Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

It's Final: Most lost jobs gone for good, analysts say
AP ^ | October 19, 2003

Posted on 10/19/2003 4:49:59 AM PDT by sarcasm

More than 3,100 pairs a day, three seconds under the needle for each pair - Judy Peavler was good at her job, stitching flies and zippers into Wrangler jeans.

At roughly $9.50 an hour, plus benefits, the job was good to Peavler, too.

So when VF Corp.of Greensboro cut hours at its jeans factory in Okmulgee, Okla., a few years ago, Peavler waited three months for business to bounce back. Now, though, she is certain the job is gone for good.

"My Dad used to preach to me to find a decent job and marry it -- don't move around and around like he did," said Peavler, whose husband, Roy, also worked at the plant before it closed in April. "So I took his advice ... but it didn't do me any good."

More workers like Peavler are finding themselves in similar straits in a labor market that is behaving very differently from its behavior in past economic cycles. In past downturns, employers cut large numbers of jobs in temporary layoffs, then called many workers back once a recovery began.

But although the economy continues to rebound, most of the 2.7 million jobs lost since early 2001 won't be coming back, analysts said.

In many cases, companies are cutting jobs and limiting hiring because of structural changes in their businesses and the broader economy.

Some of it is beyond companies' control, as demand for certain products and services dries up permanently. But employers also are limiting or cutting jobs by squeezing more productivity out of existing workers, sometimes by using additional technology. Many companies have cut jobs by outsourcing work to firms and facilities overseas.

"More and more employers are seeing the downturn in demand as an opportunity or a mandate to make permanent changes, to position themselves to be competitive when demand comes back," said Erica Groshen, an economist with the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

Such permanent job cuts were not nearly as prevalent in past economic downturns, Groshen and a colleague, Simon Potter, concluded in a recent report.

In most past recessions, temporary layoffs accounted for 30 percent to 40 percent of the rise in unemployment, the pair found. Employers often helped workers to apply for unemployment insurance, kept in contact and called them back when business picked up.

Since those jobs cuts were reversible, they helped the labor market rebound quickly as the economy found its legs. That explains situations like one in September 1983, when the economy added more than 1 million jobs in a single month.

But that began to change in the early 1990s - during the so-called "jobless recovery" - when employers sent a larger share of workers home without any plans to call them back.

It is even more pronounced during the current economic cycle, with temporary layoffs accounting for just 7 percent of the rise in unemployment, Groshen and Potter found. With companies dismissing workers permanently, the kick-start provided by past callbacks from temporary layoffs is not happening this time around.

"In this recession and recovery, we had layoffs but no recalls and I blame that on structural problems, which means we shouldn't expect a rebound in employment any time soon," said Sung Won Sohn, an economist with Wells Fargo & -- Co. in Minneapolis.

Although the recovery began nearly two years ago, the economy has lost 1 million jobs since that time.

When employers added 57,000 new positions to payrolls in September, it marked the first increase in employment since January, even as the percentage of adults with jobs once again dropped.

It's not just that the economy is slow to create jobs. The bottom line for workers is that many of the jobs that will eventually be created will be very different from the positions they held before.

Workers like Peavler have begun trying to position themselves for that change. Peavler is 35 and worked at the VF plant for more than 10 years. Paid by the piece, she averaged about $9.50 an hour, good enough that she expected to stay in the job as long as she could.

But since 2001, VF has been closing U.S. plants and focusing production in Central America amid lagging demand for its jeans and stiff price competition.

The company has closed plants in Coalgate and Prague, Okla., as well as the one where the Peavlers worked not far from their home in Henryetta.

Later this fall, VF will close plants in Seminole and Ada, Okla., bringing to nearly 1,300 the number of jobs it has eliminated across the state.

"In order to compete ... you're almost forced to have it (jeans) produced in locations where you can get the best cost and unfortunately that's just not here anymore," said Sam Tucker, the vice president of human resources for VF Jeanswear.

For the Peavlers, the change was wrenching. The couple had just bought a house and taken out a home-improvement loan.

The family relied on the health insurance provided by VF. Judy Peavler's life was so tied to working with a sewing machine that she hadn't touched a computer in 16 years.

"It was like the carpet was being pulled out from under me and it was very, very scary," she says. "I told Roy, what are we going to do? We can't make it with me going back to waiting tables."

But Roy Peavler quickly found a job, restoring repossessed mobile homes.

And Judy Peavler is enrolled at Green Country Technology Center in Okmulgee, taking prerequisite courses for training as a nurse.

Other workers are trying to make similar adjustments, but it hasn't been easy.

