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VANITY; Islam gave us "Zero".
2/10/11 | Self

Posted on 02/10/2011 3:45:34 PM PST by jd777

May I begin, by saying, I love this country, the United States of America, It is the greatest hope in the history of our planet, save the works of the prophets of God. I add that I have never voted for a Democrat - and I probably never will - although JFK did cut taxes and I wish he had lived longer. Also: I believe that we were endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights, foremost being the freedom of speech. Jim Robinson, Thank you.

So: If I be banned for what I am about to write, then I be damned.

I ask that the admin's allow me this Post.

Now:

Our tremendous pride and the influence of Holy Mother the Church notwithstanding - 1000 years after the birth of Christ - Europe was lost in the midst of a DARK AGE. When Charlemagne was brought to Rome and became the first Holy Roman Emperor- He was unable to read or write- in any language. He was illiterate and so we're all of his kings. Do not ask me to footnote this fact, for I presume the church in ad 800 was not anxious to publicize that their first Holy Roman Emperor could not read.

But how could this be? Well, There was no education. Cast your minds back dear freepers to AD 1000. Before the university in Paris, or Oxford and Cambridge. The only education was offered by the Catholic church and you had to take holy orders to recieve it. The only subjects taught were (1) a tiny bit of Philosophy - all classical philosophy was lost - and (2) Theology. The study of the nature of God. They had conferences where Bishops would literrally discuss how many angels could fit on the head of a pin.

When French scholars in the early 11th centrury went down to Moorish Spain -Al andalus - They were amazed to find the 2nd largest library in the world. The largest library in the world at that time was in Baghdad. The largest library in Christain Europe was in Avignon where they had 2000 volumes. The great Library in Cordoba had 400,000 volumes.There - europeans recived their own heritage back. Jewish scholars in al andalus translated the great works of Socrates, Plato, Aristole, Pythagoras etc FROM ARABIC into European language and gave them to their awestruck visitors.

Forget the books. The hundreds of thousands of Books. For one moment. The building. Of the Library, itself. And the Great Mosque nearby were 1000 times greater than anything ever built to that time in all of Christendom.

Now I'm sure some of you are indignant at reading this, but that can not compare to the vehemence the Pope and his bishops felt at hearing this news. How could this be? 1000 years after Christ's birth? It must have been like the Jews in captivity in Babylon who said to their leaders: "I thought we were the chosen people - what happened? "

What does one do when presented with facts such as this - well, you think fast, in Babylon they wrote the TALMUD - In Rome they cried: "CRUSADE"

The history of the Crusades is beyond the scope of this post- but what did occur is evidenced by what happened in Europe after 1099. Europeans received "zero" from Islam - So the haters cry - and how true - We did not have a "ZERO" in our number system. Arabs gave us "0" - along with all our other arabic numerals. But it didn't stop there. Al-JABR aka Algerbra was received. Basic Calculus and Trignometry. And with that came Engineering - Lost since Ancient Rome. The Templars set about building - and within 150 years they built all the great cathedrals of France - The pointed arches. That they first saw in the great mosque of Cordoba - recapitulated in Chartres. The only buildings in europe after the fall of rome were like stone huts with thick walls. The arabs showed them how to build thin walls that reached up into spires.

But the gifts went on - the Code of Chivalry - a gift of SALADIN. who sent a horse to Richard the lionheart after his own horse died in battle. Courtly Love - sung by the troubadors - really the Taribs of North Africa. Medicine - My god, Medicine. If you were injured during the crusades pray you had an arab doctor - because there was no medicine in Europe. The arabs gave us "the Canon of Medicine" - It was taught for 500 years in European Universities - after it was given to us. But you tell me - who wrote the Canon of Medicine? Please, look it up

So, if parts of the Islamic world have now experienced their own dark age. May we not return the favor? Was not the legacy of the Knights Templar the two riders on the same horse? That we fought together, but we were brothers all along and knew it not? Are not we all the Children of Abraham?

