Skip to comments.The road of jihad
Posted on 04/27/2013 7:04:26 PM PDT by cunning_fish
Last week in the U.S., Europe, and the Caucasus, people are asking how the terrorists got to Europe and then into the United States. Why didn't they have problems when moving into these countries, while ordinary citizens encounter enormous problems trying to enter these countries even on tourist visas.
Just a week before the infamous acts of terrorism in Boston, I began to study the way in which a hypothetical terrorist could conceivably enter legally into the United States.
I am not arguing that this happened in the case of Tsarnaev, but it is a fact that this route is accessible to terrorists. And it does not require any special knowledge or financial costs.
I got this idea from something that happened to one of my friends here in the Republic of Georgia. She is an ethnic Kurd.
Georgia and Azerbaijan have become very close to Turkey. The Georgian government, under pressure from the Turkish Prime Minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan, began to build a mosque named after the conquering Sultan Suleiman Abdel Aziz in Georgia, using Georgia taxpayers' money.
In part because of this, ethnic Kurds have started gradually to leave Georgia, because they do not consider themselves to be protected in this country. They are looking for ways to move to Europe, where, in their opinion, they will be more secure than at home in Georgia.
One Kurd told me a story that is very interesting to me, and I think part of her story will raise the curtain on how some terrorists enter the United States.
If you want to enter the E.U. from Georgia, you need a visa. As with the U.S., even getting a tourist visa can be very difficult. You need to collect a lot of documents, including a birth certificate and a document from your bank certifying that you have the money for the trip -- about 8,000 U.S. dollars. Of course, not everyone can gather all these documents, and even if you have collected all the documents, there is no guarantee that you will be given a visa. But there's another way. It is cheaper but more dangerous. My Kurdish acquaintance wanted to take advantage of just this way.
This is her story. From Tbilisi she flew to Minsk, Belarus. In Minsk she boarded the train and reached the city of Brest. At Brest she boarded the train to Warsaw, Poland. Poland is a member of the E.U., and there is a camp there for those who are running away from the former Soviet Union. On the train with her were for some young people who were ethnic Chechens.
"They joked with me all the way," she recalled. "They said I wasn't missing anything in Europe, and that it was better to go home. They said I wouldn't be let into Europe anyway. I did not believe that. I told them that the Turks kill Kurds, and that it was dangerous to live in Georgia. They continued to laugh. They said that if I accepted Islam, I could avoid being sent to the harem of some Turkish businessman. And they also said that as Muslims, they had a very strong diaspora in Poland, Germany, France, and England, and that they had no problems entering any of those countries."
She went on:
The train reached the border of Poland and Belarus, and stopped. The Polish border guard boarded the train and asked us to show our passports. We were warned that we should say that we were "Azul" -- that is, that we were refugees.
We were taken off from the train and taken to an interview with a police officer. What Chechens told me happened: they were allowed to enter Poland, and I was not.
When I asked the officer why the Chechens were allowed in and I was not, she said, "There is a war in their country! They need our support."
While I was traveling with these Chechens, they told me that many Chechens who fought against Russia were already citizens in Poland, Germany, France and even the UK, and from there were easily able to enter the United States.
She told me this story when she came back to Georgia, and I could not understand why the Chechens were allowed to pass into Poland and she was not.
There is also another way to sneak into the U.S. This method is also not difficult. You need to take Georgian citizenship. Many citizens of Islamic countries became citizens of Georgia. Some of them are terrorists. Pamela Geller wrote about it in her article: Chechens linked to terrorism have been arrested in Turkey with Georgian passports. Chechens have no difficulty acquiring the citizenship of Arab States, Turkey and even Iran. A very large Chechen diaspora is in Turkey, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, and elsewhere in the Middle East.
Even as far back as 1995, many jihadists went to Europe using a path through Georgia to Turkey.
Many of the Caucasian mujahideen go through Georgia to go to wage jihad in Syria and elsewhere. Receiving Georgian citizenship, they can go to Turkey without a visa and without a passport. Unfortunately, they can go from there to Iran, too.
