Posted on 05/05/2006 7:21:22 AM PDT by churchillbuff
Is the national ID card the next step toward the imposition of the biblical "mark of the beast" Christians believe will be required to buy and sell during the Last Days?
That's the contention of a growing group of believers who are working to turn back the approval of the Real ID Act by Congress last year. Public Law 109-13 requires the national ID portion of the plan go into effect by May 2008.
"There is a prophecy in the Bible that foretells a time when every person will be required to have a mark or a number, without which he or she will not be able to participate in the economy," states the Christian website NoNationalID.com. "The prophecy is 2,000 years old, but it has been impossible for it to come to pass until now. With the invention of the computer and the Internet, this prophecy of buying and selling, using a number, can now be implemented at any time. Has the time for the fulfillment of this prophecy arrived?"
The site asks visitors to sign an online petition vowing not to vote for any candidate who does not commit to repealing the Real ID Act.
The goal, states the site, which is sponsored by Endtime Ministries, is to get 100,000 signatures on the petition.
On the site is a link to purchase a DVD entitled "666 – How Close? Will the National ID Become the Mark of the Beast?"
Americans choosing not to carry a national ID, the site warns, will be prohibited from driving a car, boarding a plane, train or bus, entering any federal building, opening a bank account, or possibly from holding a job.
"This is probably our last chance to head off the mechanism before it is actually implemented as the mark," states the site in the FAQ section. "It truly may be now or never."
The Real ID Act requires states to participate in a federal data-sharing program when issuing driver's licenses, making those licenses de facto national ID cards.
Touted as a tool of the war on terrorism, the ID card provision of the law, which also includes border-security measures, has attracted the most negative attention.
After May 11, 2008, "a federal agency may not accept, for any official purpose, a driver's license or identification card issued by a State to any person unless the State is meeting the requirements" specified in the Real ID Act. While states can issue non-federal ID cards, they would not be accepted by the Transportation Security Administration for travel purposes, grounding those who don't carry federally approved cards.
The data required to be included in each card are, among other things, the person's full legal name, date of birth, gender, driver's license number, a digital photo, the person's address and machine-readable technology so the information can be ready easily by government or banking personnel.
Each state must agree to share the data on the cards with every other state.
Supporters of the law say it does not require a "national" ID card because each state issues its own cards, not the federal government. But detractors note the cards are virtual national IDs since the federal law has dictated what data must be included and that each state must share its database with the others.
The New Hampshire Senate yesterday voted to reject a bill to rebel against the Real ID system and not participate in a pilot program for which the state had been tapped. The state House of Representatives passed the measure last month, but the Senate instead voted to study the driver's license requirements.
U.S. Sen. Judd Gregg, R-N.H., is urging his home state to give Real ID a try, saying it's needed to keep terrorists and illegal aliens from entering the country.
According to the Manchester Union Leader, Gregg argues that New Hampshire residents will find it difficult to get on airplanes or enter federal buildings if New Hampshire doesn't embrace Real ID.
Groups opposed to the Real ID Act are making strange bedfellows, with Christians like those running NoNationalID.com fighting on the same side with the American Civil Liberties Union, which sponsors the website RealNightmare.org.
The ACLU site decries the fact that a motor vehicles department staff person will be required to ask for immigration-status papers from those applying for driver's licenses.
"REAL ID will inevitably cause discrimination against U.S. citizens who may 'look' or 'sound' foreign to a DMV bureaucrat," states the site. "REAL ID requires DMV employees to decide whether someone is a citizen or foreigner before issuing a driver's license. The law demands that DMV bureaucrats distinguish among citizens, permanent resident immigrants and other non-citizens in deciding who is eligible for a license and what type of license may be issued.
"Based on past experience when similar requirements were imposed on employers, widespread discrimination resulted against citizens who 'looked' or 'sounded' foreign."
The civil-liberties group also slams a requirement of the law that some immigrants be issued a temporary "tier-two" license that has a prominent expiration date.