Therefore, I plead for peace,

In closing I wish to say. God Bless the United States of America. The Constitution of our great nation. and the memory of our first true conservative Thomas Jefferson.

and oh yeah, go TEA PARTY!


TOPICS: Education; History; Religion; Science
KEYWORDS: cordoba; crusades; god; islam; islamzero; library; religionhistory; vanity; zero
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Care to discuss?
1 posted on 02/10/2011 3:45:41 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777

I am calling for Obamas resignation.


2 posted on 02/10/2011 3:48:50 PM PST by screaminsunshine (34 States)
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To: jd777

Most of the positional base 10 numeral systems in the world have originated from India, where the concept of positional numerology was first developed. The Indian numeral system is commonly referred to in the West as the Hindu-Arabic numeral system or even Arabic numerals, since it reached Europe through the Arabs.
A decimal place system has been traced back to ca. 500 in India. Before that epoch, the Brahmi numeral system was in use; that system did not encompass the concept of the place-value of numbers. Instead, Brahmi numerals included additional symbols for the tens, as well as separate symbols for hundred and thousand.

The Indian place-system numerals spread to neighboring Persia, where they were picked up by the conquering Arabs. In 662, a Nestorian bishop living in what is now called Iraq said:

I will omit all discussion of the science of the Indians ... of their subtle discoveries in astronomy - discoveries that are more ingenious than those of the Greeks and the Babylonians - and of their valuable methods of calculation which surpass description. I wish only to say that this computation is done by means of nine signs. If those who believe that because they speak Greek they have arrived at the limits of science would read the Indian texts they would be convinced even if a little late in the day that there are others who know something of value.

The addition of zero as a tenth positional digit is documented from the 7th century by Brahmagupta, though the earlier Bakhshali Manuscript, written sometime before the 5th century, also included zero. But it is in Khmer numerals of modern Cambodia is where the first extant material evidence of zero as a numerical figure, dating its use back to the seventh century, is found.[4]

As it was from the Arabs that the Europeans learned this system, the Europeans called them Arabic numerals; ironically, to this day the Arabs refer to their numerals as Indian numerals. In academic circles they are called the Hindu-Arabic or Indo-Arabic numerals.


3 posted on 02/10/2011 3:49:10 PM PST by all the best
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To: jd777

When they stop wanting to kill me when they see my yarmulke, we can have a discussion.


4 posted on 02/10/2011 3:49:17 PM PST by Uncle Miltie ("And did you exchange a walk on part in a War, for a lead role in a cage?")
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To: jd777

Before you get banned, :-) thanks for the post. Husband and I were discussing the Crusades tonight at dinner. Amazed at how neither of us knew much about the history during this time. Going to start on some heavy reading.


5 posted on 02/10/2011 3:52:45 PM PST by republicangel
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To: jd777

Dear Islam,

What have you done for the world lately, but to harm it. Time to get over what was, and focus on what is..

Sincerely,

H.D.


6 posted on 02/10/2011 3:59:11 PM PST by Hoosier-Daddy ( "It does no good to be a super power if you have to worry what the neighbors think." BuffaloJack)
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To: jd777

re: the Crusades.

Islamic jihad conquered the Byzantine Empire. The Crusades were a minor counterattack.


7 posted on 02/10/2011 4:01:53 PM PST by conservatism_IS_compassion (DRAFT PALIN)
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To: republicangel
Thank you -

The real legacy of the crusades are the stories that appeared shortly thereafter of "A quest for the Holy Grail".

If the catholic church had granted salvation - and you could just go down to the local church receive communion and be saved - why was it necessary for these knights to go out to seek some missing religious icon?

enjoy reading - and don't forget to learn of Saladin and Richard the Lionheart.

8 posted on 02/10/2011 4:03:35 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777
Europeans received "zero" from Islam

And alas, now we Americans have received ZerO from Islam.

