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Old times not forgotten: Civil War at 150
hosted ^ | Apr 2 | CHRISTOPHER SULLIVAN

Posted on 04/02/2011 7:53:41 AM PDT by JoeProBono

A hush fell over the crowd filling the elegant hall in downtown Richmond, Va. The vote was about to be announced, and a young staffer of the Museum of the Confederacy balanced his laptop across his knees, poised to get out the news as soon as it was official.

Who would be chosen "Person of the Year, 1861"?

Five historians had made impassioned nominations, and the audience would now decide.

Most anywhere else, the choice would be obvious. Who but Abraham Lincoln? But this was a vote in the capital of the rebellion that Lincoln put down, sponsored by a museum dedicated to his adversary. How would Lincoln and his war be remembered in this place, in our time?

A century and a half have passed since Lincoln's crusade to reunify the United States. The North and the South still split deeply on many issues, not least the conflict they still call by different names. All across the bloodstained arc where the Civil War raged, and beyond, Americans are deciding how to remember....

(Excerpt) Read more at hosted.ap.org ...


TOPICS: History
KEYWORDS: anniversary; civilwar; dixie; militaryhistory
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To: JoeProBono; PeaRidge; cowboyway; Idabilly; mstar; rustbucket; lentulusgracchus; southernsunshine

This one is getting nasty.


51 posted on 04/02/2011 9:43:46 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

You’re too much! Your ‘’country’’ is one of fifty states subject to the laws the rest of the other 49 are. So have at it you deluded fool, for you its 1861 isn’t it?


52 posted on 04/02/2011 9:45:59 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa
You’re too much! Your ‘’country’’ is one of fifty states subject to the laws the rest of the other 49 are. So have at it you deluded fool, for you its 1861 isn’t it?

You are gone. It was supposed to be the other way around, the FedGov™ was to be subservient to the states EXCEPT for a few things codified in the USC. This is why I think things are hopeless, I come to a site called FREE REPUBLIC, for God's sake, and I get lectured by a foolish Federal apologist(I'm being nice).

53 posted on 04/02/2011 9:50:06 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: jmacusa

“...Your ‘’country’’ is one of fifty states subject to the laws the rest of the other 49 are.”

Sad.


54 posted on 04/02/2011 9:54:19 AM PDT by APatientMan (Pick a side)
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To: central_va

Actually after the Spring of 1863, the Federal Cavalry in the Army of the Potomac handled itself pretty well. It bloodied Stuart’s cavalry at Brandy Station and beat them at Gettysburg on July 3, 1863. Stuart paid with his life fighting the “inept” Federal cavalry at Yellow Tavern in 1864. And it was Federal Cavalry that contributed greatly to the failure of Lee’s Army to escape from Appomattox C.H. in 1865.

Early in the War, the Federal cavalry was hampered by command which didn’t utilize them very effectively and often relegated them to the status of simple scouts and vedettes. By Gettysburg, a generation of younger officers were at the reins (pun intended) who were much more willing to use the Federal cavalry as a mobile fighting force.

The Federal cavalry almost always had the advantage in weaponry (small arms and horse artillery) and in the quality and quantity of mounts (the Giesboro Point Depot alone trained, readied and rehabilitated thousands of cavalry mounts for Federal service).


55 posted on 04/02/2011 9:56:57 AM PDT by XRdsRev (New Jersey - Crossroads of the American Revolution)
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To: APatientMan
Sad.

Depressingly so.

56 posted on 04/02/2011 9:57:11 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: XRdsRev

I would put it this way,

Infantry - even
Cavalry - edge to the South
Artillery - overwhelming Federal advantage


57 posted on 04/02/2011 10:00:34 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

I’m not aplogizing for anything dupe, I can vote for whom I choose. You live in Virgina, one of fifty states in the nation. You can think it separate all you want. Your Confederate utopia is a dream and nothing more.


58 posted on 04/02/2011 10:01:37 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: RayChuang88

I disagree that it was their biggest blunder of the war. Frontal assaults against enemy positions were not an uncommon tactic during the Civil War. The federals did the same thing many time (Antietam, Spotsylvania, Cold Harbor, Petersburg). I would submit that the Confederacy’s biggest tactical military blunder was not pushing on to Washington DC after the First battle of Manassas in 1861. They were facing a disorganized and shattered Federal Army in full retreat and did not press the advantage they had. Never again did they have such an opportunity as presented itself then.


