Posted on 08/10/2018 3:09:22 PM PDT by NRx
Origen, although he ascribed to Mary high spiritual prerogatives, thought that, at the time of Christ's passion, the sword of disbelief pierced Mary's soul; that she was struck by the poniard of doubt; and that for her sins also Christ died (Origen, "In Luc. hom. xvii").
In the same manner St. Basil writes in the fourth century: he sees in the sword, of which Simeon speaks, the doubt which pierced Mary's soul (Epistle 260).
St. Chrysostom accuses her of ambition, and of putting herself forward unduly when she sought to speak to Jesus at Capharnaum (Matthew 12:46; Chrysostom, Homily 44 on Matthew).
Well, we wouldn’t know....I see you’ve been crying again.
And that music the poster is bragging about has also changed over time.
Amen to that!
So now Mary is saving souls and allowing people into Heaven as well? That’s all kind of messed up on the level of the other poster on this thread who thinks the boring little Bible can not compare to the glories of the Roman sect.
In The Glories of Mary several Roman Catholic writers are quoted as saying something to that effect.
I've compared their writings with Scripture to illustrate where Rome is in error on this issue....among others.
| The Glories of Mary | Romans 10:5-13 NASB | |
| Saint Anselm says, ‘that as it is impossible for one who is not devout to Mary, and consequently not protected by her, to be saved, so is it impossible for one who recommends himself to her, and consequently is beloved by her, to be lost.’ Saint Antoninus repeats the same thing, and almost in the same words: ‘As it is impossible for those from whom Mary turns her eyes of mercy, to be saved, so also are those towards whom she turns these eyes, and for whom she prays, necessarily saved and glorified.’ Consequently the clients of Mary will necessarily be saved. (p184) | 5For Moses writes that the man who practices the righteousness which is based on law shall live by that righteousness. 6But the righteousness based on faith speaks as follows: “DO NOT SAY IN YOUR HEART, ‘WHO WILL ASCEND INTO HEAVEN?’ (that is, to bring Christ down),7or ‘WHO WILL DESCEND INTO THE ABYSS?’ (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).” 8But what does it say? “THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART”—that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, 9that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11For the Scripture says, “WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BEDISAPPOINTED.” 12For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13for “WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED.”. |
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| But, on the other hand, Mary says in the words applied to her by the church, “He that hearkeneth to me shall not be confounded;’ that is to say, he who hearkeneth to what I say shall not be lost. On which Saint Bonaventure says, ‘O Lady, he who honours thee will be far from damnation.’ And this will still be the case, Saint Hilary observes, even should the person, during the past time have greatly offended God. ‘However great a sinner he may have been,’ says the saint, ‘if he shews himself devout to Mary he will never perish.’(p185) | 14“As Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up; 15so that whoever believes will in Him have eternal life. 16“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17“For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him. 18“He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. |
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Magisterium is not a name of a group. One is not a member of the Magisterium. One does not join the Magisterium. The Magisterium does not assemble or meet. The Magisterium does not see, think, deliberate, rule or decide.
Magisterium is an abstract noun meaning Teaching Office, or Teaching Authority: the authority itself, not the people who exercise it. That’s the verb to keep in mind: exercise.
The Pope and Bishops ARE not the Magisterium. In their authority to teach Catholic doctrine, they EXERCISE the magisterium.
If what they write or say is NOT Catholic doctrine, they are NOT exercising the Magisterium.
Theologians, Bishops, and even Popes do not “make something Catholic” just by saying it.
You don’t seem to be clear about that. Try a little harder.
By the Magisterium we mean the teaching office of the Church. It consists of the Pope and Bishops. https://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/chura4.htm
Theologians, Bishops, and even Popes do not “make something Catholic” just by saying it.
Well....yes they do make things Roman Catholic.....though not necessarily Christian.
It's what gets Rome the non-biblical idea of the Immaculate Conception or that a piece of cloth will keep you out of the hell-fire....but only if you wear it the right way.