Look JD, the history of accomplishments in the Islamic world 1000 years ago is interesting, but it's completely irrelevant to the fact that hundreds of millions of modern Muslims aim to destroy civilization.

9 posted on 02/10/2011 4:07:36 PM PST by Mr. Mojo
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To: jd777
The contributions made by arabs, semites, and middle eastern peoples should not be conflated with those made by muslime. The arabic numeral system existed long before mohammerhead came along, as did the Great Library at Alexandria, which was burned by the muslime Caliph Omar.

And whatever miraculous technological acumen the middle east could boast 2,000 years ago, it hasn't advanced much over that time. It remains mired in a mentality that western civilization overcame at least 500 years ago.

THAT is the "gift" islam has wrought.

The first book published on movable type (a western invention, by the way) was a Bible. Music as we know it today arose from Gregorian chants that praised God. Theater was an offshoot of Passion Plays that depicted various scenes from biblical history. And the triumph of individual dignity over the oppression of tyrants arose because every human is possessed of a spark of the Divine.

THOSE are the gifts of Judeo-Christianity.

Equivalency denied.

10 posted on 02/10/2011 4:12:06 PM PST by IronJack (=)
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To: jd777

The Muslims take credit for a lot of things that they discovered after they conquered a people. In truth, they’re idiots.


11 posted on 02/10/2011 4:15:05 PM PST by youngidiot (Don't let the name fool ya, toots.)
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To: jd777
To All:

Islam does not Equal Arab!

In the past - ARABS have gifted Western Civilization with priceless knowledge.

What good has islam done for the world lately?

12 posted on 02/10/2011 4:16:01 PM PST by Dacus943
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To: Mr. Mojo

Thank you for reading - And I do take your point, But perhaps if history doesn’t repeat. It rhymes - 1000 years later its still the same: They’re not going away - and neither are we. So....


13 posted on 02/10/2011 4:17:05 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777

Oh, and the more I learn about Thomas Jefferson the less I like him.


14 posted on 02/10/2011 4:17:12 PM PST by youngidiot (Don't let the name fool ya, toots.)
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To: youngidiot
youngidiot: "the more I learn about Thomas Jefferson the less I like him"

So, idiot, what have you supposedly learned that foments such a dislike for Jefferson within you?

15 posted on 02/10/2011 4:21:19 PM PST by jla
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To: jd777
......We did not have a "ZERO" in our number system. Arabs gave us "0" - along with all our other arabic numerals.....

Check This Out:

=Snip=
Indian mathematics emerged in the Indian subcontinent[1] from 1200 BCE [2] until the end of the 18th century. In the classical period of Indian mathematics (400 AD to 1200 AD), important contributions were made by scholars like Aryabhata, Brahmagupta, and Bhaskara II. The decimal number system in use today[3] and the binary number system[4] were first recorded in Indian mathematics.[5] Indian mathematicians made early contributions to the study of the concept of zero as a number,[6] negative numbers,[7] arithmetic, and algebra.[8] In addition, trigonometry[9] was further advanced in India, and, in particular, the modern definitions of sine and cosine were developed there.[10] These mathematical concepts were transmitted to the Middle East, China, and Europe[8] and led to further developments that now form the foundations of many areas of mathematics.
=Snip=

Click the link to learn more.

There are no Arabic numerals. It's a misnomer.
Even the Arabs call them The Hindu Numerals

You need to check your "facts".

16 posted on 02/10/2011 4:30:43 PM PST by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: youngidiot
He wasn't perfect :)

But he wrote our Declaration of Independence. A rather substantial contribution, no?

17 posted on 02/10/2011 4:33:38 PM PST by jd777
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To: Fiddlstix
You're right - I should have left out the numerals - But it was a pun on - Islam gave us "zero".

It sounded better than: Islam gave us "the Canon of Medicine"

Anyway - I gotta go, I'll be back in XX minutes ;)

18 posted on 02/10/2011 4:39:43 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777

Incomplete and selective history is self-serving history, often revised by islam, which claims everything under the sun was “discovered” or invented by them.
To POST self-serving revisionist history is...self serving. My question is why?


