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'Great news' for West in assault case
Washington Times ^ | 12/10/03 | Rowan Scarborough

Posted on 12/09/2003 9:49:06 PM PST by kattracks

Edited on 07/12/2004 4:11:04 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

An Army hearing officer has recommended administrative punishment

(Excerpt) Read more at washtimes.com ...


TOPICS: Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: allenwest; rowanscarborough

1 posted on 12/09/2003 9:49:07 PM PST by kattracks
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To: Travis McGee; Squantos; Indie; archy; Vets_Husband_and_Wife; Debi
More indications of good news. Now if the 4th ID CO will simply follow this recommendation.
2 posted on 12/09/2003 9:57:38 PM PST by Jeff Head
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To: Jeff Head
Why wouldn't the CO follow the recommendation? Won't he?
3 posted on 12/09/2003 10:25:56 PM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: Jeff Head
And what is that recommendation?

call them 'pond scum' instead of POWs and say the geneva convention doesnt apply to them? works for me!
4 posted on 12/09/2003 10:28:35 PM PST by WOSG (The only thing that will defeat us is defeatism itself)
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To: kattracks
I think The Commander in Chief, the Honorable George W. Bush, could show the resolve this country has when dealing with terrorist and terror states by making the "administrative punishment" a promotion to at least Brigadier General and awarding him the Silver Star.

This man's actions saved numerous American lives and what thanks did he get? The military is too concerned with public relations campaigns and not concerned enough about rooting out terror cells and protecting our troops.

5 posted on 12/09/2003 10:47:00 PM PST by The Sons of Liberty
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To: kattracks
Based on my recollection from thirty some years ago, this article is a little muddled.

I seem to recall that the UCMJ, the Uniform Code of Military Justice outlined three levels of punishment.

The highest level is the court-martial. There are several flavors of court-martial, including the summary court-martial, the general court-martial, and maybe even one more that I can't recall.

Each type of court-martial has associated with it a limitation on the level of punishment that can be meted out which is consistent with the level of care expected from the process. A summary court-martial I think is presided over by a single officer, whereas a general court-martial requires a panel of officers to sit in judgement.

A commanding officer can choose to subject a subordinate to a court-martial if he believes the charges warrant it.

An alternative to a court-martial is Non-Judicial Punishment (which I have seen abbreviated as NJP). This form of punishment is a written threat from a commander to court-martial a subordinate unless the subordinate accepts the non-judicial punishment. The maximum permissible punishment is spelled out in the UCMJ. Loss of one months pay, loss of one pay grade, that sort of thing or any combination that does not exceed the maximums.

Finally, I thought there was a type of punishment called "administrative punishment". This type of punishment also has its limits, but can be imposed at the discretion of the commanding officer. Two weeks extra duty is one example of an administrative punishment.

The goal of this hierarchy of punishments is to make the "punishment" fit the crime and to prevent abuse of authority on the part of commanding officers. Without a presiding officer and a formal proceeding, there can be no court-martial. Without a written offer and written acceptance by the subordinate, there can be no Non-Judicial Punishment. Administrative punishments require little justification by the commanding officer, but the subordinate has the right to complain to higher levels of command or to the Judge Advocate General if the punishments seem out of line.

I don't recall seeing "reprimand" as any of the punishments associated with these proceedings. A verbal reprimand could be as simple as an officer stopping an improperly uniformed subordinate and ordering a correction to the uniform.

The point of outlining this is that the article states that the recommendation was against court-martial and for administrative punishment. As I thought it was defined, administrative punishment can be something which causes a "learning experience" for the subordinate but which leaves no lasting mark on his record.

Non-Judicial Punishments do cause an inclusion in the record of the paperwork threatening court-martial and documenting the acceptance or non-acceptance by the subordinate. I vaguely recall that there might be a mechanism for removing Non-Judicial Punishment proceedings from a person's record.

Since my experience was as an enlisted man, I may be unaware of special provisions for disciplining officers. Still, it would appear that the punishment for West may be very slight. It seems a shame that he waited until he felt it was necessary to violate the policy before challenging it. The policy itself represents an order from his superiors as to how he will conduct himself. West's superiors decided that their judgement in this matter should prevail. If they can now say that they were mistaken, then they should change the policy and exonerate West.

