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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Again, your personal beliefs rely on only the Truth in the Bible, and so you ignore Truths that Jesus taught verbally.

Not all Truth is contained in the Bible.

Jesus taught by example and speaking and this was passed down by the Apostles and their successors.

Even today Catholic priests preach the Gospels verbally through the pulpit.

Jesus didn’t place a leather-bound New Testament directly into your hands. He created a Church, in which these texts were written, preserved, and passed on, under the ongoing guidance of the Holy Spirit. In other words, Jesus transmitted divine revelation via Tradition, so if you can’t trust Tradition, then you can’t trust the revelation.

Since Sacred Scripture is part of Sacred Tradition, that means Tradition is bigger. It tells us things about the Bible that the Bible doesn’t say about itself (for example, there’s nothing in the Bible that tells us which books belong in the Bible). The apostles recognized this about their own writings—that they were part of a broader transmission of the Faith.

That’s why, in 2 Thessalonians 2:15, St. Paul instructs his readers to “stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.” The mode of transmission—written or unwritten—is irrelevant. It’s all Tradition.

Every Christian believes that he or she is called to pray for the world, to intercede and to mediate for others, to have a “ministry of reconciliation” (2 Cor. 5:18-19).

The faith of the Church is that the saints are not really dead, but are fully alive in Jesus Christ, who is life itself (John 11:25; 14:6) and the bread of life who bestows life on all who eat his flesh and drink his blood (John 6:35, 48, 51, 53-56). The saints are alive in heaven because of the life they have received through their faith in Christ Jesus and through their eating of his body and blood.

The book of Revelation shows the saints worshipping God, singing hymns, playing instruments, making requests to Christ to avenge their martyrdom, and offering prayers for the saints on earth (Rev. 4:10, 5:8, 6:9-11).

https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/the-bible-supports-praying-to-the-saints

May you find the Truth in the Catholic faith.


75 posted on 06/24/2018 8:20:12 AM PDT by ADSUM
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To: ADSUM

“Again, your personal beliefs rely on only the Truth in the Bible, and so you ignore Truths that Jesus taught verbally.”

God the Holy Spirit recorded ALL that is necessary for salvation and maturity.

I cannot ignore all else Christ taught, since no one knows what it was.

If you disagree, you should be able to simply prove it.

“Jesus taught by example and speaking and this was passed down by the Apostles and their successors.”

If this is a true claim, then simply prove it is true by using facts and evidence from before 100 ad.

But it cannot be proven.

It is simply a false claim - a belief without foundation, used as a blank check to make paganism “true”.

“In other words, Jesus transmitted divine revelation via Tradition, so if you can’t trust Tradition, then you can’t trust the revelation.”

Repeated often, but not true. God sovereignty inspired, preserved and transmitted 2/3 of His Word, thousands of years before there was a Church.

After the blessed reformation, the cannon was re-examined and corrections made.

“That’s why, in 2 Thessalonians 2:15, St. Paul instructs his readers to “stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter.” The mode of transmission—written or unwritten—is irrelevant. It’s all Tradition.”

1. Not a soul knows which traditions Paul referred to. No one.
2. Paul never equates tradition to the authority of Scripture.
3. No tradition is inspired by the Holy Spirit.

Again, your argument attempts to make tradition into a blank check to cover whatever pagan traditions (which you advocate) Rome added. It is never that in Scripture ADSUM.

“The faith of the Church is that the saints are not really dead, but are fully alive in Jesus Christ, who is life itself ”

We agree they are alive.

We are never called to pray, nor talk to them - nor is there any proof they can hear us. Zero.

Nor is there any evidence from the Apostles that this is true.

Given the importance Rome places on this, it is bizarre that no Apostle taught it.

Again, not there.

“and offering prayers for the saints on earth (Rev. 4:10, 5:8, 6:9-11).”

What is not said is that any believer on earth prayed to a departed saint. Not said anywhere.

“May you find the Truth in the Catholic faith.0

And may you find saving truth in Christ, who died to save before there was ever a church.


76 posted on 06/24/2018 8:49:46 AM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion
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To: ADSUM
Again, your personal beliefs rely on only the Truth in the Bible, and so you ignore Truths that Jesus taught verbally.

Which does not give someone license to make stuff up and claim that Jesus taught it.

If you cannot prove that Jesus taught it and it simply wasn't written down, you have nothing but empty man-made tradition.

And word of mouth is notoriously unreliable. If that's what your depending on, then your faith is not just resting on sand, but quick sand.

91 posted on 06/24/2018 1:50:04 PM PDT by metmom ( ...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith......)
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