19 posted on 02/10/2011 4:40:29 PM PST by MestaMachine (Note: I do NOT capitalize anything I don't respect...like obama and/or islam..)
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To: jd777

3@me.

Ha.


20 posted on 02/10/2011 4:41:14 PM PST by bayouranger (The 1st victim of islam is the person who practices the lie.)
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To: Hoosier-Daddy

>Time to get over what was, and focus on what is..<

.
Dear H.D.

No way. Why move to the 21st century when the Koran was written in the 7th? Convert or die!

Sincerely,

Islam


21 posted on 02/10/2011 5:02:28 PM PST by 353FMG
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To: jd777
"In Rome they cried: "CRUSADE"

Actually, "crusade" was the reply to "jihad."

In your rush to credit all things good to islam you completely omitted Constantinople and the eastern Roman empire. That city retained much of Rome (art, science, medicine , architecture, etc.) that was lost in the west and it served as a jumping-off point for many of the Crusades. It must have been a major eye-opener for the Franks.

My contention is that islam picked the bones of the civilizations it overran and didn't originate much.

22 posted on 02/10/2011 5:03:39 PM PST by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: youngidiot
Correct. They stole books and texts from the libraries of the time and branded them as their own. The only difference between Muslims today and then is that back then, they had the smarts to steal the material and then claim it as their own; today they simply destroy it because the “We invented it” BS doesn't fly anymore.
23 posted on 02/10/2011 5:03:58 PM PST by majormaturity
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To: jd777

ping for later comments,


24 posted on 02/10/2011 5:04:50 PM PST by pgobrien (Obama couldn't lead people out of a burning building.....)
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To: jd777; SunkenCiv
The great Library in Cordoba had 400,000 volumes.There - europeans recived their own heritage back.

There were probably many "civilizations" that were lost along with the knowledge they had amassed. Either the evidence is under ground, or, more likely, under water.

Regardless, from what I can tell, this vanity doesn't really touch on the harm caused by the spread of Islam. Will that be a subject for a future post?

25 posted on 02/10/2011 5:24:39 PM PST by fanfan (Why did they bury Barry's past?)
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To: fanfan

They sure did — Zero’s in the White House.

But seriously, zero was “invented” in India, and borrowed from there by the Muzzies.

The Maya also had zero.

Many finer homes have the Subzero.


26 posted on 02/10/2011 6:14:58 PM PST by SunkenCiv (The 2nd Amendment follows right behind the 1st because some people are hard of hearing.)
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To: jd777

Islam gave us nothing but misery.
Greek scholars kept as muslim slaves gave us the the mathematics and science that the muslims claim as theirs.


27 posted on 02/10/2011 6:19:01 PM PST by BuffaloJack (Re-Elect President Sarah Palin 2016)
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To: BuffaloJack
nothing Jack? not even the Canon of medicine?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Canon_of_Medicine

28 posted on 02/10/2011 7:09:39 PM PST by jd777
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To: all the best

Great point - And thank you. What about Algebra? Where did it come from?


29 posted on 02/10/2011 7:27:26 PM PST by jd777
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To: all the best
I want to revise my question, and yes, this cracks me up to ask, and I wrote this GD post, but....

who was Muḥammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī?

LOL!

30 posted on 02/10/2011 8:04:05 PM PST by jd777
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To: fanfan
Why don't you write about the harm? That's your job, My job is to love thy neighbor as I love thyself.

Maybe you heard different?

31 posted on 02/10/2011 9:32:16 PM PST by jd777
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To: IronJack

Nobody else will reply - and you are perhaps the brightest poster I saw on this thread _and I respect you - so I’ll ask you a question. Who were the Cathars and why were they killed?


