Will Westerfield Face Death Penalty? (Van Dam trial update)

Parents drug use, sex lives steal focus

Brenda van Dam cries as she testifies Thursday about her daughter's disappearance.

SAN DIEGO (Court TV) — The parents of Danielle van Dam took the stand Thursday at a preliminary hearing for their daughter's accused killer and tearfully recalled the circumstances of the 7-year-old's abduction from her bedroom.

Asked what she found when she went to wake her daughter on the morning of Feb. 2, a red-eyed Brenda van Dam replied, "an empty bed."

But the girl's disappearance and murder quickly took a back seat to questions about her parents' drug use, drinking habits and sex life.

Brenda and Damon van Dam acknowledged smoking marijuana and drinking alcohol the night their daughter vanished from her bedroom. A lawyer for murder suspect David Westerfield also repeatedly quizzed the pair about rumors they were "swingers," sexually involved with others.

Danielle's father, Damon van Dam

Judge H. Ronald Domnitz precluded many of the questions as irrelevant, but Brenda van Dam admitted a female friend tried to grope her breasts in a bar that night. And her husband said he had a relationship with the same woman and had kissed and massaged her in his bed the night his daughter went missing.

Westerfield, a 50-year-old engineer who lived two doors down from the van Dams, is accused of kidnapping the second-grader from her bedroom the night of Feb. 1 and killing her. Her body, too decomposed to determine a cause of death, was discovered in a trash-strewn lot Feb. 27. Spots of Danielle's blood were found in Westerfield's recreational vehicle and on his jacket, according to police. They said they also recovered child pornography from his home and suspect a sexual motive.

At the close of the three-day hearing Thursday afternoon, Domnitz ruled there was sufficient evidence to try Westerfield for kidnapping and murder. He will be arraigned March 28. Prosecutors have not decided whether they will seek the death penalty.

Brenda van Dam, who like her husband wore a picture of her daughter on her lapel, testified that almost all of her contact with Westerfield came in the week preceding her daughter's abduction. On Jan. 25, she said, she saw him at Dad's, a neighborhood bar where she had gone with two female friends. He bought her a cranberry and vodka cocktail, but she said she could not remember what they talked about and still did not know his name.

Suspect David Westerfield

Several days later, she said, she, her son Dylan and Danielle went to Westerfield's home while selling Girl Scout cookies. Westerfield formally introduced himself and bought four boxes of cookies. While the children ran around his pool, she and Westerfield talked, she testified.

He wanted to get to know her female friends, she said.

"He said to tell them I had a rich neighbor to introduce them to," she testified.

She said she told Westerfield that she and her friends might return to Dad's the next Friday if she could get a baby sitter. Her husband, she recalled telling him, would be out of town.

As she left his house, Westerfield took her phone number and told her he "had adult parties and also barbecues" and planned to invite her and her husband to them, she testified.

She said she found the comment so strange that she called her husband at work when she got home.

"It struck me as odd that he mentioned adult parties. I didn't know what he meant by that," she said. On cross-examination, she denied Feldman's charge that she was tickled because "there were others in your neighborhood allegedly engaged in the swinging lifestyle."

The van Dam's testified that on Feb. 1, Brenda and her two female friends planned to go to Dad's bar and Damon, his trip postponed, to stay home with the three children. Damon van Dam said he drank two beers with dinner and a third later.

When the friends, identified as Denise Kamal and Barbara Easton, arrived, the adults went into the garage, locked the door and shared half a marijuana joint. The boys played video games while Danielle sat at the kitchen table writing in her journal.

Brenda van Dam said she had smoked marijuana about 30 times before, and both testified they had the garage lock specially set to keep the children from happening upon them. Damon van Dam said he had one or two hits and Brenda said she had "three or four puffs."

"Did it get you high?" asked defense lawyer Steven Feldman.

"I did," she said.

The women left for the bar, and Damon van Dam said he played video games with his sons and then put all three children to bed at about 10 p.m. Danielle, he said, was already in her four-poster bed when he entered the room to tuck her in.

"I gave her a kiss goodnight," he said. He left her door and those of her brothers open about eight inches, he said.

