White House Responds to All of Those Secession Petitions: There’s No Right to Secede

The Blaze ^ | 1-12-13 | Madeleine Morgenstern

[Mozilla]

The Obama administration on Friday responded to the wave of secession petitions that spread online following the November election, preaching unity over division and saying there’s no right to secede.

“In a nation of 300 million people — each with their own set of deeply-held beliefs — democracy can be noisy and controversial. And that’s a good thing. Free and open debate is what makes this country work, and many people around the world risk their lives every day for the liberties we often take for granted,” wrote Jon Carson, director of the Office of Public Engagement.

“But as much as we value a healthy debate, we don’t let that debate tear us apart,” he said.

More than two dozen states from all corners of the country filed online White House petitions after President Barack Obama’s victory over Gov. Mitt Romney, calling for the government to allow them to secede. Carson’s letter was filed in response to requests from Alabama, Florida, Georgia, Louisiana, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee and Texas, all of which garnered the necessary 25,000 signatures.

[I want the USA back]

Free and open debate is what we don’t have in this country. Political correctness means that saying truthful things is now a crime.
If I could afford to go to a more sensible place, I would.

[SeminoleCounty]

Actually, when it comes to secession, it is up to the Feds only until they no longer challenge a state.

If a state declares independence, no US court can legally compel them to follow its orders, or, any US Federal law. The Feds can only enforce the law if they choose to go to war.

Unlike the Civil War, the Feds do not have certain advantages now that they enjoyed in 1861-1865. States have much better infrastructure and communications networks now than the Confederacy did in 1860’s. Also, since so much of our manufactured products are now made overseas....the Feds would have a much harder go getting materiel for war...and some of the basic things would require foreign nations to supply...even the most blithering Globalist apologist knows that this would be a great opportunity for Communist China to slap down a US federal government in war with seceeding states.

[M Kehoe]

there’s no right to secede.

Yes there is (Declaration of Independence, and Article V of the Constitution), it didn't go well the first time.

Even though it didn't go well the first time, maybe we need to hit the reset button (Second amendment), one more time...

5.56mm

[Paine in the Neck]

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness."

I read that as affirming that we do have the right to seek just government, whether that's through secession - or other means. Don't expect me to be bound by that suicide pact that is the "living constitution".

Geo. III didn't think secession was a right either. It finally comes down to who can make their assertion stick.

[windsorknot]

we don’t let that debate tear us apart

The jug-eared jackass is all about tearing us apart.

[First_Salute]

The decision, power, and right to secede are states’ rights; such powers were not authorized to the federal government in our Constitution.

The government of the United States of America exists, and serves, at the pleasure of the states’ legislatures and the American citizens are who residents of those states who duly and lawfully elected representatives to their legislature. The states and the union do not exist at the pleasure of the federal goverment.

At any time, a three-fourths majority of the states’ legislatures can agree to completely replace the existing federal government.

At any time, a three-fourths majority of the states’ legislatures can agree to dissolve the union.

At all times, the people, thru their duly-elected representatives sitting in the states’ legislatures, are the lawful authors outranking the federal government.

In a nutshell, the states can tell the federal government or any agent(s) or official(s) of the federal government: “You’re fired!” If the federal government refuses to submit, then the states may exercise martial power to affect relief and replace, as well as restore the federal government to operating in adherence to whatever the states’ legislatures decide will be the Amended Constitution.

[MarineBrat]

I pledge here and now that if a state attempts to secede from this union, and that secession is for the intent to restore a constitutional republic of traditional American values, I will sell my house and move to that state, and take up arms in its defense.

[Travis McGee]

And the 2A is the line in the sand.

Ask the Armenians, Russians, and the Jews:

Did the Turks, Soviets and Nazis treat them better, or worse, after they were disarmed in the name of “public safety?”

[PubliusMM]

It’s not the Constitution that assures the right of secession. It’s the Declaration of Independence...by its very existence.

[varina davis]

“Right. Nothing the White House can say can stop a state or states from leaving. It would help protect the state from a tyrannical government.”