32 posted on 02/10/2011 10:14:36 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777
What the Muslims did not destroy in the initial conquests, or destroy for being sacrilegious, they eventually learned to compile. Those complilations that were not then destroyed by other fanatical Muslims were sometime captured by Christians. Hence Indian concepts like Zero and Algebra came to Latin Christendom.

PS. People forget that the Eastern Roman Empire survive until 1453. It just didn't share with the descendants of those who sacked Rome.

33 posted on 02/10/2011 11:25:42 PM PST by rmlew (You want change? Vote for the most conservative electable in your state or district.)
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To: jd777

“And the Great Mosque nearby were 1000 times greater than anything ever built to that time in all of Christendom.”

An update to that, would it surprise you that there was a massive Christian church at the time, have you ever heard of “Hagia Sophia?” or the Church of the Holy Wisdom or Holy Spirit of God? That was the BIG church at the time during the dark ages.


34 posted on 02/11/2011 4:05:48 AM PST by Biggirl ("The Best Of Times, The Worse Of Times", Charles Dickens)
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To: jd777; the anti-liberal
"You state, 'its mathematicians created the algebra and algorithms that would enable the building of computers, and the creation of encryption.' The fundamental basis of modern mathematics had been laid down not hundreds but thousands of years before by Assyrians and Babylonians, who already knew of the concept of zero, of the Pythagorean Theorem, and of many, many other developments expropriated by Arabs/Muslims (see History of Babylonian Mathematics, Neugebauer)."

What Arab Civilization?

35 posted on 02/11/2011 4:32:38 AM PST by Madame Dufarge
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To: jd777
Hope this helps. Best regards. While the word algebra comes from the Arabic language (al-jabr, الجبر literally, restoration) and much of its methods from Arabic mathematics, its roots can be traced to earlier traditions, most notably ancient Indian mathematics, which had a direct influence on Muhammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī (c. 780–850). He learned Indian mathematics and introduced it to the Muslim world through his famous arithmetic text, Book on Addition and Subtraction after the Method of the Indians.[3][4] He later wrote The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing, which established algebra as a mathematical discipline that is independent of geometry and arithmetic.[5] The roots of algebra can be traced to the ancient Babylonians,[6] who developed an advanced arithmetical system with which they were able to do calculations in an algorithmic fashion. The Babylonians developed formulas to calculate solutions for problems typically solved today by using linear equations, quadratic equations, and indeterminate linear equations. By contrast, most Egyptians of this era, as well as Greek and Chinese mathematicians in the 1st millennium BC, usually solved such equations by geometric methods, such as those described in the Rhind Mathematical Papyrus, Euclid's Elements, and The Nine Chapters on the Mathematical Art. The geometric work of the Greeks, typified in the Elements, provided the framework for generalizing formulae beyond the solution of particular problems into more general systems of stating and solving equations, though this would not be realized until the medieval Muslim mathematicians. The Hellenistic mathematicians Hero of Alexandria and Diophantus [7] as well as Indian mathematicians such as Brahmagupta continued the traditions of Egypt and Babylon, though Diophantus' Arithmetica and Brahmagupta's Brahmasphutasiddhanta are on a higher level.[8] For example, the first complete arithmetic solution (including zero and negative solutions) to quadratic equations was described by Brahmagupta in his book Brahmasphutasiddhanta. Later, Arabic and Muslim mathematicians developed algebraic methods to a much higher degree of sophistication. Although Diophantus and the Babylonians used mostly special ad hoc methods to solve equations, Al-Khwarizmi was the first to solve equations using general methods. He solved the linear indeterminate equations, quadratic equations, second order indeterminate equations and equations with multiple variables.
36 posted on 02/11/2011 4:45:29 AM PST by all the best
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To: jd777
VANITY; Islam gave us "Zero".

No, it didn't. A type of notation indicating zero was used by the Sumerians about 3000 BC. It was carried to India by the Greeks and was brought by Arab merchants back from India. It was independently invented by the Mayans around 4 AD. There is very little of anything of worth created by Islamic culture but a huge deal expropriated from the cultures it conquered. Algebra is an example. It began in ancient Egypt and Babylon. Just because it later had an Arabic name applied to it doesn't mean it was of Islamic origin.

