Evangelicals and Jews Together - An Unlikely Alliance

I only wish it were a two way street. The National Council of Jewish Women just sued the state of Louisiana because the new "Choose Life" license plates there advances "Christian fundamentalism."¹

The Jewish ADL is opposing the teaching of "intelligent design" in classrooms.²

I just don't get it. For a pluralistic society to work, there must be give and take. Christians are not out trying to drive Jews out of the public square, aren't taking them to court every other day. A Republican introduced the bill funding the Holocaust Museum in DC (where religious ceremonies are held). Jews could reciprocate. Or at least call off the dogs. Denounce the hate speech by people such as Randi Rhodes and these people.

I have to give credit to evangelicals. Anyone messed with me the way they are messed with and I would not support anything they did.

"The article is wrong on one thing: it was not Darby's dispensationalist interpretation which triggered an understanding of Israel's continuing role in Bible Prophecy and history. It's plain for anyone reading the book of Romans."

Exactly -- Thank you. Why do these people write things like this before becoming familiar with true Biblical Christianity?

For example, how does he draw the conclusion that Christians and Jews are an "unlikely alliance"? Not only is this guy seemingly unfamiliar with Scripture and overly-concerned about the "traditions" of what some of the denominations "believe," but he forgot to complete his history homework, as well. Christianity was borne of Judaism.

NEWSFLASH, Mr. Dreher: The first Christians were Jews!

I only wish it were a two way street. The National Council of Jewish Women just sued the state of Louisiana because the new "Choose Life" license plates there advances "Christian fundamentalism."

IMO it should be a two way street. I’m OK with a Choose Live license plate, though I think if it’s offered a Choose Death plate should be offered too. That council means nothing to me. A Choose Life plate also advances my religion, you know that. And I bet that council isn’t the only one in opposition.

The Jewish ADL is opposing the teaching of "intelligent design" in classrooms.2

We’ve discussed that. I advocate it to my children. None of the ADL’s business.

I listened to RR on the web a few months ago on your advice. She’s an idiot, so what. Not the only one. We have a few in Chicago as bad or worse, though they're not Jewish. I don’t know who introduced the Holocaust Museum bill, I believe you when you say it’s a R (but I bet there were scores of other sponsers). That’s great. I’m a conservative R, but I won’t “reciprocate”. Those noahide guys are nuts, but I think the Noahides are very important

I have to give credit to evangelicals. Anyone messed with me the way they are messed with and I would not support anything they did.Lots of evangelicals may not think they’ve been messed with as much as you, some may think more, but that's not the issue they should follow their faith, none of this is about payback.

Evangelicals I know just glide along unconcerned who likes them or not. I was surprised to find out many of them don't even vote. Took me 3 years to convince one to register. Didn't know Randi Rhodes is on the net now. She is very popular in South Florida. Amazing because all she does now is bash the war. Today's rant was about how we hurt the Afghan people and they'll hate us forever. She is a Noam Chomsky in drag with a voice which makes Lynn Samuel sound like a nightengale.

Evangelicals I know just glide along unconcerned who likes them or not. I was surprised to find out many of them don't even vote. Took me 3 years to convince one to register.

That's worthwhile.

Didn't know Randi Rhodes is on the net now. She is very popular in South Florida. Amazing because all she does now is bash the war. Today's rant was about how we hurt the Afghan people and they'll hate us forever. She is a Noam Chomsky in drag with a voice which makes Lynn Samuel sound like a nightengale.

I only knew about her from you. Her opinions *uck, but she has a brain. I'll return the favor. Check these guys out Sunday pm, brainless. (http://www.wls890am.com/showdj.asp?DJID=1667).

Nancy Skinner and Ski Anderson. Bigger market, longer range, Chomsky who? They just learned to say Aaar-a-FAT. They look smart, don't they. Pablum for those whose opinions are already fixed. Like your RR. Don't let them get under your skin.

There is no other topic on FR where people read more into what posters say than these threads. I am not "upset" about anything. I merely am pointing out that evangelicals get kicked in the teeth for supporting Israel. That is a fact. There is little gratitude whatsoever. The Jewish left is on a Jihad against Christian evangelicals. I point it out because those engaged in driving Christians out of the public square, those who claim Christians only support Israel because they want to convert all Jews should be ashamed of what they do.

The Jewish left is on a Jihad against Christian evangelicals

The Jewish left is on a Jihad against religion, including Judaism, because they see traditional religious values as a threat to their socialist agenda. OTOH, liberals prefer to view Islam as a "religion" adaptable to socialist goals, while ignoring the violent fundamentalism that is a threat to the religions they despise.

Unfortunately, the Jewish left has been so outspoken and visible, they are the "Jews" most Christians notice the most, and so many take them to represent American Jews in general.

Evangelicals don't support Israel because we hope to get praise from Jews, we support Israel because it is the right thing to do.

Maybe I'm reading more into your posts than what is said, but I don't think so. Almost every time I see you on an Israel thread, you don't even comment on the topic posted, instead you post something about Jewish Communists or Jewish leftists.

If you want to start a thread about Jewish Communists or about how leftist Jews in America are go ahead, it is obviously the issue that you find to be the most important, but don't interject that topic into other issues. I'll give you a hint: "Saudi Newspaper claims that Jews use non-Jewish baby blood to make Matzoh balls" has nothing to do with Jewish communists.

The political opinions of those discussed in a thread are revelent. This is a political forum after all.