It would appear, however, that the policy stands and thus, that the superiors do not believe that the policy is mistaken. Deciding the policy is well within their authority.

6 posted on 12/09/2003 10:57:10 PM PST by William Tell
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To: Squantos; Travis McGee; Valin; harpseal; Matthew James; Fred Mertz; Wally Cleaver; Jeff Head; ...
My opinion - take the Article 15, retire, write a book and laugh all the way to the bank.
7 posted on 12/10/2003 2:56:23 AM PST by SLB ("We must lay before Him what is in us, not what ought to be in us." C. S. Lewis)
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To: William Tell
Your recollection of the process is correct.

NJP is the same as Article 15 in the Army. The commander upon convening and Article 15 hearing has a broad scope of what he can administer as punishment. Generally those punishments are confinement to quarters, Forfieture of up to 2/3 pay, and verbal or written reprimand.

Any time an officer faces anything other than administrative punishment, ie a&& chewing it's usually a career ender, they may not be thrown out, but they won't be promoted if it's in their record.

IMO what happened to LTC West is fair and eqitable to the charges, although until the Div CG makes a final decision the actual punishment may be far less than what has been listed here. An article 15 hearing can also result in no punishment at all.
8 posted on 12/10/2003 3:27:03 AM PST by Ispy4u
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To: kattracks; MJY1288; Calpernia; Grampa Dave; anniegetyourgun; Ernest_at_the_Beach; BOBTHENAILER; ...
An Army hearing officer has recommended administrative punishment — but not a criminal court-martial — for Lt. Col. Allen B. West, who is charged with assault for firing a gun to scare a confession from an Iraqi detainee.

....Mr. Puckett quoted his client as saying, "Great news indeed."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

God bless our troops ~ and Freepers ~ every one!

9 posted on 12/10/2003 5:25:12 AM PST by Ragtime Cowgirl ( "Our military is full of the finest people on the face of the earth." ~ Pres. Bush, Baghdad)
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To: William Tell
On Bill O'Reilly's program last night, West's lawyer said that he was to get NJP.
10 posted on 12/10/2003 5:38:21 AM PST by jackbill
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To: Jeff Head; SLB; Travis McGee; Squantos
My opinion is the Army is handling this in the only way possible given the way military justice operates. Now the CG will be under some pressure to give some punishment. Perhaps confinement to quarters for two weeks would be appropriate or maybe even a letter of Reprimand at which point LtCol. West is free to take the SLB option.
11 posted on 12/10/2003 6:37:57 AM PST by harpseal (stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown)
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To: harpseal
See my post here for the latest word from the LTC himself.

I believe the SLB option is what may well happen. I am encouraging him to do so.

12 posted on 12/10/2003 6:45:39 AM PST by Jeff Head
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To: Ragtime Cowgirl
LTC Allen West is a hero ~ Bump!
13 posted on 12/10/2003 8:13:06 AM PST by blackie
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To: SLB; harpseal
Exactly........Sorry a smart warrior who used his noggin to save his troops lives has to endure such BULLSHIT at all.........Write the book Lt Col West.

Stay Safe Ya'll !

14 posted on 12/10/2003 9:21:00 AM PST by Squantos (Support Mental Health !........or........ I'LL KILL YOU !!!!)
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To: SLB
I like the retire and write a book part!
15 posted on 12/10/2003 9:48:28 AM PST by Travis McGee (----- www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com -----)
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To: Ragtime Cowgirl
Bump!
16 posted on 12/10/2003 10:27:41 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: Ragtime Cowgirl
West's wife and attorney were interviewed on Fox this afternoon. She's visibly relieved and expressed her appreciation to the American people for their support of her husband.
17 posted on 12/10/2003 4:08:33 PM PST by windchime
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To: Ragtime Cowgirl
Bush should reach down and lift this officer up.

And make it clear the first rule of engagement is to kill the bad guy, break his stuff, and get intel asap.

Mark Steyn indicates we are still asking Syria's Assad nicely.

Nicely should only apply to shooting a la Specialist "Machine Gun" Ross.

18 posted on 12/10/2003 6:30:02 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hitlery: das Butch von Buchenvald)
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To: kattracks
Nearly-vindicated American Hero bump.
19 posted on 12/10/2003 11:04:40 PM PST by clee1 (Where's the beef???)
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