59 posted on 04/02/2011 10:02:19 AM PDT by XRdsRev (New Jersey - Crossroads of the American Revolution)
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To: APatientMan

Sad? Sad fools like you don’t realize that. Where do live?


60 posted on 04/02/2011 10:02:38 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa
You can think it separate all you want.

Just like Madison, Jefferson and Henry. I'm in good company.

61 posted on 04/02/2011 10:05:28 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

Still living in the US under the Stars and Stripes, and the Constitution of the United States, right?


62 posted on 04/02/2011 10:10:38 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa
Still living in the US under the Stars and Stripes, and the Constitution of the United States, right?

I pay taxes to an empire, the government of the USA has devolved into nothing more than a corrupt entity bullying every citizen in it's path.

63 posted on 04/02/2011 10:15:17 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: central_va

So put you f;ing money where your f’ing mouth is Johnny Reb and go out and really do something about if you’re so f’ing fed up with the “Lincoln statists’’ instead of mouthing off on a web-site. You hate the country you’re living in, the “Federal Empire’’? Do something about then, really do something or just shut the Hell up and be grateful you live in the country you do. There are MILLIONS who would gladly come here to have what you do.


64 posted on 04/02/2011 10:21:13 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: RayChuang88
You'd think the very able Confederate commanders would have figured out the lessons of the Battle of Bunker Hill (the British lost over 1,000 soldiers in taking Breed's Hill) and NOT do a direct frontal attack on enemy position that had a major height and sight advantage over the attackers.

You's think that any commander would have figured out the lessons, especially considering how he slaughtered his own troops on the slope at Malvern Hill a little over a year before, and had massacred the Federal Troops storming is army on Marye's Heights outside of Fredericksburg the previous December.

65 posted on 04/02/2011 10:21:32 AM PDT by K-Stater
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To: jmacusa
Where do (you) live?

You first. Which S.S.R. is it?

66 posted on 04/02/2011 10:21:58 AM PDT by Dr.Deth
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To: Dr.Deth

I live in New Jersey, in the United States off America. Where do live Johnny Reb? Are you another one who doesn’t like it here? Then why don’t all of you loud-mouth Lost Causers REALLY do something about what’s bugging you all 150 years later? Put your money where your big mouths are and do something. I dare you... You’re nothing but inter-net loud mouths and real life cowards.


67 posted on 04/02/2011 10:25:58 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa
New Jersey? Must be something in the water up there. shut the Hell up and be grateful you live in the country you do.

Not exactly original advice... I seem to recall hearing it from Chinese in 1949, Germans in 1933, Russians in 1917...

There are MILLIONS who would gladly come here to have what you do.

And many, many more who would gladly come here to take what you have. And maybe even let you live a while.

Sonny, maybe you shouldn't spend your seven-month anniversary picking so many fights.

68 posted on 04/02/2011 10:30:26 AM PDT by Dr.Deth
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To: jmacusa
You hate the country you’re living in, the “Federal Empire’’?

I love my State, Virginia, which is currently trapped , by force of arms in 1865, in the Federal Empire formerly a republic called the USA.

There are MILLIONS who would gladly come here to have what you do.

Funny, one of the Federal Empire's missions is to secure the border, they can't even do that.

Restore the republic and my "love" may return. Not holding my breath.

I pay my taxes so that can't jail me yet.

69 posted on 04/02/2011 10:30:26 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: jmacusa
I live in New Jersey

The armpit of Yankeeland, figures.

PS: Your fat RINO Governor doesn't impress.

70 posted on 04/02/2011 10:33:40 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Dr.Deth

Sonny, the fact of the matter is you Southerners lost. And your pathetic attempt to compare America today to Germany or Russia of 1933 or 1917 is just that, pathetic. Picking fights? Hardly, despite its faults I live in the greatest country on Earth. Where do live, sonny?


71 posted on 04/02/2011 10:42:11 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa

“Sad? Sad fools like you don’t realize that. Where do live?”

Name calling and twisting my words - you seem like a guy with a lot of integrity.

I said “Sad” because I do realize what the situation is. Go read it again - take your time. It will come to you.

You seem satisfied with what I consider the overreach of the Fed Gov. Good for you. Life is easier that way I suppose. Some of us are not satisfied with it. It makes me smile to know that it bothers folks like you.

Where I live is not your business.


72 posted on 04/02/2011 10:44:05 AM PDT by APatientMan (Pick a side)
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To: central_va

Great way to miss the point Johnny Reb. What are you going to do about it? You’re a coward. Why don’t you march on Washington or something? Hey, here’s a good idea, start taking pot shots at Ft. Sumter again, get the ball rolling.