After watching television and walking the dog, he went to bed, he said. He testified that the dog, Leila, was raised with dogs who had their larynx removed and almost never barked.

Brenda van Dam said that when she arrived at the bar, Westerfield was there with two friends and offered to buy her and her friends drinks.

"He said, Ladies don't buy their own drinks and threw some money on the counter," she testified.

She said that over the course of the evening, she had three cranberry and vodka cocktails and a shot of tequila. She said she did not know how many Westerfield bought because her friends just kept passing them to her. She also said she went to the parking lot with Easton, Kamal and two male friends and smoked the rest of the joint.

"How clearheaded were you," Dusek asked.

"I think I was very clearheaded," she said.

At one point, she and her friends played pool with Westerfield's friends. She said she noticed him watching them.

She said she danced with her male friends and a male stranger and then with Kamal and Easton. Under cross-examination, she admitted that Easton and Kamal were dancing provocatively with each other, and that she told investigators Easton tried to grab her breasts. Brenda van Dam denied ever dancing with Westerfield, but before the hearing ended, the defense listed several bystanders who said they had seen the pair on the dance floor together.

At 1:50 a.m., the bar closed and she drove Kamal and Easton back to her house. The two male friends also joined them.

Damon van Dam said he had just returned to bed from taking the dog out again when his wife and friends arrived home. Brenda van Dam said as she walked into the house, the security alarm indicated a door in the garage was ajar. The alarm was not hooked up to a security company and did not sound continuously when a door or window opened. She said she closed it and then she and Easton went to the master bedroom.

Easton, he said, got on the bed.

"I put my arm around her and kissed her and rubbed her back," said Damon van Dam, adding that he could not remember whether his wife was in the room at the time, but she later left.

On cross-examination, Feldman asked if he and Easton had a relationship with her and he said "Yes."

Eventually, he and Easton joined the two men and Brenda van Dam in the living room. After eating pizza, the guests left and the van Dams went to bed about 2:30 without looking in on their children.

Damon van Dam said that sometime during the night, he woke to use the restroom and noticed a flashing light on the alarm panel. He went downstairs and found the sliding back door slightly ajar. He closed it, thinking one of his guests had opened it, and returned to bed.

At 9 the next morning, Brenda found Danielle's bed empty.

"We started looking everywhere," she said.

"What was your state of mind?" Dusek asked.

"Frantic," she said.

bump for later read

Ping...for continured discussion....)))

Unless the DA has some very compelling evidence, an eyewitness, or a confession by Westerfield they havn't yet introduced in the public proceeding, I don't see how any jury will find Westerfield guilty of anything, much less murder. They haven't even shown -- beyond reasonable doubt -- that Danielle was murdered, much less by whom.

Agreement Bump....but hang him if he is proven guilty, of course....FDA

Valpal1 found this and posted it on another thread..thought you might be interested in it as well.

Child Porn Info..this guy has quite a resume!

Sheesh, they spent the entire PH talking about the parents, right? Say, who is the defendant? LOL That was bad, I know..

I can't get over how many judges have been arrested!! It's a dark dark world out there when one starts delving into it.

btt

Kim, the pedophiles are as organized as the homosexual lobby. They know who their friends and enemies are. The reason this problem exists is because the sheeple don't want to know the truth, they would rather go haring off, to blame the parent's lifestyle. While their inattention certainly gave the wolf an opening, it didn't cause the wolf to exist.

And that's the real problem, that predators are allowed live, to organize, and to strike again and again.

I think I will end up reading everything on Andrew Vachss' Site. That Child Porn article deserves it's own post.

This deserves repeating....so many rules...interesting these folks can't keep 10 simple commandments!!!!!

Basic Swinging

Swinging can be an emotionally charged lifestyle. First of all, we "are" talking about having sex with someone other than your own spouse. That by itself can be a daunting prospect, especially for couples who haven’t talked a lot about their sexual fantasies. Second, every event you attend is a test of your people skills: you must make a conscious effort to behave diplomatically, and that’s not always easy when you’re used to dealing with your spouse who knows and understands your moods and various tones of voice. Finally, finding couples whom you are attracted to and who are attracted to you is a lot like dating, you try to make a good impression, you send what you hope are appropriate signals, you ask the big question, and you might get rejected. Here are some "basic rules" to remember.

