Conservatives are now the "Blacks" of the Republican Party

vanity ^ | 12/17/03 | Destro

[Destro]

In a discussion on this thread Tom Ridge's Immigration Remarks Draw Fire a post regarding the conservative angst about the recent campaign finance reform that Bush signed into law and that the Supreme Court approved (and the approval was praised by the White House), on the heals of the Medicare entitlement enacted under a Republican controlled government the following was posted:

I'm hearing Rush now. He claims the republicans have ONLY one party to go to. He has put this issue squarely on the problem. We need to vote outside of this corrupt party apparatus.

12 posted on 12/11/2003 12:39:52 PM EST by Digger

I also heard this on Rush and my blood boiled. Rush said conservatives have no place else to go and thus will continue to vote as a block to the Republicans.....and then it hit me. That is exactly what we conservatives lament about Blacks and the Democratic party. Black Democrats who vote straight Democratic and are rewarded by being ignored.

In other words, Conservatives are now the "Blacks" of the Republican Party!!!

I urge the same solution to Republican conservatives that Black conservatives offer to Black Democrats. QUIT! Become independents and let the parties fight for our votes. If we can't take the GOP back we should leave the GOP.

I did not change. My party did. I thank God Ronald Reagan is unable to comprehend what is happening to the party he saved.

[Consort]

The truth is, when Republicans run as conservatives, and when they stand up for conservative values and principles, they win.

When the GOP wins, Conservatives have a chance to do their thing. When the GOP loses, Conservatives lose — big time. Staying home is not an option...it's a weakness.

Perhaps we Conservatives need to draft our own "Contract with Republican Leaders" and make it perfectly clear what our expectations are and also make it clear that compromising on core values will lead to electoral defeat for these psuedo-conservative, "party over principle" Republicans.

We can look for things to do, but a "Do it my way or I'll screw all the Republicans" dog-in-the-manger mentality is not the answer, IMO. It would only show that the Necro-Conservative death wish is still alive and well.

[Tamzee]

I chuckle happily when I see the Greens in a temper screeching that they won't vote for the Dems because they "abandoned their liberal base".... the more divided the left is, the more power the right has. These Greens know that but are outraged that they aren't pandered to more by the Democrat Party.

It's frustrating to same the same counter-productive tantrum over here on the right... conservatives are supposed to be a bit smarter than this.

[WOSG]

where do you get the nutty idea that Zell miller is more conservative than Bush?

Just because Zell isnt a leftist Socialist?

[WOSG]

af vet,

you are fighting an uphill battle trying to talk sense to people who feel betrayed....

as a Texas Conservative Republican, I was *never* under the 'illusion' that George W Bush was as Conservative in governing as my own views are.

I suspect that Bush is not governing as conservative as he *himself* is - you can tell that on some issues, where he bluntly disses some terrorist like Arafat in off-the-cuff comments, but the StateDept does 'damagecontrol' and puts Arafat back in the picture.


After 2 large tax cuts, conservative public policy bills, better judicial nominations (some of which have gone through), and a successful War on Terror pursuit, partial birth abortion ban, stopping kyoto and the ICC, I'd think conservatives would at least understand President Bush is a bit different from the Liberal Democrats. He's not perfect but IMHO he is on balance A LOT better than both Clinton and his father (who deliberately created a political situation harmful to conservatives; bush OTOH, is trying politically to make a Republican majority, come hell or high water.) I am impressed that often he does a conservative thing that is not loud, announced or public.

But there seems to be no expressions of subtlety or shades of difference. Pity. This could be a good, productive discussion about how to make conservative values win in a tough media/academia/political environment, nad how important it is to KEEP CONSERVATIVE VALUES FRONT AND CENTER and not abandon them with 'compromises', but --- NO --- we have to waste time on a feeble debate about either a) bootlicking whoever is in charge of the Republican party, or b) running off like children to a useless '3rd party'.

3rd party talk is the talk of imbeciles. Please, read history, know the facts. 3rd parties dont win power, they waste political energy.

There are many ways to be a LOT smarter than that, but sadly people let emotion get ahead of reason.
You want examples of effective politics? Look at the NAACP, the ACLU, look at the groups like the Christian Coalition that have created change *in* parties and in politics.
Lets THINK clearly about what's at stake and what the best ways are to advance our agenda.

[Maelstrom]

Offer me a choice between Lenin and Trotsky and feel you've accomplished something.

The rest of us will recognize such a choice for what it is.

[WOSG]

Are you really so foolish as to believe the 2 parties are no different. puleeeze ...

What state and Congressional district are you in?

[WOSG]

IN our history there have been dozens and dozens of fringe parties...

but only 2 major parties, going all the way back to the federalists and anti-federalists.

The Republicans were merely the inheritors of the Whig party mantle. Lincoln jumped from Whig to republican.

[WOSG]

There were people like you around when Reagan was President (I was one of them) who said the same things about Reagan that you are saying about Bush.

This is true.

[Boiling point]

I too am considering the constitution party. Justification? Well, if I had a person working for MY company that was stealing me blind, oblivious of company policy,and giving company secrets to my competition, I would not keep him for fear that the next employee may be worse. If the next employee screws up, you can him too! Eventually someone will get the message.