73 posted on 04/02/2011 10:44:30 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: APatientMan

Another coward.


74 posted on 04/02/2011 10:46:21 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: jmacusa

LOL


75 posted on 04/02/2011 10:50:56 AM PDT by APatientMan (Pick a side)
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To: jmacusa
When, if ever, a state(s) actually decides to secede legally by an act of the state legislature and the approval of the Governor of that state(s), I will go there and join their military. If your empire declares war on this state(s) then you will be the enemy and I would not hesitate to follow the orders of an officer of non-commissioned officer of the Army of that State(s)to cause harm or destruction to NJ, DC or anything else in enemy territory.

Until that time, if ever, I will remain a tax paying subject of the Federal Empire. Hopefully the republic can be restored without war, but you Yankees have a terrible track record. Do I make myself clear.

76 posted on 04/02/2011 10:54:30 AM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: jmacusa

New Jersey..oh, you live in that SSR. Y’all ought to go out and buy some guns and do something about that- except you pretty much can’t, ‘cause you live in NJ. And if it is so great there....why is it you guys keep moving down here and polluting our space with your socialism, toll roads and other assorted Yankee crap?


77 posted on 04/02/2011 11:16:39 AM PDT by GenXteacher (He that hath no stomach for this fight, let him depart!)
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To: donmeaker

“Would this be the RE Lee who impregnated his and his father in law’s female slaves so he could profitably sell the female children to brothels? That fellow?”

Would you care to share the source of this information, in order to establish its veracity?


78 posted on 04/02/2011 11:18:43 AM PDT by GenXteacher (He that hath no stomach for this fight, let him depart!)
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To: GenXteacher

I’m not a socialist , no one prevented me from buying a gun here. I don’t like toll roads either. You’re a teacher? Jeez, I’d love to see what you turn out of the classroom.


79 posted on 04/02/2011 11:35:37 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: central_va

Yeah, loud and clear: You’re a coward.


80 posted on 04/02/2011 11:36:43 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: APatientMan

“LOL” Laugh a lot at yourself do you?


81 posted on 04/02/2011 11:37:29 AM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: K-Stater

Hi Non - still hiding under that new handle? Knew you couldn’t stay away from WBTS very long


82 posted on 04/02/2011 12:05:13 PM PDT by stainlessbanner
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To: EternalVigilance
Or the murdering of Confederate POW's by the 6th Tennessee Cavalry, USA.
Andersonville was bad but since the North had ample resources and men why was the percentage of deaths in POW camps in the North only 4% less that the Southern Prisons?
Or the rape of female freedwomen by Sherman's bummers through Georgia?
Ft. Pillow was investigated by the Federals and found that the refusal of the Union soldiers to surrender was a major reason for the large number of casualties. Even Sherman was on the board of inquiry.
Or the sending of black regiments because the commanders thought the blacks to be cheap into battles where the reason was to just have the enemy to expend ammunition like at Olustee or the Battle of the Crater?

The Union was stained with just as much racism as was the South and unbiased historians know this.

83 posted on 04/02/2011 12:06:05 PM PDT by vetvetdoug
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To: jmacusa

Yes, NJ believes in such rights that one cannot even own weapons there without much paperwork and the threat of confiscation. THAT NJ? Can you carry a pistol in your car without registration? Can you have 100 rifles that aren’t registered in your house and carry them to a shoot? How safe are you in downtown Newark unarmed?


84 posted on 04/02/2011 12:11:43 PM PDT by vetvetdoug
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To: central_va
I see you assailed unjustly by what appear to be products of the Empire's “education” system. Having raised children exposed to this system of Indoctrination - not Education - I am very familiar with “public” education's insidious attack on mind and spirit, and of the great effort required to save a growing child from mindless conditioned emotionalism and to preserve the child's natural inclination towards critical thought and self awareness.

My sympathies and warm regards. The War was a great tragedy and destroyed the Republic. We live in post Republic times; there are metaphors in 2nd Century Rome.

85 posted on 04/02/2011 12:14:29 PM PDT by Iris7 ("Do not live lies!" ...Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn)
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To: vetvetdoug

No argument there. I’m not happy about the gun laws here but where in America can you legally buy a gun without paper work? And your Confederate utopia would allow guns for all no problem?