It's what gives rise to other false doctrines such as the "Treasury of Merit".
You're starting to sound like the Gnostics again.
No. Someone doesn’t like it when some people resort to thread-hopping when they have no legitimate argument.
If you can't handle that reality, perhaps you should retire to the caucus threads.
A lot of things being discussed are not mentioned on this thread. That's the way the open forums work. If that's your objection pretty much every post gets pulled.....but Rome likes to shut down disagreement.
Sure seems you're embarrassed by this being known.
Then why are you having the posts mentioning the Scapular pulled?
You should be the one who is embarrassed by resorting to thread-hopping and personal attacks.
Ah yes...the old "personal attack" defense.
Not sure how stating you wear a scapular is a "personal" attack.
Perhaps the open forums aren't for you after all.
It’s a free republic. I’ll post where I wish.
Post where you want to.
Yet, you don't allow others to do so.
But if you cannot handle the free flow of a debate, then the open forums are not for you.
I myself can get tripped up by mishandling abstract words, for sure.
Here's an example or two which may clarify things, because --- due to having a pope right now whose expressed theological opinions are sometimes bogglingly imprecise and ambiguous --- we're having to debate "meanings" and "levels of authority" which were never considered debatable before.
If you perceive that Pope Francis has been setting off flashbangs all over the Church, you're perceiving right. He's a strangely anti-papal Pope such as we haven't seen for generations, maybe centuries.
So here's one example quite relevant for today:
1. Doctrine: Legitimate civil authorities have from God the lawful authority to justly carry out capital punishment in order to protect society from evildoers.
2. Doctrine: God has not made capital punishment mandatory, e.g. He didn't require the execution of Cain (for murdering Abel), David (for murdering Uriah), or Saul (for murdering the early Christians) so therefore there are at least some circumstances where you don't have to, or even must not, execute murderers.
3. This statement could be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium. "Capital punishment should be carried out very rarely."
4. This statement could be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium. "Capital punishment should not be carried out on women who might possibly be pregnant."
5. This statement could be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium. "Capital punishment should not be carried out on minors."
6. This statement could be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium. "Capital punishment by methods W, X, Y, and Z should never be permitted because they are too cruel and sadistic."
... now, how about these examples:
7. "Capital punishment is inadmissible unless there is absolute moral certainty that the convict is actually actually guilty of this crime, and did it when there was zero question of cognitive deficit or mental/emotional illness."
My opinion? This could be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium, even if it resulted in practically no executions being done ever --- or, say, one per century! --- because of uncertainty of fact.
8. "Capital punishment is inadmissible because the Death Penalty is intrinsically morally wrong: civil authorities have no right, ever, under any circumstances, to carry it out."
I would argue strongly that this could NOT be a permissible exercise of the Magisterium, because it would directly contradict #1, which is a settled doctrine of the Church. It is part of what we call the Ordinary Magisterium.
`
The reason there's a bunch of controversy right now, about Pope Francis' altering a paragraph of the 1997 Catechism, is because of the ambiguity of the word "inadmissible."
It's an "import" word from civil law; it's not found in any previous Catechism, and it hasn't been clarified whether "inadmissible" here
So what do we do?
Well, we can petition Pope Francis for a clarification, but he's already notorious for refusing to provide direct answers to direct questions.
That leaves us with an axiom of Catholic Moral Theology called "Probabilism": a doubtful law is not binding ("lex dubia non obligat"). That's a heck of a position to be in, if you're dealing with a literal life-or-death question.It leaves you with a section of the Catechism which cannot be said to be binding law.
I am personally convinced that this is dereliction of duty on the Pope's part. I am quite angry that the Pope ("this Pope, this present Pope") has once again thrown in a flashbang and left us all in controversy. And I fear he does this deliberately.
I have never hears ANYONE say that, except you.
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