Back to the books for you.
37 posted on 02/11/2011 4:57:12 AM PST by aruanan
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To: majormaturity

Plus now, we have the internet to back-up as a way to fight against such “bs”.


38 posted on 02/11/2011 5:12:44 AM PST by Biggirl ("The Best Of Times, The Worse Of Times", Charles Dickens)
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To: IronJack

Also in Alexandra Egypt, there is a new Great Library and as a matter of fact, there are young people who are guarding it against any possible trouble.


39 posted on 02/11/2011 5:15:20 AM PST by Biggirl ("The Best Of Times, The Worse Of Times", Charles Dickens)
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To: jd777

The Cathars (not the name they chose for themselves, by the way) were a dualistic pseudo-Christian sect that flourished in medieval France. They were heavily persecuted by the Catholic Church, resulting in their virtual eradication during the Albigensian Crusade.

They were exterminated because their theology was inconsistent to the point of heresy with the ruling religious authority of the time.

That was in the Thirteenth Century.

On Sept. 11, 2001, a band of muslime madmen hijacked four jet aircraft and crashed them into a variety of fixed objects, resulting in the deaths of at least 3,000 innocent Americans. Then there were the London subway bombings, the assaults in Mumbai, the Bali bombings, the Madrid bombings, and a host of other murders.

Those were yesterday.

Equivalency denied. Again.


40 posted on 02/11/2011 5:27:55 AM PST by IronJack (=)
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To: IronJack
I think the story has some more complex aspects to it than might appear on the surface - but i want to say, you're a very sharp guy - and you're a credit to FR.

Thanks for responding.

41 posted on 02/11/2011 7:51:01 AM PST by jd777
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To: aruanan
Thank you for the response. I wish I hadn't used the "zero" pun - alas, It was a rhetorical device. And your criticism is valid

However, Can I refer you to one contribution that the Europeans received and used for over 600 years in Europe for the benefit of our Civilization

It was called "The canon of Medicine"

From Wiki:

a 14-volume medical encyclopedia compiled by Ibn Sīnā (Avicenna) and completed in 1025.[3] It presents a clear and organized summary of all the medical knowledge of the time.[4] Originally written in the Persian and Arabic language, the book was later translated into a number of other languages, including Latin, Chinese, Hebrew, German, French, and English.[5] The Canon is considered one of the most famous books in the history of medicine.[6]

Health! JD

42 posted on 02/11/2011 8:22:55 AM PST by jd777
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To: jd777
"However, Can I refer you to one contribution that the Europeans received and used for over 600 years in Europe for the benefit of our Civilization"

Have you heard of the Roman physician Galen? His works were studied until the 19th century.

43 posted on 02/11/2011 9:44:56 AM PST by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: Flag_This
Excellent addition to the thread. Hear Hear! But - as my article mentions -the works of Ancient Rome and Greece - The Great treasures of the world - were all but completely lost in Western Christendom by AD 1000. Hard to believe but it is true. They did not know of those works existence.

From the 11th century onwards, Latin translations of Islamic medical texts began to appear in the West, Among those was ibn Sina's Canon of Medicine and the the much earlier Work of Galen et al.

But they were received back to Europe - translated from Arabic.