Back in 1996, Osama bin Laden wanted to establish a road by which jihadists could pass legally through Georgia to Europe and then into the United States. That is why he began to finance the construction of the road from Grozny in Chechnya to Tbilisi in Georgia. Back in 1996, many jihadists tried to settle in Poland and France. Did they succeed? And if so, are we going eventually to see even larger and more terrible acts of terrorism?
Sorry for mishap:
Source is a Jihad Watch:
Author is Joseph Zaalishvili.
Aren’t the Kurds muslims? IF not, what are they?
The road of Jihad is paved with obama’s intentions
Kurd are certainly non-muslim. A fraction of them are Alawites, but the vast majority are Ezidy.
Thanks for your reply, but you have me feeling very ignorant. OK, I could google, but freepers are smarter (lazier?) than google.
Can you give me a short explanation of those religions, because while I think I have heard of Alawites I thought they were a sect of Islam and Ezidy I’ve never heard of.
I mean, are they Christians? It would make me feel stupid to not have realized this, but of all the articles I’ve read about the Kurds I swear none ever made that clear.
If you want to tell me to go wiki myself, that will be OK too!
Excerpt: Today, the majority of Kurds are Sunni Muslim, belonging to the Shafi school. Mystical practices and participation in Sufi orders are also widespread among Kurds. There is also a minority of Kurds who are Shia Muslims, primarily living in the Ilam and Kermanshah provinces of Iran, Central and south eastern Iraq (Fayli Kurds), and who are Alevi, who mostly live in Turkey....
Ezidy are neither Christians nor Muslims. Their religion recognized as hard to comprehend for outsiders thus it is a monotheistic religion (single God - the creator centered). Their holy place is a Lalesh temple near Mosul, Iraq. They believe it is a place where God started to build Earth. There are also seven archangels and they worship the sun as well which brings a few pagan strings. In short, it is really a complicated cult.
Well, I don’t think Wiki is correct here. The majority of Kurds are living in Iraq or Turkey and for that reason they falsely identify themselves as Moslems to avoid persecution. Any Kurd I met elsewhere identifies as Ezidy.
Judging by the Heinz 57 of languages I can hear at the local Wal-Mart after dark in my local Cleveland, OH are, Not exactly close to any border except for Canada sixty miles over the water, I would say it is very easy to get into this country.
Based on the fact that they ADMIT to having 11 Million illegals in this country, meaning there is really 20 - 30 million, I would judge that entering this country is easier than boarding a bus. And don't forget your free EBT card, Housing voucher and Obama phone (Specially designed to make it easier to remote detonate)!
Let's stop kidding ourselves. The elite in this country WANT the third World immigrants to under cut our wages and vote for Democrats. They don't give a damn about the law, unless you break it and can be fined.
I think you missed author’s idea. He is telling that a law-abiding worthy immigrant or simply tourist has little to none chance to enter US legally. It is not the case for millions of savages willing to cheat the system.
from my home page
Here’s what I wrote on the subject of Iran, Iraq & Afghanistan a while back.
We SHOULD withdraw from Iraq via Tehran.
Heres how I think we should pull out of Iraq. Add one more front to the scenario below, which would be a classic amphibious beach landing from the south in Iran, and it becomes a strategic withdrawal from Iraq. And I think the guy who would pull it off is Duncan Hunter.
How to Stand Up to Iran
Posted by Kevmo to TomasUSMC
On News/Activism 03/28/2007 7:11:08 PM PDT 36 of 36
Split Iraq up and get out
***The bold military move would be to mobilize FROM Iraq into Iran through Kurdistan and then sweep downward, meeting up with the forces that we pull FROM Afghanistan in a 2-pronged offensive. We would be destroying nuke facilities and building concrete fences along geo-political lines, separating warring tribes physically. At the end, we take our boys into Kurdistan, set up a couple of big military bases and stay awhile. We could invite the French, Swiss, Italians, Mozambiqans, Argentinians, Koreans, whoever is willing to be the police forces for the regions that we move through, and if the area gets too hot for these peacekeeper weenies we send in military units. Basically, it would be learning the lesson of Iraq and applying it.
15 rules for understanding the Middle East
Rule 8: Civil wars in the Arab world are rarely about ideas like liberalism vs. communism. They are about which tribe gets to rule. So, yes, Iraq is having a civil war as we once did. But there is no Abe Lincoln in this war. Its the South vs. the South.