U.S. governors also have come out against the law, saying it is a huge unfunded mandate imposed on the nation's states.
The National Conference of State Legislatures is equally opposed to the Real ID Act, saying, "Federal legislators and rule makers are negating state driver's license security efforts, imposing difficult-to-comply-with mandates and limiting their flexibility to address new concerns as they arise. In other words, decades of state experience is being substituted for a 'command and control regime' from a level of government that has no driver's license regulatory experience."
Endtime Ministries' Irvin Baxter, a radio host, believes the national ID is a precursor to the forced embedding of radio-frequency chips under the skin.
Baxter told the Concord, N.H., Monitor: "That's where we are headed right now. The prophecy states that you will have to receive a mark on your hand or in your forehead."
The pin is something you set (stored in the DB). You wouldn't call the social security office to demand a new number, would you?
Ok think long and hard before answering this question. Do you really think for one second that president hillary clinton or more importantly her AG (wich will probably be reno again )will not have any interest when a posting member of a conservative forum that she considers part of the vrwc goes to a gun shop ? Are you really that niave and ignorant? would you like to buy some of my florida swampland? For a nominal extra fee a can build ya a bridge that spans every acre.
No, I don't think she'll be interested. Besides, do you even know how an RFID chip works? Do you know what the range on the most advanced versions are?
Good point I forgot about military ID's.
Well said as usual and something I'd like to add is that from some of the legal reform meetings I've attended over the last couple years it's becoming increasingly apparent that a public officials' oath of office is actually a 'naked offer of contract' to the people and the reason they tend to ignore much of our protests on issues is that we have never individually or collectively ACCEPTED the contract that's been offered.
There are some other issues involved also but from what I've learned once we give them administrative notice that their oath has been accepted we now have a binding contract for them to protect our rights.
The way I see it the fedgov, stategov, etc. all have 'contracts'with the people and likewise each public official that takes an oath of office while invoking "so help me God" has created the offer of contract under the common law....and it's up to us to hold their feet to the fire.
Try participating in the economy without a social security number. The beast is already here - it's called the Nanny State.
With all due respect, I can't agree with you. I had the unhappy experience of working with homeland security , unhappy due to the situation not with the team. We still have our rights, and there is a lot of misinformation out there about the Patriot Act. I know you will not agree, but this is my opinion after my experiences with them. I know what goes on to a certain degree, and we are not as monitored as one may feel.
Oh, this should be a good thread....
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What an interesting statement.
I suppose it depends on the definition of "good."
But my best guess and hunch is that you are declaring that it's wonderful that ya'll can be in the middle of a bunch of contentiousness about this issue.
If that best and most logical guess from tons of experience and observation is the least bit correct, it's an enormously sad commentary on the state of Christianity on our beloved forum and probably in our Nation and world.
Not that such is all that surprising, sadly.
But I hope I'm greatly wrong. At least there must be some such faint hope hiding around here somewhere.
. . . nothing can do about it . . .
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Prayerfulness and personal preparedness--at least in heart and spirit are better than lack of same, regardless.
Your logic escapes me. Maybe I'm too tired. I just really do not understand what you are saying.
Your attitude rings several bells, however.
"President Uribe said he would consider having Colombian workers have microchips implanted into their bodies before they are permitted to enter the United States to work on a seasonal basis."
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Add to that the fact that Mexico's chief bureaucrats have all been SLAGGED . . .
very sobering.
[SLAG = SLAve taG--or meat processing tag--depending on one's designated disposition/destination]
Claiming that you won't be able to buy consumer goods is a little over the top IMO.
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I've never considered the Bible's prophetic predictions to be over the top in any respect.
Besides, dozens came true about Christ's life, death and Resurrection from 400 years before his birth.
1. Israel has become a nation again in a day after 2,000 years precisely as predicted.
2. in the same era, as predicted, Russia, China, Iran are hostile to Israel.