Basic Rules

1)   Never attempt to break up a couple.
2)   Set your limits and stick to them. If the other party cannot accept them, leave!
3)   Move at your own pace, don’t let someone rush you into something you may regret later.
4)   Always keep the first meeting on a no strings attached basis, but be prepared to swing if it is    mutually agreeable or to give an honest answer if something doesn’t click.
5)   Don’t lie and cheat on your soul mate. If you do you're in the lifestyle for the wrong reason.
6)   Always keep dates unless you give ample notice of changing circumstances.
7)   Don’t cross other people’s limits.
8)   Never, under any circumstances exert pressure on a partner to swing.
9)   Protect the anonymity of other swingers by refraining from name dropping.
10)   Always maintain the highest standards of personal cleanliness and appearance.
11)   Do not engage in any unlawful activity that would discredit swingers as a group.
12)   Communicate and be honest with your soul mate and other swingers.
13)   No, thanks, means NO! No explanation needed.

Remember a swing club is the last place to be shy. To be successful you need to be open.

Dealing With Jealousy

Jealousy is a problem that many people face. It will always be there to some degree, after all this is the person you love most in the world giving away a very sacred part of your relationship to someone else.

The best thing you can do to reduce jealousy is to communicate with each other about how you feel. If you aren’t comfortable with something that is going on, tell your partner. If you or your partner honestly cannot handle a specific event (tongue kissing/ oral sex/ full swap) you should probably avoid that event. Every couple has their own limitations, it is best to set yours at the point where both you and your spouse are most comfortable.

Each situation is different, don’t jump in until you are ready. If you are having problems in your relationship and you think swinging will help, it won’t. If you have a close relationship built on honesty and communication then swinging will only strengthen that.

Performance

This is something that most people think of in swinging as only affecting the men. Here they are ready to play with some new woman, a woman they have wanted for hours, month’s or even years, and just when everything is falling into place and it’s time to perform they can’t. How many times have we seen this, or had it happen to us. I know I’ve seen it plenty, and the thing is it’s not the guys fault, and it’s not the girls fault either. I mentioned earlier that this affects more than the men, and it does because women have the same problem, it’s just not physically visible. Usually with us it shows itself in that we aren’t able to cum.

What causes this you ask? Simple, not being comfortable in your environment. In a normal dating relationship you don’t have sex with a person until you are comfortable with them, this might be the first date, or it might be 3 months later, at any rate, by the time you get around to swinging you are definitely comfortable with your partner. You know what to expect. When it comes to swinging you could be playing with someone you barely know (if at all), that you only met an hour before and haven’t really even talked to. How comfortable can you be, completely naked trying to have sex with what is basically a perfect stranger? Ok, so some people can, but most can’t.

So what is my advice? Get to know the person you are with ahead of time, our usual rule is talk with them on the phone a few times before meeting them in person. At any rate be comfortable with who you are with. If you aren’t comfortable, don’t do it. Just remember you aren’t alone, it’s actually quite common.

This should be looked at from another angle as well, a warning so to speak to all the single guys out there who think swinging and group sex would be just SOOO cool. Things are much different in real life than in fantasy.

Communication

Communication with your partner is THE most important thing in any relationship, whether you swing or not. It is important to make sure that your partner knows that they are the most important thing to you, and that swinging will always come second. If at any time they feel otherwise, your relationship is in trouble. Before you start swinging you should make sure that your relationship is secure, with a strong backbone of communication. You should talk to each other about what makes you happy, what turns you on, what bothers you and what you could not handle seeing or doing. And you have to listen to each other.

Use the issues you discuss to help you set boundaries and rules when you do enter the lifestyle. Never do anything that either one of you are not comfortable with. Setting boundaries will help insure that feelings are not hurt. Make sure that anyone you swing with is aware of your boundaries and rules prior to swinging. By ensuring that the other people involved are aware of your boundaries you will ensure that your boundaries don’t become a problem later (they will have already been addressed and if the other people you are with can’t handle your boundaries then they should say so). It’s best to discuss this before you get to your party location.

