul writing to the Thessalonians 4:13-18
Then followed by John, taken in the Spirit to the Lord's Day pens the sounding of the 7th or last trump.
I Corinthians 15: 50Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
56The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
58Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.
Paul is either supposedly penning what he was shown, or all of Paul's writings were another gospel. Paul knew that ALL flesh bodies will be changed in a 'twinkling of an eye' at the last or 7th trump. One must need ignore all but a couple of verses that Paul wrote to get a rapture doctrine... Nothing else Paul penned gives any hint or suggestion that other than the soul that returns to the Maker will be here on God's green earth through the first tribulation.
13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. 14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. 15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. 16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.
The subject here to inform so as to NOT be ignorant, concerning them which are asleep... flesh body dead, soul/spirit returned to the Maker that sent them. IF you notice verse 16 Paul once again inserts that 'trump' of God.
No where in any of the prophecies does God end the law of gravity, and nobody is going anywhere in a 'flesh' body... without a man made 'spaceship'. Show me the prophecy where this earth is polluted with masses of flesh bodies left behind in a so claimed rapture?
Revelation 11:15-19 15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
19 And the temple of God was opened in heaven, and there was seen in his temple the ark of his testament: and there were lightnings, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail.
Why do you not believe that God is able to protect those that love Him, right here on the place where He intends to establish His kingdom. Heaven is where ever God is and He intends to reclaim this earth.
What was Paul telling those Thessalonians in the second letter, to give them comforting?
God is NOT sloppy, He is quite capable of dispensing His wrath upon those that have earned it. I get the impression you have no idea what that first tribulation is. It is curious how little concern is expressed regarding the 'real' tribulation so many Middle East Christians have suffered. Christ said that 'wars and rumors of wars' was not the end... The opposite of wars and rumors of wars is a 'false' peace, peace, peace, when there is no peace. There are precious blessings reaped, to live in a nation that at its founding established that there are God given 'rights' that no man/government can give or take...
I also find it striking, that Christ committed no sin, yet allowed Himself to be killed, without even a whimper... None before or since can claim they are without sin.
Paul wrote these letters decades before the Revelation of John was penned, so the seven trumpets of the Revelation had not even been revealed when Paul was writing tot he Thessalonians and Corinthians. He used the trumpet reference because it was something these converts would have been very familiar with, the military sense for muster to battle and end of wacth/end of battling.
The last half of the Tribulation is the Great Tribulation, but those four horses and riders come before the abomination of desolation happens in the rebuilt Temple. That first seal, revealing the rider on the White Horse with a bow is not Jesus. It is a false messiah.
That false messiah, according to Paul in 2 Thess 2 will not be revealed until 'the departure' has happened. THAT was a comforting word to those Thessalonians who feared the Rapture had happened and the dead they expected raised to Him had already happened and they missed it.
Paul proclaimed the man of sin had not yet been revealed so they could stop worrying that the Departure had come and they had missed it.
ICorinthians 14:7 And even things without life giving sound, whether pipe or harp, except they give a distinction in the sounds, how shall it be known what is piped or harped?
8 For if the trumpet give an uncertain sound, who shall prepare himself to the battle?
Paul does not designate the sound of a trumpet, as the sounding of the 'last' trump. He is talking about peoples egos over 'tongues teaching versus preaching prophecy... and Paul ends this lesson with -------- 40 Let all things be done decently and in order.
I Corinthians 14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints.
I thought God inspired both Paul and John to write down what God wanted us to know... After all Paul got first hand, face to face, on his way to Damascus and ended up writing the majority of the 'so called' New Testament.
Daniel penned things that not even he understood... at the time... I have no doubt Daniel is now fully aware of the meanings of the things he wrote ...
What John penned was given to him as he was taken in spirit to the Lord's day... Now, how long is a day with the Lord?
Are you asking if I believe in angels and demons? Of course I do, the Lord Jesus Himself spoke of them.
And the hand of God wrote the warning described in the book of Daniel.
But how does any of that change the fact both Noah and Lot remained on the earth during and through the judgment of God (and were protected from it)?
Matthew 24 This is what Christ said would be the signs of His return...
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
28 For wheresoever the carcase is, there will the eagles be gathered together.
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21 Christ Himself lays out the action that takes place at the sounding of the 7 trumps. No where does Christ mention a secret mission to collect anyone... We are suppose to be waiting for Him, and not get caught up in the mass deception, such that the return of Christ will be like a thief in the night. Why, because the majority think the first supernatural entity tossed out of heaven is none other than Jesus.
It does not take years for 'birth pangs'... once labor begins it is a matter of at most 'days', and at best hours.
I humbly leave you to twist in the wind, waiting for the man of sin to be revealed, so you can suffer in the Tribulation.
I am waiting expectantly for my Lord to come and call me out from among these, to meet Him in the air and return to where He has been preparing a place for me in The Father's House. ONLY the Holy Spirit can break through the confusion. I just pray you have accepted Him as your Savior, in which case I will see you in the clouds, despite any errors we may be stumbling back and forth.
At least I know who that ‘man of sin’ is, and will NOT be tempted with his promised rapture.
Good for you
If a person has been born from above, the Rapture is an event which God promises is in his or her future and He is the One Who completely controls the timing of His act. How is that Truth a 'temptation' you would reject? Believing the even is coming neither saves you nor unsaves you. So I am wondering what you intended to mean with t\your conclusion in #76 above.
He did have difficulty getting his points off the ground....mingled with apologies etc...and his urgency, which is always a heads up for me to proceed with caution. Even doing so he did his fair share of dragging enough to loose my interest.
Bottom line: Stay focused on Christ and watch for his coming as we’re asked to do.
.....”Christians are supposed to be bringing the Gospel of Christ to unbelievers”....
Yes.. and should be foremost in out thinking as these events and happenings should point to the urgency of the salvation of people before it’s too late. We all have family members who do not know the Lord, and many walking far from Him. So this is the urgency.
Also we’re to watch for His coming.....although these events can differ depending on ones positions...events in Israel are always interesting as they are throughout the Eastern nations.....they will be positioned and operating just as He said they will and all in his time. Could be soon.....could take years yet as God can speed up things and slow them down at will.
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