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Why Luther?
Ligonier ^ | 10/30/2020 | Gene Edward Veith

Posted on 10/31/2020 5:28:58 AM PDT by Gamecock

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To: Gamecock
"I simply taught, preached, and wrote God’s Word; otherwise I did nothing. And while I slept or drank Wittenberg beer with my friends Philip [Melanchthon] and [Nicolaus von] Amsdorf, the Word so greatly weakened the papacy that no prince or emperor ever inflicted such losses upon it. I did nothing; the Word did everything."3

Excellent article about Martin Luther. God's word indeed penetrates through every false and accursed notion of man's pride and reveals the truth of the grace of God. Though I am not a Lutheran, I am grateful for Luther and the other reformers who willingly gave up all so that the true gospel was preached and preserved.

41 posted on 10/31/2020 9:18:52 PM PDT by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: ebb tide
TROLL
42 posted on 10/31/2020 9:21:12 PM PDT by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: ebb tide; Mom MD; JesusIsLord
RE: Christ Committed Adultery

This has been refuted MANY, MANY times but some people don't really care about TRUTH and would rather pass on lies if it furthers their twisted objective. As to Luther teaching that Christ committed adultery, this is a simple reply (it doesn't seem to matter to them when we post longer explanations anyway though) the article delves into more points:

    No one knows if Luther actually said this. The critical apparatus in the Weimar Ausgabe reveals the textual and grammatical problems in this supposed quotation. Schlagenhaufen recorded only a portion of what he remembered Luther to have said that day (and after how many beers?). No context is given.

    Scholars know how difficult, if not impossible, it is to link the lapidary "table notations" of Luther's friends to Luther's own views. The editors of the American Edition speculate in a footnote that the "probable context is suggested in a sermon of 1536 (WA 41, 647) in which Luther asserted that Christ was reproached by the world as a glutton, a winebibber, and even an adulterer" (LW 54:154). A more probable context is Luther's account of the atonement. One of his basic assertions is that our sins become Christ's and Christ's perfect righteousness becomes ours by faith. This idea of "the happy exchange" is found in many Luther texts. Given his central soteriological and christological concern, the theological irony in Schlagenhaufen's remembered notation becomes clearer: The "godly" Christ becomes or is made a sinner through his solidarity with sinners, even to the point of dying as a God-forsaken criminal on the cross. This is how Luther understood Paul's statement, "God made him who knew no sin to be sin for us so that in him we might become the righteousness of God" (2 Cor. 5:21

    So Christ "becomes" an adulterer, though he does not actually commit adultery with Mary or anyone else. He puts mercy front and center, and rejects the legalism which demanded that the woman caught in adultery be killed and the woman at the well and Mary Magdalene be shunned. The holy one becomes the sinner by putting himself into the situation of sinners, by loving and forgiving them, and ultimately by taking their sins on himself. For this gospel reason, Luther could also remark that God made Jesus "the worst sinner of the whole world," even though he also acknowledged that the sinless, righteous Christ actually committed no sin himself. Trapped in a literalistic approach to Schlagenhaufen's contextless note, some readers have missed the metaphorical character of the remark, which Luther may have made, if he made it at all, with a twinkle in his eye. I'm confident that Luther would not be a fan of The Da Vinci Code--except perhaps with a beer in hand and that twinkle in his eye.

    Here is an article from Concordia Theological monthly: Did Luther TeachThat Christ Committed Adultery? by Arthur Carl Piepkorn. He states,

      Thus the "hair-raising blasphemy" turns out to be an inaccurately translated version of a somewhat uncertain, uncontrolled and unverifiable quotation of an offhand remark of blessed Martin Luther, without a shred of context or any indication of the circumstances that evoked the words it purports to reproduce. Since the item was destined to remain in manuscript form for 356 years after it was set down, it is quite probable that blessed Martin Luther himself never saw what Schlaginhaufen had written down.

    More at https://beggarsallreformation.blogspot.com/search?q=christ+committed+adultery


43 posted on 10/31/2020 9:56:16 PM PDT by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: ebb tide

Hi.

That’s a really good, and fair, and perceptive question.

I don’t know about Stalin in particular.

If Stalin never came to faith, then no, Jesus did not pay for all of Stalins sins.

