Posted on 01/13/2010 7:46:56 AM PST by SmithL
South Dakota's Lutheran bishop attempted to head off the possibility of local congregations breaking from the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America during a Tuesday night forum before several hundred congregants.
The Rev. David Zellmer, bishop of the South Dakota Synod of the ELCA, met with members of Rapid City Lutheran congregations to respond to a controversial decision last August allowing homosexual clergy to serve in the church and recognize their partners.
Zellmer said the action threw some churches into turmoil and angered some congregations. He said he wanted to assure the people that the synod still does not recognize same-sex marriage.
The August vote had done two things: It made it possible for gays or lesbians in publicly accountable, lifelong, monogamous, same-gender relationships to serve as clergy. It also allowed congregations to ask candidates for pastor positions about their sexual orientation.
"There will be transparency. You will know about the relationships or the lack thereof, of the people called to serve you," Zellmer said.
He also told the group that he will not lead the synod out of the ELCA.
"There is nothing in my vows as pastor or as bishop that would allow me to do that," he said.
Zellmer said that while he had a long list of complaints with the church, there wasn't enough there to make him ask South Dakota Lutherans to leave ELCA. He said that the decision isn't about salvation as much as it is about civil law.
"I'm not leaving because it's not about gospel," he said.
Break up the organization, splinter away from the church as an independent faction, and there's historical evidence that the faction would last at best 18 months.
"There's not a way that we're going to do more," he said.
He also asked that church leadership not withhold funds from the synod. "When you withhold funds, you let loose a storm in the church," he said. He said that churches supported in Third World countries were the ones that had the most to lose.
He asked the audience to consider the two hymns that were part of the evening service. The beauty of the sound had still resonated through the church when the organist stopped playing.
"Imagine your singing if you made all of the tenors leave," he said.
David Zellmer, bishop of the South Dakota Synod of the Evangelical Lutheran Church of America, spoke to the congregation at Calvary Lutheran Church on Tuesday evening, Jan. 12, 2010 about the controversial vote of allowing homosexuals into the clergy and leadership positions within the church.
"When you withhold funds, you let loose a storm in the church,"There has indeed been a storm let loose within the ELCA, but it's a self-inflicted storm.
Hey Dave, the true believers who believe and respect God’s Word are not going to endanger themselves because of a heretic like you. They are leaving and the Holy Spirit is going with them leaving you and your ilk in your reprobate state.
Instead of sending missionaries to Africa, maybe we should evangelize America again. Just a quick glance through the Bible would fix a bunch of troubles in this country.
Oh, really?
"9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, 10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. "
1 Corinthians 6, NKJV
That page must be torn out from the good Bishop's Bible...
This Bishop just lied to his Synod. It's all about gospel and what the Bible teaches.
I'll try to answer that. I was in the 'belly of the beast' yesterday. The patriarch mother of a family we know well passed away and her service was yesterday at our local ELCA church; a church my wife and I left some years ago for this very reason, along with other reasons. Naturally, we attended the service in support of the family, and met any number of friends from our time there.
Naturally, the subject came up. Frankly, I can think of only one family that might be supportive of gays in that congregation, and they weren't there yesterday. To a person, all decried the path the ELCA has taken. But they also voiced the deeply-set feeling that "This is our church family", and that they as individuals or families, could not just up and leave. It would be like breaking up "family".
That leaves them with further options, but I can't say at this time they'll be taking advantage of them. Keep in mind, these are seniors, pretty set in their ways, and decisions like this are difficult to embrace.
The Bible is quite clear on this issue, its a pity (though not suprising) most of the protestant churches have decided the Bible is just wrong.
How about if the bishop talks about the ELCA’s pro-abortion stance? That’s infinitely more sinful than their homosexual agenda.
* as of August 19, AD 2009, a liberal protestant SECT, not part of the holy, catholic and apostolic CHURCH.
*****Instead of sending missionaries to Africa, maybe we should evangelize America again.****
Africa began sending missionaries to the US several years ago because they see us as a heathenistc country.. worse than pagan countries of old who sacrificed children on alters to their Gods, because we kill children while they are still in the womb...
It would be like breaking up "family".
I'm coming to understand that.
I agree with you. An ELCA member who supports ordaining gays and gay weddings told me, “Churches should change, to conform to society.” I said, “No, society should change, to obey the Bible.” She didn’t have a response to my comment. We argued for about a half-hour, and neither of us changed our mind.
Yes, Church’s are not meant to be a reflection of society, and any church that ever is, is a blasphemous one.
Here is a prayer by this Saint, which could have been written last August
Father, keep us from vain strife of words.
Grant to us constant profession of the Truth!
Preserve us in a true and undefiled faith
so that we may hold fast to that which we professed when we were baptized
in the Name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit,
that we may have Thee for our Father,
that we may abide in Thy Son
and in the fellowship of the Holy Spirit.
now and forever,
AMEN.
I’ve long used the phrase “Christ established his Church to change people’s minds; not change itself to suit people’s minds.” As with you, that usually don’t have much of a response.
A good church IS necessary for Christian growth. However I don't consider that a trap, but a blessing. This, though, is the ELCA and IMO the lost their distinction as a 'good church' long ago. Thus, they have trapped their membership to a great degree.
Younger, more resilient, members may find moving on somewhat easy to do. After all, that's the American lifestyle. But these people are, for the most part, elderly, that has been their church for decades, and such a decision doesn't come easy. Especially when it means not only leaving the entity, but frequently their friends as well.
He could take a vow to follow the Lord of the Church and obey His Word, but that's a decidedly unpopular position among ELCA bishops and clergy nowadays.
12:1 I appeal to you therefore, brothers, by the mercies of God, to present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God, which is your spiritual worship. 2 Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect.
such a decision doesn’t come easy.
That’s what I mean by a trap.
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