Posted on 02/23/2010 8:02:16 AM PST by butterdezillion
Expatriation was and is a right. I will read the case later. I am having to type in bed pretty much today and it has slowed me down. We shall see about Wong. The anchor baby thing is a problem. Looks to me like we need to keep illegals out when they are gravid, if female, and “lovey”, if male.
Why I think we need to amnesty those who are here, and set about to securing the borders like should be simple common sense. OTOH, the mexkins will end up being a conservative core in the future. And, they are Christians, unlike what the Europeans are going to have to deal with...
parsy, who is enjoying all the legal stuff
Donofrio only followed up on what Terri K was already doing at the time. I believe she already figured out what the required responses were supposed to be and got help to make sure she understood them. Donofrio was working with Terri K, but they had a disagreement over something and parted ways. Then Donofrio dropped the ball on the UIPA effort. Regardless, there’s no reason here to make excuses for the DOH or Spokesbabe Okubo when none fit.
Also, I’m glad you admit there could be mulitple documented to obtain a birth certificate. By citing unknown vital records, Chiyome Fukino acknowledged Obama’s original birth certificate did not confirm birth in Hawaii. Since the COLB is only an abstract of that original birth certificate,then it too would not confirm birth in Hawaii.
Now the questions are what were these phantom documents and why not let the public see them?? How reliable are these documents??
I don’t know what the hospitals submitted. That’s a good question. Maybe somebody here knows the answer.
Whatever information was needed to verify place of birth would be on just the certificate if it was signed by a doctor, so there would be no reason for Fukino to refer to plural “records” if she was verifying birth place, unless the whole birth claim depended on supplementary information.
Regarding the fee, the part about “to amend his records” should have resulted in a “no records exist” response separate from the “access denied” if a fee was paid to see his birth record. They’re supposed to segregate the responses if different portions of the request require different responses.
If you didn’t find it, you weren’t looking hard enough. It ain’t like it ain’t smeared all through out. And, I can see by your expression, the impact of the Hoosier Halfwits has set in.
parsy, who says, Sunday Morning’s Coming Down....
Speaking of opinion letters, I think a good tactic might be to cite the opinion letter that showed file numbers were part of the Index Data and request all index data for the yakcheck.org cert number (of course, with no mention of Obama or any names) ... something like, “I am requesting index data for file number XXX in accordance with opinion letter XX dated XXX, pursuant to HRS 338-18(d). This is NOT a request for copies of any certificates, just index data associated with this specific number only.”
I think there’s a guy named Kurt Tsue at the DOH who might be more cooperative than Okubo. kurt.tsue@doh.hawaii.gov
Just a thought.
I’ve been online all morning without a bit of trouble. Then I start reading this thread’s posts and zowie. Mine in slowing down and pausing.
************
Howdy there, Eligibility Ed, you big hunk a hunk!
The impact set in a long time, which is why I’ve been laughing ever since. And if you think something actually supports their faulty conclusion ... please post it. It certainly isn’t contained in their decision. If you actually find something you think stands up to scrutiny, share it. It will give me some more laughs while I quickly deconstruct it.
The Wong Kim Ark conclusion seems to just be Wong Kim Ark is a US Citizen as well as a Chinese Citizen, and exempt to the chinese exclusion laws.
So what?
It dosn’t say Wong Kim Ark is a natural born citizen.
I’ve tried asking for the index data for the certificate with #xxxxxx.
They told me they couldn’t give me any information because I had not shown that I have a direct and tangible interest in President Obama’s birth certificate.
So then I asked them where Obama’s name came from, noting that their answer only made sense if the cert# I asked for was for Obama’s birth certificate. I asked them to clarify whether that was really the answer they meant to give me.
It was actually a hilarious run-around they did, except that it totally ignored the rules. I’m sure that runaround where she never gave an answer that even made sense probably convinced Takase that I’m “mentally ill” since I can’t even recognize when I’ve been given the answer. lol.
So then I requested a non-certified copy of Obama’s abbreviated birth certificate - which would have the certificate number on it and is directly authorized for release to me. No, they won’t follow those rules either.
I actually only went public with any of this stuff once I was convinced that there was no way I could get anything due me from the DOH. The OIP is now letting the DOH decide what the legal answers should be. The ombudsman refuses to investigate. The courts are an option but I don’t have the money to even bring a suit and I also believe that Obama went to Hawaii to buy off the judges who would be involved.
I truly believe that they will continue to break their laws until somebody FORCES them to stop. The only way I know to try to force them to stop breaking their laws is through public exposure which creates public demand for the law to be followed.
I think the article by the Honolulu Advertiser said that Okubo was working on these requests by herself. Which I thought was funny because her responses always refer to “we”.