Rule 10: Mideast civil wars end in one of three ways: a) like the U.S. civil war, with one side vanquishing the other; like the Cyprus civil war, with a hard partition and a wall dividing the parties; or c) like the Lebanon civil war, with a soft partition under an iron fist (Syria) that keeps everyone in line. Saddam used to be the iron fist in Iraq. Now it is us. If we dont want to play that role, Iraqs civil war will end with A or B.
Lets say my scenario above is what happens. Would that military mobilization qualify as a withdrawal from Iraq as well as Afghanistan? Then, when were all done and we set up bases in Kurdistan, it wouldnt really be Iraq, would it? It would be Kurdistan.
I have posted in the past that I think the key to the strategy in the middle east is to start with an independent Kurdistan. If we engaged Iran in such a manner we might earn back the support of these windvane politicians and wussie voters who dont mind seeing a quick & victorious fight but hate seeing endless police action battles that dont secure a country.
I thought it would be cool for us to set up security for the Kurds on their southern border with Iraq, rewarding them for their bravery in defying Saddam Hussein. We put in some military bases there for, say, 20 years as part of the occupation of Iraq in their transition to democracy. We guarantee the autonomy of Iraqi Kurdistan as long as they dont engage with Turkey. But that doesnt say anything about engaging with Iranian Kurdistan. Within those 20 years the Kurds could have a secure and independent nation with expanding borders into Iran. After we close down the US bases, Kurdistan is on her own. But at least Kurdistan would be an independent nation with about half its territory carved out of Persia. If Turkey doesnt relinquish her claim on Turkish Kurdistan after that, it isnt our problem, its 2 of our allies fighting each other, one for independence and the other for regional primacy. I support democratic independence over a bullying arrogant minority.
The kurds are the closest thing we have to friends in that area. They fought against Saddam (got nerve-gassed), theyre fighting against Iran, they squabble with our so-called ally Turkey (who didnt allow Americans to operate in the north of Iraq this time around).
Its time for them to have their own country. They deserve it. They carve Kurdistan out of northern Iraq, northern Iran, and try to achieve some kind of autonomy in eastern Turkey. If Turkey gets angry, we let them know that there are consequences to turning your back on your friend when they need you. If the Turks want trouble, they can invade the Iraqi or Persian state of Kurdistan and kill americans to make their point. It wouldnt be a wise move for them, theyd get their backsides handed to them and have eastern Turkey carved out of their country as a result.
If such an act of betrayal to an ally means they get a thorn in their side, I would be happy with it. Its time for people who call themselves our allies to put up or shut up. The Kurds have been putting up and deserve to be rewarded with an autonomous and sovereign Kurdistan, borne out of the blood of their own patriots.
Should Turkey decide to make trouble with their Kurdish population, we would stay out of it, other than to guarantee sovereignty in the formerly Iranian and Iraqi portions of Kurdistan. When one of our allies wants to fight another of our allies, its a messy situation. If Turkey goes into the war on Irans side then they aint really our allies and thats the end of that.
I agree that its hard on troops and their families. We won the war 4 years ago. This aftermath is the nation builders and peacekeeper weenies realizing that they need to understand things like the 15 rules for understanding the Middle East
This was the strategic error that GWB committed. It was another brilliant military campaign but the followup should have been 4X as big. All those countries that dont agree with sending troups to fight a war should have been willing to send in policemen and nurses to set up infrastructure and repair the country.
What do you think we should do with Iraq?
Posted by Kevmo to Blue Scourge
On News/Activism 12/12/2006 9:17:33 AM PST 23 of 105
My original contention was that we should have approached the reluctant allies like the French to send in Police forces for the occupation after battle, since they were so unwilling to engage in the fighting. It was easy to see that wed need as many folks in police and nurses uniforms as we would in US Army unitorms in order to establish a democracy in the middle east. But, since we didnt follow that line of approach, we now have a civil war on our hands. If we were to set our sights again on the police/nurse approach, we might still be able to pull this one off. I think we won the war in Iraq; we just havent won the peace.
I also think we should simply divide the country. The Kurds deserve their own country, theyve proven to be good allies. We could work with them to carve out a section of Iraq, set their sights on carving some territory out of Iran, and then when theyre done with that, we can help negotiate with our other allies, the Turks, to secure Kurdish autonomy in what presently eastern Turkey.