But lets say I agree with you. We will leave political inclinations out of the discussion. Let's have threads about black Americans and not mention Gore got 91% of their vote. Let's have threads about the NAACP and not mention its socialist history. Let's talk about Barbara Lee (D-Ca) and not bring up her ties to the CPUSA. We should not point out that Southerners tend to be pro-state's rights. We can have threads on feminism too and ignore Friedan was a card carry member of the CPUSA. When we talk about lawyers, we can ignore the history of the Lawyer Guild and what the agenda of the Trial Lawyers is. When we discuss Catholics, let us not say anything about the Church's history of opposing socialism.

Free Republic will be sure a better place if no one is allowed to point out or comment on the obvious. We can play pretend.

Of course I know evangelicals don't expect anything back for supporting Israel. That doesn't mean those watching from the sidelines should not point out the ingratitude.

Whenever any of my fellow Catholics trot out the "Darby" shiboleth regarding "end times," my eyes glaze over and all possibility of serious consideration ceases. We don't seem to understand that the Evangelicals have put ALOT more effort into researching this subject. Their studies so dwarf the Catholic effort it seems like the elementary math student trying to critique a professor. We have adequate and satisfying arguments for just about any other Catholic/Protestant disagreement; this one is the glaring exception.

If you look back at the history of my posts, I have many times noted that the majority of Jews in America are liberal. Although, I would probably call these people liberals and not Jews. However, I do so when appropriate, you seem to have an obsession with it and point it out in every single thread.

You also seem to have a dislike for Jews in general. If someone says that Jews are generally non-violent, you quickly respond with something about Communists. If someone were to say that Christians were non-violent and a Jewish person were to say that they were and that the Nazis were an example of this you would accuse this person of being anti-Christian; and you would be right, the Nazis were in no way Christians.

The difference between you and me, is that I don't blame Judaism for the Jewish liberals, I blame liberalism. There is nothing in the Jewish holy book that would make someone be pro-abortion, I know I have read their holy book. The liberals in the United States are not liberal because of Christianity or Judaism (and there are many more liberals in this country who claim to be Christian than Jewish), rather they are liberal in spite of Judaism and Christianity.

I agree with you 100% that we are not taught enough about the tens of millions of people killed by the Communists. But the Communists certainly weren't Jews. Did the Communists qoute the Old Testament when they massacred, did the Nazis qoute the New Testament when they massacred?- of course not. The evil forces in this sense were Naziism and Communism, not Judaism or Christianity.

In the same vein I do blame Osama Bin Laden and his ilk on Islam. Islam is what inspired the hijackers, and it is what inspires the Palestinians, and all the other radical Muslims in the world. Islam is an evil force just like Naziism and Communism.

To blame the tens of millions of deaths under Communism on Judaism is not only wrong, but can only be achieved through a selective reading of history of someone with an agenda.

I blame liberalism too. If you look at my posts, I bring up what I do when others are attacked. Don't feel like sitting back and hearing about how IBM and the Catholic Church aided and abetted the Holocaust without mentioning what the other side did. There is a thread right now that is typical. Our loyal ally Turkey is being trashed for what happened to Armenians 80 odd years ago. The reason for the trashing? One Turkish politician made one stupid comment about Israel. Rather than ignore the comment, Israel and many on FR are making a big deal of it. An incredibly stupid move as Turkey has been friendly to Israel and is the voice of separating church and state in the region.

I'm not sure I even know where to begin...

1) Salvation, according to the Christian tradition, rests soley with one's acceptance of Jesus as your Lord and Savior. One's political opinion regarding the current middle east crisis is not relevant.

2) I have many many Jewish friends and family members...their political opinions are about as liberal as you can get. They oppose virtually every item of the conservative political agenda.

3) Most Jewish friends and family members with whom I am close have a very very low opinion of evangelical christians....they think that they are a bunch of ignorant rednecks, mostly

"Reform jewry in america is dying...primarily as a result of interfaith marriage"

I'm a member of a reform synagogue, and the christian in an interfaith marriage. There are a lot of mixed marriages in the temple, and we are doing just fine, numerically speaking.

I get annoyed when I hear folks talk about jewish-christian marriages like its some sort of communicable disease. We are not destroying judaism...but we are changing it. Given the large number of christians in our temple, the community has had to alter its views on things...politically and culturally. I think its a healthy process that brings in more points of view, as opposed to a narrow, ethnocentric viewpoint that has dominated judaism for some time.

Well I agree with a lot of what you say, but my opinion of you changed when on a different thread an elderly Jewish Freeper said that when he was younger he suffered because of anti-Semitism, you replied that he suffered nothing compared to the Christians under Kaganovitch (I think that is the name you used). Apparently Kaganovitch was a "Jewish" Communist.

The absurdity of such a comment was not lost on me. If someone were to say that Christians are discriminated against in the United States (and many Freepers, including myself, say this every day) and a Jewish person were to say that they suffered nothing compared to the Jews under Hitler. You and I would both call that person anti-Christian.

Everyone has a right to their opinion, and we certainly have anti-Evangelicals, anti-Catholics, and anti-Semites on FR. As long as people are honest with their opinions I usually tend to ignore them, I'm responding to you only because you claim to be pro-Israel.

Unlike some (not you) on these threads I'm pro-American first. I think Israel has every moral right to hit back at those trying to destroy her. The sooner and harder the better. When our interests coincide, we should be allies. But Americans should have no illusions about Israel. They are not in the class of the British when it comes to being friends. As official policy, they have damaged America in the past and probably will in the future (the Brits did too but because of traitors in their midst). Israel is a nationalistic theocratic socialist state. There is nothing we should borrow from Israel and we should prevent Israel, as far as possible, from messing in our internal affairs.

My attitude isn't unique toward Israel. I believe the same about most countries. Israel comes up only because, right now, their actions have a great effect on our security.

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