Particular redemption means that not everyone is saved.


44 posted on 11/01/2020 6:56:17 AM PST by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
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To: ebb tide

Hi again, my previous post would be the same answer I gave about Stalin.....


45 posted on 11/01/2020 6:57:33 AM PST by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
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To: ebb tide; Mom MD; JesusIsLord

On the other hand, there is this:

https://wolfmueller.co/did-martin-luther-claim-that-jesus-was-an-adulterer/


46 posted on 11/01/2020 1:31:29 PM PST by Jacob Kell
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To: Jacob Kell; Mom MD; JesusIsLord; boatbums

47 posted on 11/01/2020 1:38:36 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: Jacob Kell

I’m not getting into it with catholic sources that claim unsupported comments with no context. Luther’s writings and the blessings and successes of the reformation stand for themselves. You notice the roman catholics attacking Luther are still catholic despite their idol worshipping gay marriage supporting pope and priests.


48 posted on 11/01/2020 1:39:13 PM PST by Mom MD
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To: Mom MD; Jacob Kell
Here's a timeline of LGBTQIA+ events at Luther College

History at Luther

49 posted on 11/01/2020 2:04:22 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: ebb tide

So? A great many Lutheran denominations have become apostate just as the Roman Catholic church is apostate. That does not change the validity of the reformation or reflect on Lutherans that belong to faithful synods that have no fellowship or financial ties with the apostate branches. Still sending your dollars and support to Rome ebb? If you belong to a roman catholic parish you do. Time for another reformation. You could study Luther to learn how. Or you could leave your apostate church. Or you can throw stones from your place of rank hypocrisy. Your choice but I’m done responding to your laughable attacks on Luther


50 posted on 11/01/2020 2:10:09 PM PST by Mom MD
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To: Mom MD

One apostate, named Bergoglio, does not make the Holy Catholc Church apostate.

BTW, churches don’t go apostate, individuals and sects do.

And I find it hillarious that you claim validity to Luther’s Deformation while admitting it has devolved into many apostate sects.

Glass house and stones, Mom


51 posted on 11/01/2020 2:17:47 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: ebb tide; Jacob Kell; Mom MD; JesusIsLord
Yawn all you want but don't you ever falsely make the claim again that Luther blasphemously taught Christ committed adultery! That would be intentionally bearing false witness, you know (aka a LIE).

The Democrats are doing just that with their repeated lies against Trump claiming he said there were "very fine people on both sides" at Charlottesville , he "won't condemn white supremacists", he "called soldiers losers and suckers", etc. If one has to lie to advance their cause, then they don't have truth on their side. Think about that.

52 posted on 11/01/2020 2:43:46 PM PST by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: boatbums

Luther blasphemed like no other person I’ve ever read about.

You have got to be joking.


53 posted on 11/01/2020 2:45:09 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: boatbums
That would be intentionally bearing false witness, you know (aka a LIE).

I have not lied.

And why don't you practice what you preach?

54 posted on 11/01/2020 2:54:41 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: boatbums

Catholics would rather fight false statements about Luther than clean up their own mess. Luther is still over the target 500 years later.....


55 posted on 11/01/2020 2:57:10 PM PST by Mom MD
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To: ebb tide

You “have not lied”??? Then what do you call it when someone repeats a falsehood even after they have been corrected multiple times? Do you also think Biden, Harris, Obama, et al have not lied?


56 posted on 11/01/2020 2:58:55 PM PST by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: boatbums; Mom MD; Jacob Kell; JesusIsLord
The Blasphemies of Luther
57 posted on 11/01/2020 2:59:55 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: boatbums

It’s not a falsehood.

Luther was a blasphemous, perverted, heretic.


58 posted on 11/01/2020 3:01:59 PM PST by ebb tide (We have a rogue curia in Rome.)
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To: Mom MD

Some of them don’t even try to hide it!


59 posted on 11/01/2020 3:02:53 PM PST by boatbums (Lord, make my life a testimony to the value of knowing you.)
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To: ebb tide

That’s the ELCA. The “L” in it stands for Liberal. They’re Liberal in theology, politics, you name it.


60 posted on 11/01/2020 3:08:55 PM PST by Jacob Kell
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