This Ping List is for all things pertaining to the 2nd Amendment.
FReepmail me if you want to be added to or deleted from the list.
More 2nd Amendment related articles on FR's Bang List.
Posted on 08/12/2018 5:38:29 PM PDT by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
Well, we did it. We took my Spanish 12ga shotgun with the 27.5" barrel and cut it off. Now, it has a 19" barrel and the end has been filed and finished and it is ready to go. The intended purpose is for home defense, or in a still rare case, if some group of people are causing a problem/rioting out in society as a secondary weapon. In some literary circles, such is called a "Coach Gun".
It appears some characters in history over 100 years ago determined that a cut down shotgun would be an effective weapon a close ranges when only 1-2 shots were needed to take care of a criminal who didn't know when to run. To all of us who know guns, if faced with a double-barreled 12ga at close range, and upon being informed it has 00 Buck in it, one tends to find a way to de-escalate that disagreement or run like hell. Without getting into all of the legalities and exceptions, suffice it to say that the barrel must be 18" or longer (1/8" under is a felony) and the overall length if with buttstock is 26" (Mine fits both parameters).
No long shots here. But, in the case of a home invasion or someone trying to carjack you and you can get your hands on it, it is the perfect weapon. No night sights needed. Other than that, I can see little use for it.
This Ping List is for all things pertaining to the 2nd Amendment.
FReepmail me if you want to be added to or deleted from the list.
More 2nd Amendment related articles on FR's Bang List.
Buy a box of 2 1/2” .410 shells with #9 shot. That will be plenty for snakes. Wouldn’t cut the barrel, it’s probably full choke with will put plenty of shot on target.
There was a device called a “duckbill spreader” that was used by SEALS in Vietnam that flattened out the pattern. A modern version is in production that can be screwed in like a choke tube (if it’s made to fit your gun).
The top figures in the graphic are clearly human torsos. What are the bottom figures? Termite mounds? Zombie blobs?
For a snake a machete is probably a better option. Cheap and effective.
“From what I understand, the 18” barrel length does not apply to a hand grip shotgun.”
Affirmative. This is a NEW interpretation by the notorious BATFE, since President Trump took office.
Try some minishells.
https://www.aguilaammo.com/shotshell/
look at post 47.
Birdshot at 12-14 foot can easily kill you with a body shot.
Really small shot, such as #8 might not, if no vital organs are hit. Heavier shot, like number 4, can penetrate 6 inches.
Here is a whole article on the subject.
http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2010/02/robert-farago/shotgun-penetration-with-various-rounds/
I do not think birdshot is an optimum defense load, but it is very dangerous and deadly under 15 feet.
You can legally buy a shotgun with a 14” barrel without registering it as a short barreled shotgun.
“Maybe firing our choice at night to experience the muzzle flash would be educational.”
You’re unlikely to stop and put earplugs in either. Now you can’t see or hear. Better hit with the first shot.
They look like stylized head and shoulders to me.
It is an M16-A1 25 meter target. the silhouettes are sized to represent different ranges.
The term “sawed-off” shotgun is customarily used to connote a gun the barrel of which has been shortened illegally. You can saw off the barrel until the cows come home and it’s legal (and lawful, too) so long as the muzzle remains at least 18” from the breechface. So calling a shotgun with a barrel of 18” (or longer) “sawed off” is something of a misnomer, regardless of any encounters it might have had with a hacksaw.
You might want a 32” barrel to shoot migrating geese but for two-legged varmints at horse shoe-pitchin’ range, 18” is plenty.
For that matter, a 14” bbl is plenty. But only equipping it with a pistol grip to dodge the NFA? Not a great idea. The shot pattern from 14” bbls spreads roughly one inch per two yards traveled so at 10 yards (well within the range of most home defense situations), you’re bulls-eye is only about 5” in diameter. So you still gotta aim pretty good, particularly since your target probably is not going to oblige you by standing still while you shoot him.
Not to mention trying to execute follow-up shots looks like you’re wresting a rubber snake, so you’d best make the first shot count.
I cut down my Mossberg 500 to 18.25” and put a pistol grip on (it still comes in overall at 27”). You are spot on, they kick like mules.
Thanks for the link. Yeah - I was thinking of the light stuff used for trap shooting. There was a shooting at my son’s college a few years ago. The guy (from off campus) used a shotgun with light bird shot. One guy he killed - he had the barrel against the back of his neck.
He shot three other students that were on their feet walking back to the ambulance. One photo shows a guy with a red rash about 1-foot in diameter. There is video of the gunman entering a building. A girl is shot in the chest from about 6 feet away - she turns and runs away from the gunman. She was also treated and released that same day.
Right after the gunman shoots the girl, the building monitor (boy student) sprays the guy with pepper spray as he was reloading and takes the gun away. Then tackles him and knocks the guy’s knife away.
Hmm - another learning lesson. With a double-barrel, better make sure the bad guy is down and out after the second barrel. And that he is alone. Don’t want to get jumped as you are reloading.
And another learning lesson. Don’t judge a book by it’s cover. The hero student was a small Asian kid. And he is a fan of “My Little Pony” (a “Brony”). Also is a fan of martial arts, firearms, and iirc is planning on the military after college.
I’ve killed lots of snakes with a full-length .410. As a teen, I would find them, get close to them, and put the muzzle right on their head. A longer gun helps you do that. Sometimes, they got curious enough to look down the barrel...
Only non-lethal snakes, though. Never, ever moved toward a cottonmouth on purpose.
CPC12020, Article 2: (c)(1) As used in this section, a “short-barreled shotgun” means any of the following:
(A) A firearm which is designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell and having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length.
(B) A firearm which has an overall length of less than 26 inches and which is designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell.
(C) Any weapon made from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise) if that weapon, as modified, has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length.
Sawed off shotguns are not illegal in California.
CPC12020, Article 2: (c)(1) As used in this section, a “short-barreled shotgun” means any of the following:
(A) A firearm which is designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell and having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length.
(B) A firearm which has an overall length of less than 26 inches and which is designed or redesigned to fire a fixed shotgun shell.
(C) Any weapon made from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise) if that weapon, as modified, has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length.
Sounds like he missed. Maybe she caught a stray pellet. At six feet any 12 gauge load is deadly in a chest shot.
Everything counts on the details. May he just grazed her skin.
If you have a chance, shoot something that can show penetration with a 12 gauge at six feet. A bird shot load at that range is devastating.
I usually use gallon milk plastic bottles full of water in my demonstrations.
I was wrong about her having only superficial wounds. An article about her testimony at trial:
She awoke at Harborview Medical Center and learned she’d been shot on the right side of her chest. An artery in her shoulder was hit, which is why there was so much blood, and pellets collapsed her right lung, Williams testified.
She affirmed that she didn’t want to discuss what she’s gone through to recover from her injuries and was excused after only 18 minutes on the witness stand.
*********************
Below is the video of her getting shot and the take down. The student that was killed was outside, as were one or two others that were wounded. I guess another learning point - if you’re shooting a bad guy with bird shot, he still might have plenty of energy to pull his gun and shoot back. The first thing the girl does after she turns around is pull out her phone! The way she was still acting in the video is why I didn’t think that she had been hurt that bad.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfGBiib9qBg
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.