Christine Kerrigan of Philadelphia worked as a project manager for ExciteAtHome, a high-speed Internet-service provider whose spectacular rise in the late 1990s was followed by an equally abrupt plunge into bankruptcy.

When the company began to fold and she lost her job in late 2001, Kerrigan said, she looked around for similar work and found some temporary consulting assignments. But soon those dried up, too.

Kerrigan, who is 35 and a single mother of two teen-agers, began to realize that an equivalent of the job she had wasn't going to come back, even with a different employer.

Kerrigan is now enrolled at the Community College of Philadelphia, studying for a new career as a physician's assistant.

However, as excited as she is about the prospects of change, it has taken a long time to shake off the disillusionment of seeing her last career evaporate.

"It was personally, such a setback for me when the work force said thanks but no thanks," she says.

"Everything I did was part of my makeup. It was part of who I am and they no longer needed me."


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: economy; joblessrecovery; jobmarket; manufacturing
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100 ... 121-131 next last
To: Lijahsbubbe
unfortunately,i'm not being facetious.
61 posted on 10/19/2003 12:53:08 PM PDT by contessa machiaveli
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: NutCrackerBoy
Our consumers benefit from cheaper products. If outsourcing makes the products cheaper, then that's that.

"Cheaper" is irrelevant if you can't afford 'em anyway.
You need to be a value-added producer before you can be a consumer.
And it is our value-added, wealth-creating occupations that are being outsourced.

62 posted on 10/19/2003 12:59:51 PM PDT by Willie Green (Go Pat Go!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 59 | View Replies]

To: KC_for_Freedom
Well, moving every time you lose a job is not always a great option. When you have kids and a mortgage, it is hard to move.

Then if you have a two income family, you can't move because it would cause the other person to lose their job.

What I think totally sucks is that we are now outsourcing engineers to China, India, and Russia. Why??? Isn't a degree from an American college and experience in America worth lots of money??? If not, why not. Why are we spending so much money on a college degree and then have that job outsourced to other countries?

How do we prepare our children to get a job in the future?? What career is safe? I always thought my husband and I were safe. We both have degrees in computer science from very good colleges. Now, I'm thinking I'm going to have to go back to college if I want to get a well paying job. I don't know if we can even afford me going back to college.

I'm currently looking for a job, but I haven't worked in 8 years. It's not economically worth it for me to take a low paying job. The costs of having that job are too high: babysitters, housecleaners, more clothes, more gasoline, take out food, etc.


63 posted on 10/19/2003 1:08:02 PM PDT by luckystarmom
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: luckystarmom
that's why parents are piling their college aged kids into law schools at record rates. they see what is happening with other "professional" jobs like engineering and tech, and they don't want their kids to see any part of that.

their are other good careers, many in health care services, construction management, and of course government and government funded services.
64 posted on 10/19/2003 1:13:29 PM PDT by oceanview
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 63 | View Replies]

To: oceanview
Law schools aren't an answer either.

Right now, we are beginning to outsource law work as well.

Before, you would have young lawyers do all the grunt work for clients, and the big kahuna lawyer, would read off on it, correct it, and present it to the client.

Now, law firms are beginning to outsource the grunt work to India. It is legal. There will be pressure on lawyer salaries when this starts to really kick in. There will actually be few law jobs out there. Unless of course, we start really jamming up the courts with more frivolous suits and need warm bodies there.

The only job that is safe, is one that can not be done by internet, fax, overseas, or by a computer/robot.

X-ray reading is now being done in India. It will get to the point that when you get blood drawn, it might be overnighted overseas to be analysed. Seriously.

65 posted on 10/19/2003 1:24:20 PM PDT by dogbyte12
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 64 | View Replies]

To: sarcasm
Attention all working class Freepers who think the world owes them a living (you tariff lovers, this means you as well):

A job is not something you are entitled to. A job is not something an employer is, or should be, required to provide for you, whether you are competent or not.

Simply, a job is your selling of your time and skills to someone else for renumeration. What you receive for your time and skills is the result of the demand/supply equilibrium for whatever you do based on competition and scarcity.

Therefore, whether you realize it or not, if you have a job you are actually self-employed.

If your services are worth more than your employer is paying, then you should be able to leave your job and make as much working for yourself. If not, you are overemployed. Enjoy it, because it will not last.

If you would prefer not to be self-employed, become a civil servant or tenured professor. Everyone else is subject to the basic realities of global economics whether they like it or not.