I think the HDOH is onto me now though. lol. If you wanted to make that request, OIP Opinion Letter 90-04 notes the grandfathering principle for UIPA, and 90-23 notes what was required to be included in index data before UIPA was passed. More explanation at http://butterdezillion.wordpress.com/2010/02/12/birth-certificate-number-must-be-disclosed/
lol. Well if you’da told me he was a hunk..... (my husband would kick me off the case for sure. lol)
Parsy was complaining about things being slow last night also. Maybe the size of the thread makes a difference? I don’t know, but I think Ed might be really busy these days. lol.
I understand, however, by specifically citing the opinion letter that says direct and tangible interest isn't needed (90-23), you could force the issue ... especially if you submit the request to a different party at the DOH.
You could even quote this from the opinion letter:
Similarly, index data concerning vital events may also be inspected without the showing required by section 338-18(b),
Personally I'd copy the e-mail to the OIP and to Dan Nakaso at the Honolulu Advertiser and ask for Kurt to reply to all message reciepients.
Absolutely right, however, prepare yourself for the “you can’t read” shtick or the “nuh uh” shtick or the “Wong’s been cited 1,000 times” shtick (without regard to none being cited to make a British-Kenyan-Hawaiian-Indonesian-Native-psuedo African- and maybe part-U.S. citizen eligible for president).
Not in one sentence. You have to look at the reasoning and case cites in the middle part of the opinion. All that stuff is there for a reason.
Look at the Bible. Does Jesus ever come right out and say you shouldn’t murder people?
parsy, who is curious
Jesus said you shouldn’t murder the bible by trying to make ridiculous analogies with it. Just admit you can’t support the Hoosier Hillbillies’ reasoning with actual citations. Then you might think about brushing up on the bible as better way to spend time.
You can’t read. Go back to number 1887, which is like the 3rd or 4th time I posted this. It’s like the Bible. Jesus said “Obey the Commandments”-—when he said that he “adopted” and “affirmed” the language of the 10 Commandments.” When you read the 1O C’s, it says “Thou shalt not kill”.
“Murder” is killing, so the intelligent person realizes that Jesus would not want us to murder someone. But, I am not sure Jesus ever comes right out and says, himself, THOU SHALT NOT MURDER!
But, if a Birther arguments applies, since Jesus didn’t say it directly, we can’t be sure. And, the commandments say “kill” not “murder” so how do we realy know Jesus wouldn’t approve of us murdering people...
See how silly this is getting. That’s what you guys are doing. Ignoring the language, ignoring the holding, and flatly refusing to use basic reading and comprehension skills. Plus, you have a 2009 Indiana case, which clearly and distinctly confirms my take on this.
parsy, who thinks you need to re-read the case and look for all that “natural born” stuff
Nice meltdown. Quanity doesn’t make a quality argument. I guess all the nonsense about the bible is because you can’t refute my arguments that exposed the idiocy of the Hoosier Hootenannies. My point was made and stands.
Whatever, I can’t play with you anymore. I have:
1...given you links to both cases
2...pulled the applicable language out of Wong, and the Indiana case
3...explained to you how Courts adopt prior cases and language from prior cases.
4...given you a timely and applicable case, the Indiana one, where a court has recently done just that
5...given you a Biblical analogy that you refuse to touch because you know full well it nails you
6...done all of the above, except No. 5, numerous times.
If you still don’t get it, then you either don’t want to get it, or you simply lack the reading comprehension skills necessary to understand it.
If No.2 applies, I suggest you find work in a job that does not require you to read things and then apply them to your job. Perhaps either ditch digging or stable cleaning is where you will be happy. It is hard, but honest work.
parsy, who has led you to water, stuck your head down in the water, held your nose, and actually got the water in your throat, and you just ain’t going to drink, even though you are dying of thirst. I can’t do anything else to help you.
Parsy, how about some plain old common sense. You think Obamas dual citizenship, that he admitted to, isn’t a problem. Chew on this. Citizens with dual citizenship can vote in their home country and here. You want foreigners voting here? If CITIZENS that hold other loyalties is a bad idea, how much worse is it that a President does? Do you HONESTLY believe the Founding Fathers, who sacrificed EVERYTHING, would allow divided loyalty in a President?!
Wong Kim Ark was a dual-citizen. Where in the case and supporting cites does it say a dual citizen is equivalent to a natural born citizen?
The question what is a natural born citizen in the article II sense does not seem to be directly addressed.
The question is, is Obama an nbc? Period. If he is, he could be a communist who says we ought to do what the Kremlin says and it would not matter. That is our job as voters to decide.
Do you really want SCOTUS to pre-screen candidates? Because there are a whole bunch of people born here, to two citizen parents, who hold other loyalties. Lets, see, what about Jane Fonda? Think she could run for president? Oh heck yes! Where are her loyalties? Friggin Hanoi?
The birthers are trying to screw with the Constitution in their zeal to get Obama. They may not mean to. But they are.
parsy, who wishes Fonda had been there during the middle of a Wild Weasel run
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