[WOSG]

Somehow the libertarian, smaller government branch of the GOP (many of us), need to figure out how to get our point across to the national party. This is out of hand. In 2004, I will provide 100% support for Bush; in practical terms, it is either Bush or Dean/Kerry/Hillary, etc. Bush is our guy for 2004. He's done a lot of things that I love, but also some things that are going to bite us in the rear long-term. Somehow we need to have a stronger voice in the party for the next four years and for future elections regarding spending and govt growth. I don't know what the solution would be, but if there is one, it could come from this forum.

My solution is to support the Club for Growth and their support for Pat Toomey against Arlen Spector.

One RINO head on the wall of the Senate GOP caucus chambers would do wonders for concentrating Republican minds on a more Conserviatve agenda!. And please, folks, give up the idea that any other party makes sense for conservatives right now. If we are the blacks of the Republican Party, then the Democrats are the KKK of our values, beliefs and interests. We CANNOT afford to fracture and let the Dems rules - unity is strength.

[Boiling point]

I too am considering the constitution party. Justification? Well, if I had a person working for MY company that was stealing me blind, oblivious of company policy,and giving company secrets to my competition, I would not keep him for fear that the next employee may be worse. If the next employee screws up, you can him too! Eventually someone will get the message.

[WOSG]

Wise comments... well said.

[tacticalogic]

Lets THINK clearly about what's at stake and what the best ways are to advance our agenda.

I think that's the point where the cognitive dissonance sets in. "Winning is everything" doesn't fit comfortably into conservative philosophy.

[WOSG]

Tamsey, you are right... I hope though you are voting for the Republican running in the GOP primary for US Senate: PAT TOOMEY!!

There is a RINO imposter in our midst we need to get rid of.

[Right_in_Virginia]

I too am considering the constitution party.

Even though I don't know you, I'll treat your decision to join another party with respect.

But, please, promise me you won't come back when a DemonRat is in the WH and complain about nationalized health care, the International Court, American soldiers fighting the war on terrorism by the UN's rules under their flag, the Kyoto treaty being the law of the land, higher taxes, or the return of partial birth abortion.

Deal?

[King Prout]

I suppose it bears pointing out that the "11th commandment" (ie: "Thou shalt not speak ill of a fellow republican") was issued to his staff and promulgated amont the 'pubs in congress. It's a command from the party chief to all the smaller chiefs, and has no bearing on what we fry in the shallow ponds do on a daily basis.
pardon the mixed metaphor - tired and flu-ridden.

[Sam Cree]

"This is not a game."

I hardly think so. Agreed that survival, and it is indeed at stake, takes precedence over freedom.

Yet, shredding our Constitution, that ain't a game either.

Thanks for your thoughtful reply, I will try to answer it equally thoughtfully, when I get a moment to do so.

[lasereye]

The thing about most of these people who won't vote for Bush is they seem to define their decision in highly personal terms. It's not a question of analyzing in practical terms what would happen under Pres. Dean - a hyper liberal Supreme Court for a generation, ending missile defense development etc., vs. Bush. They feel "betrayed" and "used". They "can't" vote for Bush, etc. He "won't fool me again". He's "not getting MY vote". He's failed some test for true blue conservatism. He's done some non-conservative things, therefore there's NO DIFFERENCE between him and the Dems. Meanwhile, he's cut taxes, appointed or tried to appoint solidly conservative judges, signed the partial birth abortion bill, pursued expanded domestic energy production (which the Senate has blocked, and they weirdly blame him for that), missile defense, war on terrorism. None of that means anything. They sound like a bunch of 10 year olds.

[Protagoras]

Are you really so foolish as to believe the 2 parties are no different. puleeeze ...

Have you stopped beating your wife? puleeeze

You can try to put words in other peoples mouths, but it's the same old retread strawman tactic that is so popular around here. Are you so foolish that you think I would fall for that nonsense? But nice try,,,,, I guess.

What state and Congressional district are you in?

And the reason for that question?

[RaceBannon]

You don't think there is a substantial difference between the Democrat Congresses prior to 1994 and the Republican ones afterward, no subtantive difference between Bill and Hillary Clinton and George and Laura Bush, no real difference between Dick Cheney and Al Gore.

USMC 1977-1981

And, yeah, there are some differences between the people you mentioned.

For instance, if Hillary demanded that we allow our houses to be burned down overnight, the Republican Congress would fight for the right to do it over 3 weeks instead.

We still get our house burned down.

Remember what we demanded when we took over the house? Defund the NEA, NPR, PBS, seperate education from government, school vouchers, tax cuts for all, not tax rebates once a year, reduced spending, balanced budgets...

Which of these did we get from the Repub majority?

I'll wait...Until then, we have amnesty for illegal aliens, meaning CRIMINALS here illegally...suspension of free speech in the political arena with the CFR Bill, socialized health care put half-way into place with the new presciption drug plan just passed (Burning the house down over 3 weeks?), the abandonement of Taiwan and a new creation of a ONE CHINA policy...we want democracy for Iraq, why not Taiwan? The handing of technology to foreign nations that are our economic competitors, and told the whole time it is for our benefit while we all get laid off due to work going overseas...

No place to go, Rush?

If I have no place to go, shouldn't I just stay home?

People who run for office are supposed to give us a reason to vote FOR THEM, Right Rush? Not just vote against someone, but a reason to vote FOR someone?

GWB is a liberal, and people like me said so before the election for months.