66 posted on 10/19/2003 1:27:27 PM PDT by massadvj
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: massadvj
Ah, I see the economically clueless Randia crowd has chimed in again.
67 posted on 10/19/2003 1:32:49 PM PDT by RogueIsland
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: oceanview
From what I know about my dad's business, he sets his own prices. And he is a foreigner. I used to work in IT, also, but I saw the writing on the wall back in the late '90s and got out of it and now I do something else. I know that doesn't help the folks that geared their whole career to writing software and other highly technical things, but there is always room in America for smart, hardworking people.
68 posted on 10/19/2003 1:39:53 PM PDT by rabidralph (Laugh, while the Orioles plot their World Series bid, 2004.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 57 | View Replies]

To: sarcasm
Good post. It stands to reason that we can't all work in service industries and outsource manufacturing to other countries without our standard of living eventually falling. All the more so, since those service jobs that can be done overseas (data processing, software design) are already being lost. Eventually a day of reckoning will come. It won't be pretty, but it will have been deserved.
69 posted on 10/19/2003 1:45:10 PM PDT by x
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ItisaReligionofPeace
In 2000, median hourly earnings (not including tips) of waiters and waitresses were $6.42. The middle 50 percent earned between $5.88 and $7.26. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $5.49, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $10.15 per hour. For most waiters and waitresses, higher earnings are primarily the result of receiving more in tips rather than higher hourly wages. Tips usually average between 10 and 20 percent of guests' checks, so waiters and waitresses working in busy, expensive restaurants earn the most.

Source: BLS

70 posted on 10/19/2003 2:40:14 PM PDT by anniegetyourgun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: ItisaReligionofPeace; JohnSmithee
$12,500 annually = $6.00/hr (1.00 FTE). Hardly ironic....or unrealistic.
71 posted on 10/19/2003 2:45:16 PM PDT by anniegetyourgun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: oceanview
Walmart workers don't get healthcare so that will be affected too. You are right though that we will all be government employees paying 80% tax rates working for our master politicians. We may have to have a revolution to take the country back.
72 posted on 10/19/2003 3:01:27 PM PDT by cp124 (The Great Wall Mart)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 64 | View Replies]

To: sarcasm
Another success story of free trade. Free trade is costing the American citizen dearly.
73 posted on 10/19/2003 3:05:05 PM PDT by RiflemanSharpe
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: NoControllingLegalAuthority
I guess it's the Marie Antoinette argument: "Let them eat cake,"...

HM Queen Marie-Antoinette never said ”Let them eat cake” or anything close to it. The Queen of France was a pious woman who had nothing to do with the oppression of the poor ; neither can the blame for France‘s troubles be laid at the feet of her husband, HM Louis XVI, King of France. It was Marie-Antoinette’s husband’s great-great-grandmother, the wife of Louis XIV, who said ”Let them eat cake”.

Marie-Antoinette and her royal husband went to the guillotine forgiving their murderers and praising the name of Christ. They were martyred at the hands of the bloody Republic, and deserve better than the shabby treatment their memories have received over the years.

74 posted on 10/19/2003 3:09:14 PM PDT by B-Chan (Catholic. Monarchist. Texan. Any questions?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: anniegetyourgun
What? Waiters are paid minimum wage by most restaurants. That is $2.13 per hour. The rest has to be made up of tips. It is very unrealistic. You know little of what you speak. Silence.
75 posted on 10/19/2003 3:25:42 PM PDT by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]

To: anniegetyourgun
This includes tips dear.
76 posted on 10/19/2003 3:26:19 PM PDT by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies]

To: anniegetyourgun
No way the average waitress is paid that plus tips.
77 posted on 10/19/2003 3:26:48 PM PDT by ItisaReligionofPeace ((the original))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies]

To: LibertyAndJusticeForAll
"Hundreds of threads with this theme have been posted for several months. If you are interested in some good answers check harpseal's profile page.
Engaging in truly meaningful discussion is always welcomed."

I have to admit to having learned a lot from these discussions. Same with any number of topics that have been debated here over the years. What's happening is important and is quite unique in my lifetime.
78 posted on 10/19/2003 3:45:22 PM PDT by JohnSmithee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 56 | View Replies]

To: B-Chan
"Marie-Antoinette and her royal husband went to the guillotine forgiving their murderers and praising the name of Christ. They were martyred at the hands of the bloody Republic, and deserve better than the shabby treatment their memories have received over the years."

Interesting, any links...?
79 posted on 10/19/2003 3:46:46 PM PDT by JohnSmithee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 74 | View Replies]

To: ItisaReligionofPeace
See for yourself.

Know little of what I speak? Are you also a CCP?

Silence? Are you an FR censor?

80 posted on 10/19/2003 3:53:59 PM PDT by anniegetyourgun
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 75 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100 ... 121-131 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson