Posted on 12/22/2015 6:54:03 AM PST by C19fan
“And me on the left? /grin”
Oh, no! I’m sure you were on the “correct” side.
Something I read a year ago sounds very pertinent to your point. For much of my life, I have heard horror stories about how the early M16s would jam. They were virtual "jam-a-matics."
For years I believed this was because the early rifles were not well built or well tested.
Then I read this article explaining that the CIA never had any problems with the weapon when they used it in Vietnam. That they never had a jamming problem with their weapons.
It turns out, that when the weapon was developed, the company specified a particularly clean burning and smokeless propellant for the ammunition. Guns equipped with the original manufactured specified ammunition did not jam. They worked flawlessly.
It turns out, the Army had a lot of left over gunpowder from World War II, and some of the Army Bureaucrats thought it would be terrible to let all that gunpowder go to waste, so they re-purposed it for M16 ammunition.
In other words, they started manufacturing M16 rounds with left over gunpowder from World War II, that was never designed to be used with the M16 rifle. It was dirtier than that specified for the M16, and it clogged up the gun.
The correct powder did not do this, and indeed, the correct powder would likely "clean" the rifle when it was fired through it.
All of our casualties from M16s jamming were the result of people trying to save money by re-purposing old gunpowder designed for other rifles.
Just thought you would like to know how our Military Bureaucrats had your best interests at heart back in the 1960s.
I have been hit twice by the U.S. .30 carbine round, once by a ComBloc 7,62 possiubly 7,62x39, maybe the Czech 7,62x45, which was commonplace among the bad guys at the time where I was, and once by a 7,62x54 bolt-action Mosin-Nagant rifle round.
The hits from the carbine were like a good solid punch but missed bone and neither did serious damage nor incapacitated me. The 7,62 short hit was in my left hand, entering my palm [Hands up! Don't shoot!...(not really)] and exiting behind the root of my thumb. The hit from the Nagant was from behind, felt like I'd been hit by a baseball bat and I woke up two days later in the Australian *Vampires* 8th Field Ambulance hospital at Vung Tau. Ow. I was told by my doctor that having bullets pass through my body was injurious to my health and that I should give it up. But if I have to get hit again, first choice would be from a 5.56 M855 62-grain ball round from beyond 300 yards; 7,62x39 M42 AK round from beyond 200 yards would tie for *I'd rather be hit by one* honours. Next choice would be from a M193 55-grain M16A1 round, also out past 200. Third would be the current Russian 5,45x39 round of the AK74- they really do tear out chunks, close AND at a distance.
I haven't seen a hit from the new M855A1 ammo for the M4 carbine yet. We shall see.
True...and a valid point...and all the more reason to fling the most destructive projectile we can develop at him.
Kinda hard to run and fire with no legs or arms and torso ventilated enough to see paradise through.
We should wage war in the most violent, gruesome and visible way possible.
We cannot kill someone "nicely", which is what the M-16 was purported to do, but we can kill them more "efficiently", and our weapons R & D should be dedicated to that.
One shot, one total and immediate kill...should be the training objective for every snuffy out there, and we should be able to give him the equipment to facilitate that.
Hell, in the fog of war, most of us can't wait around to see if a goat humper is suffering anyway, nor should we care.
Israel has largely switched to a 77grain 5.56. It shoots very flat and hits harder according to my daughter.
If I'm in an urban or jungle environment and most of my contacts are under 300m, I want the AK. Over 300m, I want a M14 7.62x51, SVD 7.62x54R, .30-06 Garand, or even a .303 Enfield.
Bingo! “military bullets are meant to incapacitate and create logistics logjam”
A wounded soldier has to be carried back behind the lines for treatment and that takes two of his comrades. So three
fighters are removed from the front lines.
That’s my preference as well! 5.45
What barrel length and twist are they putting it through?
6 grooves in a 178 mm (1 in 7 inch) twist
Several barrel lengths, probably the most common being the Tavor which is generally a 14.5 or 13 inch barrel.
Very, very accurate.
600 yards in a bull pup in not unheard of.
I have tens of thousands of the tungsten-core 5.45 rounds just because it was so cheap.
I then went out and built a couple AK-74s.*
(For other readers, yes 74, not 47.)
Seriouly ouch-making article, with rather macabre photos, the jist of which seems to be that the M4 bullet tumbles and breaks apart.
You can’t even get experts to agree totally on something as seemingly straight-forward as terminal ballistics. Everybody weighs the variables differently.
The Marines in Anbar Province (Surge) were making so many successful headshots that there was an investigation into possible battlefield executions. I presume we were talking mostly M4’s there.
I want a Tavor. One of the best social work tools ever.
I highly recommend not volunteering for target practice for the M855A1 ammo for the M4 carbine....
Thank You for your service!
Yes I have one and I sure wouldn’t want to be on the other end of it.
“The properties of the 5.56 MM come close to violating the prohibition of using expanding bullets in warfare. “
There is effectively no prohibition to using expanding rounds as the rules are currently interpreted. “Hollow point” rounds aren’t allowed. However, both the Sierra Match King bullets favored by military snipers and the new SOST 5.56 rounds in service with the Marines are expanding rounds. The SMK has a hollow portion under the front of the jacket which instantly collapses on impact. The SOST round is derived from the Trophy Bonded Bear Claw hunting bullet and will mushroom with the best of them. (It is now available to civilians, I just found out courtesy of the linked article BTW.)
http://blog.cheaperthandirt.com/mk-318-mod-0-bullet-matter-call/
http://www.thegunzone.com/opentip-ammo.html
Even some fully jacketed 5.56 ammo is quite devastating. If the bullet’s center of gravity is sufficiently far to the rear, it will tumble on impact even if it is perfectly stable (high twist rate) in flight. This is the trick to producing armor-piercing (non-expanding) bullets that will produce large wound channels and not just pencil through the target.
Civilians also have access to soft point and ballistic tip 5.56 ammo that performs extremely well on soft targets. Don’t hesitate to take your 5.56 deer hunting if you’re so inclined - just make sure you pick the right bullet.
the Tavor was born out of the necessity of:
having a population that is 60% more likely to be left-handed than the rest of the world
Being surrounded by savages
And having little narrow curvy streets
“Don’t hesitate to take your 5.56 deer hunting if you’re so inclined - just make sure you pick the right bullet.”
I should have added - check your local laws, 5.56 is not legal for hunting deer in some backwards areas... ;-)
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