That leaves the Sunnis and Shiites to divide up whats left. We would occupy the areas between the two warring factions. Also, the UN/US should occupy the oil-producing regions and parcel out the revenue according to whatever plan they come up with. That gives all the sides something to argue about rather than shooting at us.
38 posted on Thursday, July 12, 2007 3:55:19 PM by Kevmo (We need to get away from the Kennedy Wing of the Republican Party ~Duncan Hunter)
With both Iraq and Turkey as US ‘allies’ there is little to none chance for Kurdish state. I don’t think Kurds are into and idea to support any American cause there too and for a simple reason of a very dramatic history for any party taking American side being located in hostile environment. Ask South Vietnam, Saddam Hussein and numerous other. Priorities are windy in Washington DC. Today an ally, tomorrow a corrupt dictator and terrorist.
Why would they even want to come here legally? They could do better by coming in illegally and waiting in comfort on under the table tax free wages and government benefits until Rubio, McCain and the Democrat party gives them citizenship and voting rights.
>>>Why would they even want to come here legally?<<<
‘They’? I guess for that same reason as other good people aren’t about to break a law. Or simply because they are law-abiding Christians who have no idea to cheat the system. Why generalize? Almost everyone came to America as an immigrant or an offspring of immigrant. They built America aren’t them?
> Almost everyone came to America as an immigrant or an offspring of immigrant.
That appears to be quite true:
Who Were The First Americans?
for National Geographic News
September 3, 2003
A study of skulls excavated from the tip of Baja California in Mexico suggests that the first Americans may not have been the ancestors of today’s Amerindians, but another people who came from Southeast Asia and the southern Pacific area....
With both Iraq and Turkey as US allies
***I see you’re being ‘sarcastic’ here, so you don’t perceive either of them as particularly strong nor valuable allies.
I dont think Kurds are into an[y] idea to support any American cause there too
***Your writing is difficult to follow. I amended it to what I think you were trying to say. What I wrote wasn’t about getting Kurdish support for the “american cause”, it was about getting American support for the Kurdish cause. For freedom and autonomy of an indigenous population where it would be in our best interest in the fight against Iran, in particular.
and for a simple reason of a very dramatic history for any party taking American side being located in hostile environment.
***The French took our side when our nation was born. The brits took ‘our’ side when they were surrounded by hostile Nazis. Israel took ‘our’ side and they’re surrounded by enemies. Your point lacks weight.
Ask South Vietnam,
***South Vietnam seems like a reasonable place to start your analogy. We failed them. We didn’t take the ‘side’ of the Vietnamese people, we took the side of the anticommunists, to fight against the very same Vietnamese we had trained in WWII to fight against Japanese Imperialism but who were now motivated to fight against other perceived foreign imperialism.
Saddam Hussein and numerous other.
***Ask Saddam? When he was on ‘our’ side he thrived. When he was against us he languished. His example doesn’t exactly help what you’re trying to say.
Priorities are windy in Washington DC. Today an ally, tomorrow a corrupt dictator and terrorist.
***And the day after that, an ally again... if the nationalistic indigenous patriots are strong enough. Like Israel. Britain. France. East Germany. Japan.
I understand what you are saying. I agree.
The truth is that if American citizenship seems to go to illegals easier than to real deserving law abiding immigrants. And that SUCKS!
I live about 50 miles from the Canadian border and there are so many foreign looking/speaking people here shopping that it is amazing. Well it turns out that there are so many things that are cheaper to buy in the US than Canada that it pays them to come over and spend a day or two and shop. Bellingham WA Costco can’t keep milk on the shelves. Milk is a big one. Eggs. Gasoline. I see obviously Asian and Indian & Muslim folks with huge shopping carts at Ross, buying upwards of $1000 of stuff.
What I’m saying is that Canadians may be coming to your area to shop and not all the immigrants are living in US.
Nobody is coming from Canada to Cleveland to shop. It takes a minimum of three hours to get there by way of Detroit or Buffalo. Unless they have a really fast boat or can stand a really cold sixty mile swim.