Don’t be afraid to set your boundaries too tight, you can always expand them later, as you both grow more comfortable with what you are doing. However, if you set the boundaries too loose or don’t set any at all, it is very likely that one of you will get their feelings hurt, because something happened that the other wasn’t comfortable with.

Communication must occur at all times. This includes, not only when the two of you are alone, but even when you are with other couples, no matter how may times you have been with them.

Before you and your partner go out to meet another couple, establish ways to communicate between yourselves that others won’t be aware of. That way if you meet someone and one of you is not interested, they can communicate that without flat out saying it. The same goes with if you are both interested and want to proceed.

Don’t be afraid to speak up during an encounter if something is bothering you, or if you aren’t comfortable for any reason. Keeping feelings to yourself will only cause resentment. It is better to get things out in the open and cleared away than to have them fester so that something that could have been taken care of easily becomes a large issue.

There isn’t enough I can say to stress how important, Communication is. If it is there, it can create the strongest relationship possible, if it is absent, it will most likely destroy a relationship.

Emotional Attachment

A friend of mine outside the lifestyle says she could never participate because she’s afraid she will meet the man of her dreams. I feel that she is looking at swinging in the wrong context it’s not about falling in love (except with your own partner) it’s about enhancing an existing strong and stable relationship.

Needless to say, this is a "very" sensitive area. I believe that somewhere between love and ambivalence lies a very happy, healthy "sexy" medium that can only be called lust. It’s ok to lust after someone other than your spouse. This is what drives the whole lifestyle experience because if you didn’t feel "lust" for a person you most likely wouldn’t do anything with them.

Okay you may ask, but why is it ok to lust after people in the lifestyle? First of all, it’s natural to feel positively inclined toward people who treat you well and make you feel good. For many people, men and women, participating in the lifestyle it gives their ego a boost when they discover that other members of the opposite sex do find them attractive, it’s the old "I still got it!" That charges up their own feelings of sexual confidence, which increases the amount of sexiness they project. When you walk around feeling sexy about yourself, it’s pretty easy to feel "lustful" toward others.

Also, it’s a heck of a lot easier to have good sex with someone if you are attracted to them. Isn’t this true even outside the lifestyle? It's been a while since I've been on the dating scene, but last time I checked it was hard to get into it if you had to put a bag over your partner’s head or tape their mouth shut to keep them from revealing any more "personality."

And of course, it’s possible (even likely) that you’ll meet people with whom you want to become closer friends outside the lifestyle. Developing friendships within the lifestyle is a happy side effect of meeting so many nice, sexy new couples.

None of this can be a problem if you and your mate talk about it openly, and if you are able to identify your feelings and separate them from the way you feel about your spouse.

Emotional attachment is a problem when you start to "fall in love". Falling in love with someone you swing with is a BAD idea, for several reasons:
1) It can lead to illicit sexual encounters, which is "cheating" on your spouse. If you’ve ever wondered where to draw the line between swinging and cheating, this is it.
2) It can lead to the breakup of two good relationships.
3) It can sour you or your "love" completely on the lifestyle, after all, if you marry a man who left his wife for his swinging partner, you "get" a man who would leave his wife for his swinging partner. If you like the lifestyle, don’t screw it up by falling in love.

The lifestyle is about sexual pleasure, finding new things that make you feel good, and finding new ways to make your relationship more satisfying. Communicating with your spouse is the most important factor in having fun within the lifestyle.

First Experiences

Honestly, there are a lot of people that do not have good first experiences as they enter the lifestyle. Being with another couple that is too pushy or doesn’t respect boundaries, or having it not live up to the expectations they have set through either porno films, other experiences or personal expectations, it can leave some people feeling cheated or find it less than appealing.

One of the common expectations and one that causes a lot of personal conflict at first is expecting, hot passionate sex with other people. But when it’s all said and done, a lot of people, especially women, feel that it felt empty and not completely satisfying.