3. Jerusalem is a great burden around the neck of the world in the same era, as predicted.
4. A global government of tyranny is on the soon horizon in the same era, as predicted.
5. Said global government has been working for decades in secret perfecting the SLAG chip implant that 'just happens' to fit precisely the Biblical prediction of citizens under the global government being unable to buy or sell ANYTHING without the ID.
6. The global economic exchange infrastructure is virtually already in place--all but in place--even in out of the way places in third world countries.
7. Israel's neighbors are hostile to her and intent on wiping her off the map, as predicted, for this era.
8. Duplicity and deception are the order of the day, as predicted, as predicted for this era.
9. Rank evil and corruption of every kind have multiplied geometrically, as predicted, for this era.
10. people are running to and fro rapidly over the globe as Biblically predicted for this era.
11. knowledge has increased and the exchange of knowledge has increased astronomically in this era, as predicted.
12. Signs in the Heavens have increased dramatically in frequency, drama and variety, as predicted for this era.
. . .
. . .
If you believe all that and much more is all due to chance plus time coincidence . . . then you have more faith in such an illogical notion than I could ever begin to have.
Rome and Nero did not come CLOSE
to fulfilling all the dozens of predictions about the Anti Christ etc.
a couple or so, maybe--maybe. That doesn't come close.
This ID form will not be used to target you for punishment due to race, creed, ethnicity, gender, sexual preference or anything of the kind. This ID will be used to make ordinary functions in society be orderly, organized, and far more efficient than it is today.
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Didn't Hitler make such claims about some of his bureaucratic moves early in his regime?
Your faith in the benevolence of increasingly powerful and intrusive bureaucracy is . . . astounding . . . mystifying . . . shocking . . . and all the more so found on a conservative forum.
Please tell me you are not some social scientist who hasn't much of a clue about human nature.
The globalists waited for the right "crisis" to emerge, and then they got all their hearts' desires. They were correct in assuming that the American people would become docile as sheep when facing a national security threat.
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Agreed,
though, the globalists didn't wait for any crisis. They have had a series of them planned and carefully staged, implemented step by step for decades. Some claim WWI and WWII etc. etc. etc. were such. Certainly the war on terror is.
Wehrner von Braun told Dr Carol Rosin, his PhD assistant the last years of his life dying of cancer--told her in 1974 that the Soviet Union would be delisted as the world's boogy man. Then there would be a war on terror. Then a war with Iraq. Then a war with ET in space.
Rosin as Division VP at Fairchild later was in a meeting of said puppet masters when such was being discussed and planned. She threw a fit and ended up resigning. She was looked on as naive and un-with-it.
But at least she had her confirmation that what von Braun had said was true.
I would never want to clame that tyranny, bureaucracy, evil, etc. are exceedingly logical.
I think there's something about that mentality that would prefer to have something mechanical/electronic inserted in human beings.
Regardless, it will be.
Doesn't it also say that those who will be saved are to be marked first,Doesn't it also say that those who will be saved are to be marked first,
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Not by a long shot. Scripture is quite clear that anyone accepting the mark will be banned from Heaven and an eternal relationship with God. It's one of the end time issues and events that will separate the sheep from the goats.
Believers may have to be martyred to avoid it--but that must be our choice if we truly love God and seek eternal life.
Doesn't it also say that those who will be saved are to be marked first,
It will be the American People that lose if Hillary gets in there...
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And the world, actually. Shrillery is eager to rush all this global tyranny stuff into place at the speed of light. The GOP is just plodding along with it--seemingly--though not in all areas.
Too true and well put, imho.
seems a bit silly at this point.
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Only because you haven't dug deeply enough and researched the topic thoroughly enough.
One of the CIA/FBI's chief inventors of said chip decades ago didn't think much of it until one of his buddies showed him in Scripture what he was working on. He resigned, renewed his relationship with God and went around the country warning people about it because he KNEW from his job the seriousness, the plans and how accurate Scripture was about it all. Then, as I recall, he died an early death. I forget the ostensible reason.
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