It is local illegal aliens and Legal Resident aliens, MANY, MANY, MANY from the Middle East, MANY, MANY , MANY who are here to escape persecution, and of course get on welfare, that are shopping at the local Wal-Mart just 10 miles from Downtown Cleveland in a second ring suburb. Lots and lots of hijabs after dark ALL over this country.
I’m not an immigrant, neither are my parents or grandparents.
Only if you are a native American and still your ancestors came here from Siberia at the time.
By that reasoning, we’re all africans. I am not an immigrant. Stop playing the left’s game.
>>>I live about 50 miles from the Canadian border and there are so many foreign looking/speaking people here shopping that it is amazing. Well it turns out that there are so many things that are cheaper to buy in the US than Canada that it pays them to come over and spend a day or two and shop. Bellingham WA Costco cant keep milk on the shelves. Milk is a big one. Eggs. Gasoline. I see obviously Asian and Indian & Muslim folks with huge shopping carts at Ross, buying upwards of $1000 of stuff.
What Im saying is that Canadians may be coming to your area to shop and not all the immigrants are living in US.<<<
A lot of these people has come from Canada. They have much more immigrants which makes up to a fifth of their population and yes, shopping in Canada is much more expensive and it makes perfect sense to drive 100 miles into US to buy stuff. There are a lot of non-immigrant Canucks in that crowd but not everyone can tell them from Americans.
They drive by Detroit area for obvious reason.
Are they like the Zorastrians (sp?)?
There are still some of those folks around, I think Zubin Mehta is one.
Ezidy = Yazidi
Now they can look it up.
I need to read it slowly, so I can properly digest.
While I'm at it, I would like to leave you with a gift that also requires spiritual discernment. Please contact me if you are interested in seeing more truth. Amen.
Police Say The Naked Man Arrested In Boston Was Not Tamerlan Tsarnaev
Both his nutty parents and his straight up Uncle say they are 100% certain this video is Tamerlan. Look at any of the pictures we have of Tamerlan, we can all agree that his most significant feature is his nose. Now, look at the crystall clear video images. This naked man is obviously Tamerlan beyond any reasonable doubt.
On Thursday night while police were hunting in Watertown, Mass. for bombing suspects Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, at one point they arrested a naked man who looks a lot like Tamerlan.
Police say the naked man is not Tamerlan, despite various conspiracy theories going around the Internet.
According to the official account, Tamerlan died after a shootout with cops, riddled with bullets and shrapnel before being run over by his brother who was fleeing the scene in an SUV.
Take a look: I dare you!
The Watertown police department got back to us via email just to say that the naked man was not Tamerlan Tsarnaev (pictured on right and in high-res here).
The shootout with the Tsarnaev brothers occurred on Laurel Street. The journalist interviewed in this video describes naked man's capture near Nichols and Dexter, literally down the street from the shootout.
Naked man was apparently stripped, questioned, clothed, questioned some more, and reportedly let go. It's likely police stripped him because they were under citywide bomb threat and wanted to make sure he didn't have a suicide vest, but the police did not comment on that.
Needless to say, Business Insider is interested to hear Naked Man's personal story send any tips to email@example.com.
Have any of you viewed the CNN footage of a Crisis Actor that was interviewed at the bombing and then again four days later as a witness to the Watertown shootout.
Maybe this oversight was due to the Sequester; HaHaHa.
If you're still with me, I would be happy to PM you.
FReepers, it's Eagles Up!
Almost everyone came to America as an immigrant or an offspring of immigrant. They built America arent them?
***zotworthy grammar and sentiment...
My grandparents arrived legally. Crimmigrants are just cutting in line. And that line should have been shortened long ago, anyways.
No they don’t drive by Detroit. Why would they? They could stop in at any one of the dozens of Wal-Marts between Detroit and The west side suburbs of Cleveland.
Look on a map, There are eight million people between Detroit and Cleveland including some of the most wealthy and poorest areas of the country. They could stop at any of the stores in the Detroit Metro go to Ann Arbor, Toledo, any of the stores in NW Ohio.
No One is driving 3 to 4 hours OR MORE past dozens of Wal-Marts to shop at a non descript one in a Western Suburb of Cleveland. A place no one twenty miles from Cleveland has ever heard of. They are LOCAL inhabitants that are foreign.