While we are not experts, we would probably say that it has to do with the expectations we have set for sex.

For most of us, sex is connected to love, affection and intimacy and security. Sex in the lifestyle is just sex, recreational sex, sex just for fun. Without the love, affection and intimacy we are used to, it can seem empty and hollow.

While you might be with a person that has a great technique, or can make you tingle all over, without the safety, security, and love you get from your spouse, it can never compare or even come close to what your spouse has to offer you. It is just sex, nothing more.

Many people have a first experience, and then take quite awhile before coming back for more. Many people never come back for more. For them, the feeling of emptiness was too much to work through.

Some people experience a feeling of guilt. This is normal; after all we were all brought up thinking having sex with someone other than our mate was wrong. The best thing to do is to discuss with your mate your feelings, what you liked and what you disliked. In most cases this will help resolve this feeling.

Everyone gets started in this lifestyle differently. We feel the best way is to start slow. Perhaps you may want to start with just being in the same room with another couple and watching each other, or perhaps the guys just watching the ladies. The main thing is to do what you are comfortable with and when you feel that you can go one step further talk with your mate about it. If you are both comfortable about it do it.

Age

Wouldn’t it be great if you went to a club or function and everyone there were really attractive couples in your own age group? At first, yes. But then the lifestyle would lose one of its great dynamics.

The ability to socialize, make friends and maybe even have some experiences with couples that bring something different to the table. In the outside world, the things we build friendships on are age, careers, age of children and common interests. In the lifestyle, the unique bond is sexuality, a liberated sexuality that crosses age and sex, career and other boundaries.

Many times, people find out after the fact that they would have gotten along well. Older people are afraid to approach younger couples, thinking they would not be interested in older couples. Younger couples do the same, thinking older couples prefer couples more mature than themselves.

If you think of your experiences as a journey, you will find that making friends of all ages can give you new perspectives and great fulfillment. By being open minded, you just might find yourself pleasantly surprised.

Who You’ll Meet

Who goes to swing clubs, and what kind of people will we meet? The answer is as diverse as our society. You will meet, doctors, lawyers, mechanics, salesman, dentist, just about anyone.

With a community that diverse, you will most probably find people like yourself.

What’s important is finding people with similar attitudes. At first, you will most definitely find people more "advanced" than you. By that, we mean people that have been in the lifestyle awhile and have lost many of the inhibitions you might have. You will probably also find others that are at the same place as you. Even if you are not interested in a physical relationship with them, they still might be fun to be around, and can be the beginning of a great support system for you.

You will also run into people you do not particularly care for. That’s OK. Just as in real life, you can’t expect to like everyone, and can’t expect everyone to like you. But you can still be nice and social. If they want more from you, politely tell them you are not interested. Most people will listen.

When you do run into those occasional pushy people, just be firm and tell them you are not interested. They will get the idea sooner or later. Be blunt, if need be. After all, we are all adults, and can handle the truth.

Conversations

As a group, you will find people in the lifestyle to be very open and honest about their experiences. Most will even share from their personal experiences to help and show you support.

With that said, do not ask for specifics. The names of other couples they have been with is personal and should be confidential. You might be thinking, "But what about my safety. I want to know if a couple was with someone I think might not be clean."

The best we can tell you is to not party with that couple again. Hopefully you picked a couple that feels the same as you about safe sex. If they insist on condoms for partying, then you have little to worry about. If condoms are optional with them, then does it really matter if you know the other peoples names? Not really, risky sex is risky sex and you can’t tell by looking at someone if they are disease free.

"But what if they are with a couple we had a bad experience with. We should let them know what jerks they are, right?"

Listen, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and many couples get themselves in a deep hole by putting themselves in the middle of two other couples. Remember what is important, you and your spouse. Nobody else.

We are not saying that you shouldn’t tell someone about a couple that put you in danger, either physically or by carrying a disease. But there is a fine line between helping and hurting a situation. If you choose to become involved, you must be prepared for any result.

The same is true in reverse. It is never a good idea to talk with other couples about who you have been with. Generalities are fine, and can be quite enlightening in a conversation. But no one really needs to know how Bill could not get erect, or how Sarah smelt funny. It’s not only rude, it’s a violation of the other couple’s privacy.