Hmmm.... seems to me that’s exactly what President Jefferson Davis believed, as well as Generals Robert E. Lee, Stonewall Jackson and a thousands of Confederate soldiers and citizens.

[Texas Fossil]

I want no part of secession. I want it all back and the Lying Commie B_tards in jail.

No Right? BS!

July 4th, 1776

..”Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, —That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. ....

---

Rights are granted by God not Government. Certainlty not the Lying POS who sleeps in our house at 1600 Penn. Ave.

[x]

Also, since so much of our manufactured products are now made overseas....the Feds would have a much harder go getting materiel for war...and some of the basic things would require foreign nations to supply...even the most blithering Globalist apologist knows that this would be a great opportunity for Communist China to slap down a US federal government in war with seceeding states.

Secession attempts would be fun for China even if the US didn't resist them. In fact, you could probably look forward to China supporting such movements.

Unlike the Civil War, the Feds do not have certain advantages now that they enjoyed in 1861-1865. States have much better infrastructure and communications networks now than the Confederacy did in 1860’s.

No state is ever likely to be as unified about anything as the cotton-belt states were about slavery in 1860.

Secession now would mean a true "civil war" (if the last one some how wasn't): fighting in the streets of Atlanta or Dallas, Charlotte or Houston.

Maybe brother against brother and neighbor against neighbor, but certainly one side of town against the other.

Enjoy.

[Matthew10]

There are, at the very minimum, two states, who by their constitution can secede.

Texas: http://www.constitution.legis.state.tx.us/

and Maine: http://www.maine.gov/legis/const/

Both also allow the use of deadly force to protect self and property that is lawfully owned.

[TexasTransplant]

“... democracy can be noisy and controversial.”

When the gun grabbing starts it’s going to be very noisy and “confrontational”

TT

[central_va]

fighting in the streets of Atlanta or Dallas, Charlotte or Houston.

Funny how you chose only Southern cities to make you point. LOL, you are SOOOOOO transparent.

[central_va]

In a world where 8 million Israeli's can form their own country surrounded by enemies, the excuses I have seen on Free Republic making it somehow impossible for a state or group of states to form their own country as impossible are laughable.

Here are some of the best (lame) excuses so far:

-states cant secede because of the power grid.

-China will invade us.

-There will be a riot in a city somewhere.

-There will be chaos(like the state governments don't even exist)

It is getting funny.....

[x]

Ain't nobody up here going to secede, brother.

Also, it's too cold for street-fighting.

With all the ice somebody could slip and get hurt.

In any case, is Dallas really a Southern city?

[rockrr]

They are gathering info - addresses and attitudes. It will all become clear shortly...

[x]

In a world where 8 million Israeli's can form their own country surrounded by enemies

The rest of us live in a world where things are way, way more complicated than that. For starters, think "nuclear weapons" and "alliance with the US."

the excuses I have seen on Free Republic making it somehow impossible for a state or group of states to form their own country as impossible are laughable.

Maybe to you. You and your kind are willing to wade through seas of blood to get what you want. And you don't even understand that the goal is unattainable -- that nobody's following you.

The country is already mixed together enough -- North, South, East, West -- that it's hard to separate out states or regions. The kind of solidarity the 19th century slave states had is impossible nowadays.

People are also a little less blood-thirsty than they were a century ago, and that's not entirely a bad thing.

[IronJack]

Secession, by its very nature, does not require the approval of the federal government. That's a lot like saying if you want to escape from jail, you need to get the warden's permission.

In fact, a state could secede simply by refusing to participate in any federal activities. Who are the feds going to arrest? And how are they going to compel compliance?

For example, let's say a state declares itself independent, then prohibits employers in that state from withholding federal taxes. The feds can stomp around all they want and muscle their way into the statehouse, but then what?

Furthermore, if all the citizens of the state refused to pay federal taxes, the load on the IRS would be so great they could not possibly prosecute all of them.

Or the citizens could simply declare themselves not bound by laws passed in another jurisdiction and go on about their lives.

Secession can be accomplished in a lot of ways, many of which don't begin with gunfire.