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Outsource the work of our economic advisers
seattle times ^
| February 19, 2004
| Froma Harrop
Posted on 02/19/2004 7:03:48 PM PST by dennisw
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To: Joe Hadenuf
You're comment on post #48 was excellent. You were the first one who mentioned the problem with illegals. See, this is a two tiered attack lobbed directly at the American middle and lower pay earners (I hate to use the "class" word). A lot of work the illegals are taking are manual labor jobs that were formerly held by Americans of lower socio-economic positions. You would think that Rev Al and that windbag J.Jackson would be all over this illegal invasion like white on rice.
So, between allowing and encouraging outsourcing through the likes of OPIC and the absolute refusal of GWB to abide by our Constitution and protect or borders....the American workforce is getting a double whammy.
A previous poster also mentioned how hard it is (due to BS rules and regulations and beauracracey) is is to conduct small business operations in a profitable way here in the US, that the mere prospect of a person starting a small manufacturing business in the US is made expotentially more difficult than in other countries. It does not take an economic degree to figure out that this does not bode well for the future of US citizens.
But, hey.....GWB 's true colors as a globalist are shining brightly now....for all to see. I suppose he's securing a position in the UN ten years down the road.......
Free trade, in this instance, is so far away from being "free"...it's laughable.
It seems the two political parties have formed a nexus, for the sole purpose of selling out everything that our forefathers have worked so hard for and died for. It's simply a race to the bottom of the barrel....and now the real question becomes, who will get us there faster, the dumacrats or the RINO republicans...
321
posted on
02/20/2004 4:39:50 AM PST
by
taxed2death
(A few billion here, a few trillion there...we're all friends right?)
To: HiTech RedNeck
"We really don't want a country in which half the people are Bill Gateses and the other half lives in cartons on the street."When you all stop resorting to sophomoric libera; scare tactics tripe as argumemts, maybe the real debate can start
322
posted on
02/20/2004 4:43:45 AM PST
by
Luis Gonzalez
(Unless the world is made safe for Democracy, Democracy won't be safe in the world.)
To: LowCountryJoe
What's wrong with this Overseas Private Investment Corporation that you harp on constantly. Why this Private corporation cannot be private?
323
posted on
02/20/2004 4:48:05 AM PST
by
A. Pole
(The genocide of Albanians was stopped in its tracks before it began.)
To: A. Pole
It uses the federal government as a re-insurer but yet there is no cost borne by the tax payer, Why? Because it make money and has an actual $4 billion reserve, Why? because it charges its clients (firms holding policies) premiums for that insurance, Why? Because businesses would think twice about off-shoring if they didn't have a "risk pool" in case of political unrest.
But why is this good for the U.S. isn't this counterproductive? Comparitive advantage determines what gets traded. This is just the market, doing what it does best - allocating resources. Did you happen to catch the part where OPIC indirectly creates 1/4 million jobs and $60 billion in exports?
What if the federal government has to step in for a bailout? After blowing through 4 billion in reserves, it would be pretty safe to assume there would be some sizable political unrest underway - the kind of unrest that's like to bring some form of United States intervention, at the tax payer expense, anyway.
324
posted on
02/20/2004 5:09:55 AM PST
by
LowCountryJoe
(Shameless way to get you to view my FR homepage)
To: A. Pole
They will find new jobs in new emerging fields. If needed they will pick up the new skills. No problem, they will not miss their old buggy whips occupation. The "buggy whip" argument is pretty old, and not really applicable here. Horse & buggies no longer exist (except in Amish country). Software still exists, and there's a great need for good software developers. I suspect there will be that need for many many years.
That said, I think the free market is the place for the outsourcing/offshoring problem to be worked out. Some day there's got to be a company or two that figure it's best for their long-term bottom line and for the quality of their product to stay American. Security's better, the quality of the project management and code is better, that company would be seen as "patriotic" in a sense....
But for now, people prefer Chinese-made dorm room veneered pressboard to Amish furniture that can be handed down to you great grandchildren....
325
posted on
02/20/2004 5:32:40 AM PST
by
Theo
To: Fledermaus; Texasforever; Luis Gonzalez; Dane
I enjoyed your posts on this thread.
I hope this won't be construed as a personal attack.
326
posted on
02/20/2004 7:34:29 AM PST
by
William Wallace
(“There will be a happy ending: the chaos let loose by Roe will give way to restored justice.”)
To: Luis Gonzalez
The quality of o-seas 'mice' is inconsistent.
Further, mice are usually priced around $10. or less. I smell something on this 'article.'
327
posted on
02/20/2004 7:37:41 AM PST
by
ninenot
(Minister of Membership, TomasTorquemadaGentlemen'sClub)
To: Paul C. Jesup
lobbiests or the whorehousesTHere's a difference?
328
posted on
02/20/2004 7:39:34 AM PST
by
ninenot
(Minister of Membership, TomasTorquemadaGentlemen'sClub)
To: Luis Gonzalez
"Don't forget to include elves.....I like elves." I can tell. You seem to prefer fairly tales to truth and facts. So I will not brother you with either other then to say that the economic history of the nation and what you believe are very different.
329
posted on
02/20/2004 8:26:11 AM PST
by
jpsb
(Nominated 1994 "Worst writer on the net")
To: taxed2death
With more people falling out of the middle class, that provides work for people employed by non-profits who are hired to help their less fortunate neighbors. Of course the wages aren't comparable to the high tech sector...but they're steady wages. And it helps if you speak Spanish.