You’ll find that if you do not talk about other couples and refuse to listen to dirt about other couples, you can keep conversations and friendships fun and you can be fun to be around.

She said she told Westerfield that she and her friends might return to Dad's the next Friday if she could get a baby sitter. Her husband, she recalled telling him, would be out of town.

This is not an invitation to kidnap and murder a child. It is an invitation to meet an adult woman at a bar, when her husband is out of town, and perhaps hook up later. There is no evidence that Westerfield was interested an anything other than adult women. Even the police admit the porn photos were exclusively "post pubescent" (my term) women. DW was interested in meeting Brenda's adult friends. He wanted to meet Brenda and her husband, and invite them to "adult" parties.

Can anyone tell me when DW had access to kidnap Danielle? He was in the bar until at least 10:30. He would have had to assume a babysitter was in the house after that. Babysitters stay in the living or family room of the house. They don't go upstairs and go to bed. How would you enter a house with the babysitter downstairs?

At 2:30, Brenda and friends were in the house. They did not leave until 2:30. At 3:30 Damon was up and noticed the door open. He shut it and it was still shut the following morning. So, the window of opportunity to kidnap Danielle was 2:30 to 3:30 a.m. Why would DW feel safe to enter the house then?

Isn't is more likely that the "kidnapper" was someone already in the house? Either the parents or one of the friends? We don't even know that Danielle was kidnapped. She could have had an accident in the house, or wandered out when the party was going on.

While their inattention certainly gave the wolf an opening, it didn't cause the wolf to exist.

Amen..

I'll tell you what..in college, I spent an entire semester studying pornography for a big research project. (interesting note: I even called and interviewed employees in the field (ha ha) and also interviewed a sergeant in the vice squad..who said that crime is higher around strip bars and porn bookstores.) It is quite the organized culture to say the least. They are VERY CLOSED mouthed, and do not like interviews..As I was studying I ran across information about child pornography, and included a few pages of information about it in my research. Child porn use to be available in pornography book stores as late as the 70's!!!! I could NOT believe it.

Gee maybe it was the Judge in San Diego who was recently arrested for having child porn.

I believe this is the fourth time I am asking you this question. I can understand why you may not want to answer, but I thought it worth one more try.

If the VD lifestyle had absolutely nothing to do with the crime and should be left uninvestigated as it pertains to this crime, I ask the following.

Do you consider their home a safe place for children?

Would you leave your own children in their care with no more concern than any other "normal" home?

Knowing their lifestyle, would you encourage your own kids to spend time at the home?

Just curious as to how innocent and free of blame you find them.

The child porn angle has no legs that I can see. Out of the thousands of pics the guy gleefully allowed the authorities to view, there were but a few that resembled chid porn and only because they were designed to be so.(ie: probably phoney) That is why the charge is a secondary or even a non-event type of charge.(easilly defended)

I see nothing that convinces me that they even have the right guy. (except for the DNA) Even the DNA is as yet nailed down. I will wait till trial before I make any conclusions.

A pretty good collection of links with regard to obscenity laws..

I hate to even call the animated rape scenes as porn..They are obscene cartoons depicting an violent crime that is designed for an audience, that enjoys watching rape. Some of the audience may fantastize about rape..and the rape cartoons "could" provoke some into committing rape. That is a very strange and peculiar hobby.. and is definitely enough to make someone look at him twice. I am with you though, the so-called experts will have to look at the 100 questionable pics and rape scenes and draw a conclusion for us, the people. I hope and pray the so called experts are really qualified to make a judgement.

If the defendant did not have the rape cartoons and other 66,900 pictures, (A VERY unusual amount..a tremendous amount) but only had 100 possible child porn pics, would you still think it's but a few?

Will Westerfield face death penalty?

Van Dam family wishes, politics may play roles in DA's decision

No bargaining chip

A quick resolution

Parents drug use, sex lives steal focus

This deserves repeating....so many rules...interesting these folks can't keep 10 simple commandments!!!!!