86 posted on 04/02/2011 12:16:41 PM PDT by jmacusa (Two wrongs don't make a right. But they can make it interesting.)
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To: stainlessbanner

Good to see you.

Been gone a long time. I became annoyed with the increasingly vulgar discourse.

Can’t resist this post. Got a live one on the hook.


87 posted on 04/02/2011 12:20:43 PM PDT by Iris7 ("Do not live lies!" ...Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn)
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To: stainlessbanner
Hi Non - still hiding under that new handle? Knew you couldn’t stay away from WBTS very long

Obviously you have me confused with someone else.

88 posted on 04/02/2011 12:28:28 PM PDT by K-Stater
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To: Iris7

Howdy Iris7 - good to hear from you. I’ve been keeping a low profile, too. Sometimes you can’t resist jumping in the fray, other times you realize there are non-FR things to be done, other priorities.


89 posted on 04/02/2011 12:30:25 PM PDT by stainlessbanner
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To: central_va


90 posted on 04/02/2011 1:09:54 PM PDT by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet - Visualize)
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To: central_va; jmacusa; GenXteacher
This one is getting nasty.

Indeed!

jmacusa - The gentleman from Virgina you are assailing is a US Navy veteran. Also, the slur you apply to a conservative North Carolina teacher is egregiously misplaced. You could learn much from both of them if you allow yourself the privilege.

91 posted on 04/02/2011 1:27:20 PM PDT by southernsunshine
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To: All
Comparing any damage the South did to the atrocities of Sheridan in the Shenandoah Valley or Sherman's March to the Sea is simply stupid.
Like comparing corporal to capital punishment.

One thing is for sure,like in all wars,there was a lot of mendacious propaganda churned out then and some of it is repeated now.
But the scars and shattered lives caused by the evil Yankee invaders will still be long remembered because it actually happened.

92 posted on 04/02/2011 1:31:20 PM PDT by Happy Rain ("WARNING" -Sarah Palin is a very dangerous woman--she defends herself when attacked.)
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To: donmeaker

>Would this be the RE Lee who impregnated his and his father in law’s female slaves so he could profitably sell the female children to brothels?<

Have you stopped beating your wife yet?


93 posted on 04/02/2011 1:39:14 PM PDT by Darnright (There can never be a complete confidence in a power which is excessive. - Tacitus)
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To: K-Stater
Obviously you have me confused with someone else.

LOL!

94 posted on 04/02/2011 1:52:00 PM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: aruanan

Lee had a problem. He had to free all the slaves named in his father in law’s will. He had to pay off his father in law’s debts. He had to give the property, unintailed to his children. By creating mostly white female slaves, not named in the will, and selling them at the highest rates, to the brothels, he could accomplish all those things. Doing that was legal, and in accordance with the honor of such a gentlemen. In asserting that he did what was necessary, I do not impugn his honor, but rather the morals of the society which held such behavior to be honorable.


95 posted on 04/02/2011 1:53:37 PM PDT by donmeaker ("Get off my lawn." Clint Eastwood, Green Ford Torino)
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To: donmeaker
By creating mostly white female slaves, not named in the will, and selling them at the highest rates, to the brothels, he could accomplish all those things.

Documentation please. Our maybe you should stop this crap.

96 posted on 04/02/2011 1:57:26 PM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: KoRn
You are correct—in 1861,like 1776,a dozen or so sovereign states again tried to exit another hostile tyranny and in the process gave birth to an almighty Federal government more than willing to rape murder and burn them back into line.
Don't get me wrong,I'm glad the South lost because of the great country we all love that emerged—well, til now anyway.
It's just the domestic precedent of the big all powerful central government the damn Yankees invented to destroy the Southern patriot that many of us can't forgive.
97 posted on 04/02/2011 1:58:13 PM PDT by Happy Rain ("WARNING" -Sarah Palin is a very dangerous woman--she defends herself when attacked.)
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To: Happy Rain
I'm glad the South lost

You're only glad because you know without the South the USA would be the USSA by now.

98 posted on 04/02/2011 2:04:39 PM PDT by central_va (I won't be reconstructed, and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Happy Rain


99 posted on 04/02/2011 2:05:10 PM PDT by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet - Visualize)
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To: central_va
I get a laugh out of these threads. Since the end of the great unpleasantness and before I have acquired relatives in Virginia, Alabama, and Mississippi. We all lost some people and have great arguments.
100 posted on 04/02/2011 2:33:02 PM PDT by Little Bill (Harry Browne is a Poofter.)
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