330
posted on
02/20/2004 8:30:05 AM PST
by
Ciexyz
To: kittymyrib
We had our best shot at a flat tax in this last election, Steve Forbes made it the center piece of his campaign. But the Bushbots would have none of it, now the Bushbots are reaping what the Bushbots have sown. A globalist president that cares more about wall street then main street and thinks millions of illegals invading the country is OK, thinks out sourcing all our jobs is OK, thinks big government and big spending is OK, etc. Thanks alot Bushbots.
331
posted on
02/20/2004 8:32:01 AM PST
by
jpsb
(Nominated 1994 "Worst writer on the net")
To: Cronos
Explain their middle class then? Serfs? how? They're getting paid what's good money for them -- they're making their kids go to school, college etc and get better grades.Great, we'll mark you down as another Republican for Red China.
332
posted on
02/20/2004 8:33:35 AM PST
by
Joe Hadenuf
(I failed anger management class, they decided to give me a passing grade anyway)
To: edeal
The high tech jobs matching my skills are bone dry.... I don't understand. Are there no high tech jobs for Americans anymore? Is every single high tech job now earmarked for Indians?
333
posted on
02/20/2004 8:35:59 AM PST
by
Ciexyz
To: Joe Hadenuf
Great, we'll mark you down as another Republican for Red China.
Nope, not red China. I'd want the chinese to get rid of the chicoms. India, on the other hand is a democracy, so I'd rather we boost them up so they can handle the chicoms AND the slamofascists.
334
posted on
02/20/2004 8:38:19 AM PST
by
Cronos
(W2K4!)
To: Fledermaus
Just watch "American Idol" and see the lip on the brats that are told, for obviously bla bla......I live in reality. Try it sometime.
Your reality is watching American Idol?
And your the economics expert right? Yeowza..
335
posted on
02/20/2004 8:38:50 AM PST
by
Joe Hadenuf
(I failed anger management class, they decided to give me a passing grade anyway)
To: Cronos
Explain their middle class then? Serfs? how? They're getting paid what's good money for them -- they're making their kids go to school, college etc and get better grades. Great, we'll mark you down as another Republican for Red China.
Nope, not red China.
It's not? And what reality do you live in?
I'd want the chinese to get rid of the chicoms.
How's it feel to want? Why don't you send them a letter and complain.
336
posted on
02/20/2004 8:42:15 AM PST
by
Joe Hadenuf
(I failed anger management class, they decided to give me a passing grade anyway)
To: Luis Gonzalez
I don't think you could, as a practical matter, restrict what goes out over phone lines. You could, however, levy a tariff on international traffic and you could even break out data traffic from voice and have different rates.
The problem is that you would have to have an enormous tariff to offset the enormous labor cost savings. Also, protectionism always has unintended consequences.
To: edeal
"How can you conclude that I am a liberal? Liberals love big business. Big business and big government go hand in hand. Big business gets big government to intervene on its behalf to disadvantage its rivals in such a way as to eliminate normal economic competetive pressures."
That has not been my experience. Liberals distrust, even demonize, business i. e. those "evil, soulless" corporations. I have always tended to vote Republican because I distrust big business less than I distrust big government. That wasn't because I necessarily thought that business leaders had more integrity than government leaders, just that I thought the system of checks and balances worked better in business than in government. With Enron, MCI, Arthur Anderson, etc. over the last couple of years, I have had to rethink that position.
To: Ciexyz
I don't understand. Are there no high tech jobs for Americans anymore? Is every single high tech job now earmarked for Indians?It is that bad. I have a rather large network of people which include technical recruiters and even exectutives. The statements from all of them are pretty bleak.
From the recruiters I get statements that they are on the verge of leaving the industry because of the finacial hit they have taken. One of my friends who is a technical manager at a major supermarket chain has told me his company has stopped hiring Americans for their point of sale technical support staff. They are moving it all to India (that field is my specialty).
Another friend of mine is an exectutive for a mid sized fast food restaurant chain. He told me they are already overstocked with IT people and are in the process of cutting the numbers in half.
A family member of mine is the assistant director of IT for a phone company, and they are moving all IT operations to San Juan, PR.
Then, just searching job boards you can see the difference from even 6 months ago. In Microsoft development (like ASP, VB, etc), there used to be pages of jobs listed each day nationwide, and several in my city. Now it's a trickle, and a heavty portion of those are scams to get applicants to send them money.
People say that unemployment is 5 or 6 percent, but how many people are like me. I did not register with a state agency for unemployment benefits (welfare), and even if I had they would have run out months ago. I would have been considered employed. (I do not count temp office work at 1/3 of my normal salary to be employment, the government does).
These are just some examples. I also have 30 or so aquaintences working for various companies in my field and none of them are hiring. Most are in fear of being caught in the next downsize.
339
posted on
02/20/2004 10:31:26 AM PST
by
edeal
To: SeeRushToldU_So
You miss the point. The point is to not vote. Why vote for a President who is helping destroy the domestic job market for my field.
Believe it or not the President has an effect on business and trends in the nation. When the President gives his stamp of approval of US policy which is detremental to my livelyhood, of course I am not going to support him. Will I be upset by his defeat. No, because how exactly is he going to be different from the Democrats? The Republicans in congress would actually behave better in that situation. I just cannot vote for what I don't support, so that means I can never vote for the Dems and this year no vote for Bush.
340
posted on
02/20/2004 10:39:51 AM PST
by
edeal
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