44 posted on 02/11/2011 10:31:44 AM PST by jd777
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To: jd777
Stll pimping Islam I see... Pederasty..aka....buggery... Middle East and Central AsiaIn pre-modern Islam there was a "widespread conviction that beardless youths possessed a temptation to adult men as a whole, and not merely to a small minority of deviants."[42] In central Asia the practice is reputed to have long been widespread, and remains a part of the culture, as exemplified by the proverb, Women for breeding, boys for pleasure, but melons for sheer delight.[43] In the Ottoman Empire culture, young male dancers, usually cross-dressed in feminine attire, were called Köçek. Youth conversing with suitors Miniature illustration from the Haft Awrang of Jami, in the story A Father Advises his Son About Love. Freer and Sackler Galleries, Smithsonian Institution, Washington, DC.In post-Islamic Persia, where, as Louis Crompton claims, "boy love flourished spectacularly", art and literature also made frequent use of the pederastic topos. These celebrate the love of the wine boy, as do the paintings and drawings of artists such as Reza Abbasi (1565 – 1635). Western travelers reported that at Abbas' court (some time between 1627 and 1629) they saw evidence of homoerotic practices. Male houses of prostitution amrad khaneh, "houses of the beardless", were legally recognized and paid taxes.[44] Osman Agha of Temeşvar who fell captive to the Austrians in 1688 wrote in his memoirs that one night an Austrian boy approached him for sex, telling him "for I know all Turks are pederasts".[45] In 1770s, Âşık Sadık the poet wrote, in an address to the Sultan: Lût kavmi döğüşür, put kavmi bozar. Askerin lûtîdir, bil Padişahım ("The people of Lot fight, the people of idolatry spoil. Know, my Sultan, that your soldiers are sodomites"). In Afghanistan in 2009, the British Army commissioned a report into the sexuality of the local men after British soldiers reported the discomfort at witnessing adult males involved in sexual relations with boys. The report stated that though illegal, there was a tradition of such relationships in the country, known as "bache bazi" or boy play, and that it was especially strong around Kandahar.[47] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pederasty
45 posted on 02/11/2011 1:10:01 PM PST by Crim (The Obama Doctrine : A doctrine based on complete ignorance,applied with extreme incompetence..)
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To: Crim
Dear Crim - it's great to hear from you again. I missed you ;) And what work you did on that topic. You seem very involved with your research, Well done. I certainly won't bother to summarize homosexuality in Euope since Ancient Greece Rome, and the Renaissance. Like I care. But I will Quote Winston Churchill: "The real traditions of the British Navy are rum, buggery and the lash."

And how about that Pope Benedict and his "hunky" (not my word) private secretary?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/2008/04/21/2008-04-21_pope_benedicts_hunky_private_secretary_h-2.html

Seems like everybody in power has their own body man aka "Reggie Love".

Ferstay?

46 posted on 02/11/2011 1:35:35 PM PST by jd777
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To: jd777

Nice crabwalk and attempt at a bait an switch...too bad the british buggery was between MEN , not MEN and BOYS which is STILL an islamic tradition....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bacha_bazi

Which is ironic seeing as the penalty under sharia law for homosexuality is Death.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_topics_and_Islam


47 posted on 02/11/2011 2:13:09 PM PST by Crim (The Obama Doctrine : A doctrine based on complete ignorance,applied with extreme incompetence..)
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To: jd777
Why don't you write about the harm? That's your job, My job is to love thy neighbor as I love thyself.

Maybe you heard different?

WinTheFuture are you talking about?
My job?
Heard different? About what?

You posted a vanity and invited discussion.
I made a post and asked you a question.

48 posted on 02/11/2011 4:33:09 PM PST by fanfan (Why did they bury Barry's past?)
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To: jd777
"But they were received back to Europe - translated from Arabic."

Where did the muslims get their versions? From the Byzantines - a.k.a. Eastern Roman Empire. The returning crusaders were heavily influenced by Constantinople.

The one positive aspect of the muslim conquests was their imposing a single language over a huge geographic area which facilitated the spread of ideas from east to west.

49 posted on 02/11/2011 6:55:17 PM PST by Flag_This (Real presidents don't bow.)
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To: fanfan
MY apology - I just saw that the question was - will you now write about the harm of a religion? - I felt that topic had been covered here ad infinitum.

Thank you for reading and responding to my post. I appreciate your input. Cheers, JD

50 posted on 02/12/2011 8:40:48 AM PST by jd777
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