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8 years later, TWA 800 case just heating up!
WorldNetDaily.com ^ | Friday, July 16, 2004 | Jack Cashill

Posted on 07/16/2004 4:53:39 AM PDT by JohnHuang2

Edited on 07/16/2004 4:55:29 AM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]

Last July 17, the major media made no comment that seven years prior, on July 17, 1996, TWA Flight 800 exploded off the coast of Long Island, killing all 230 people on board.

If the media took note of the date "July 17" at all last year, it was only to observe that American soldiers had found it scrawled on walls throughout Iraq. July 17, after all, was Iraq's national liberation day, the day Saddam helped lead the Baath Party to power in 1968, the day he seized the presidency in 1979, and not impossibly, the day he took his revenge on the United States in 1996.

This year, as every year, thousands of TWA Flight 800 family members and other interested parties will honor the date. Among them is Capt. Ray Lahr. Just last week, the retired United Airline pilot learned that his case against the National Transportation Safety Board and the Central Intelligence Agency is still on track. On Monday, Aug. 2, Lahr and his attorney, John Clarke of Washington, will square off against the NTSB and the CIA at the U.S. District Court in Los Angeles.

Lahr is hoping to force the NTSB and CIA to disclose the data upon which they based what Lahr calls "the impossible zoom-climb." As the agencies and Lahr both understand, the zoom-climb is the Achilles heel of the TWA Flight 800 investigation.

The FBI first publicly advanced the zoom-climb scenario when it bowed out of the case in November 1997. Its agents did so to negate the stubborn testimony of the hundreds of eyewitnesses who had sworn they saw a flaming, smoke-trailing, zigzagging object destroy TWA Flight 800.

To make its case, the FBI presented a video prepared by the CIA. A key animation sequence in that video showed an internal fuel tank explosion blowing the nose off the aircraft, which then "pitched up abruptly and climbed several thousand feet from its last recorded altitude of about 13,800 feet to a maximum altitude of about 17,000 feet." This rocketing aircraft, claimed the video, looked like a missile and confused the eyewitnesses.

This animation was essential to close the investigation. Without it, there was no way to explain what these hundreds of eyewitnesses – many of them highly credible – had actually seen. A veteran safety investigator and a serious researcher in the field of gravity, Ray Lahr watched this animation in utter disbelief. He knew this scenario to be impossible, and he set out to prove it. When he learned that not a single eyewitness had seen the plane ascend, including airline pilots who had watched it from above, he redoubled his efforts to discover the basic physics behind the alleged zoom-climb. For the last several years, however, despite numerous FOIA requests, the NTSB has refused to cooperate. The impressively stubborn Lahr finally took the agency to court.

Lahr has done an excellent job pulling the sometimes-fractious TWA 800 community together to assist him. Many key people have filed sworn affidavits with Lahr, including retired Rear Adm. Clarence Hill, and their collective commentary has to impress even the most skeptical of observers. All of this evidence, including the court papers, can be found at RayLahr.com, as well as in past articles on WorldNetDaily.

One question that has never been resolved is just how the CIA animation project came to pass. Two recent books, however, do shed light on the dynamics of the video's creation. One is the much-discussed "Against All Enemies," by Richard Clarke, then chairman of the Clinton administration's Coordinating Security Group on terrorism. The second is Murray Weiss's recent and highly readable book, "The Man Who Warned America," on the subject of John O'Neill, a terrorist expert with the FBI who died in the World Trade Center on Sept. 11.

Within 30 minutes of TWA Flight 800's destruction, Clarke relates in his book, he had convened a meeting of the CSG in the White House situation room. "The FAA," Clarke reports, "was at a total loss for an explanation. The flight path and the cockpit communications were normal. The aircraft had climbed to 17,000 feet, then there was no aircraft."

Clarke here serves up two significant untruths in a book replete with them. The first is that the Federal Aviation Administration was at "a total loss" for an explanation. In fact, it was the FAA that prompted the meeting and did so for a very specific and frightening reason: Its personnel believed the aircraft had been attacked. As NTSB Chairman Jim Hall would report in a confidential November 1996 report, "Top intelligence and security officials were told in a video conference from the White House Situation Room that radar tapes showed an object headed at the plane before it exploded."

Clarke also deceives the reader about altitude. The FAA never reported an altitude of 17.000 feet – nothing close. The FAA knew that the last recorded altitude of TWA Flight 800 was "about 13,800 feet" as even the CIA animation later admits. In the retelling, Clarke pads in the zoom-climb differential on the night of the crash and attributes it falsely to the FAA.

Weiss, who had excellent access to O'Neill's FBI colleagues, gets much closer to the truth as to the motive behind the emergency White House meeting. "The FAA," he writes, "initially reported spotting a radar blip on their tapes that indicated there was another plane or projectile near TWA Flight 800 when it exploded." This much is true. Weiss, however, is misled on his next point, namely that the FAA told the FBI one day later that "there was no blip. There were no missiles picked up on the JFK scanners." The sighting was an "anomaly."

In truth, to its credit, the FAA refused to change its story despite the pressure to do so. When in November 1996, the NTSB leaned on the FAA to "agree that there is no evidence that would suggest a high speed target merged with TWA 800," the FAA refused.

"We cannot comply with your request," the FAA's David Thomas responded. "By alerting law-enforcement agencies, air-traffic control personnel simply did what was prudent at the time and reported what appeared to them to be a suspicious event. To do less would have been irresponsible."

To set the record straight on this issue, Ray Lahr persuaded one key witness, James Holtsclaw, to go public for the first time. In 1996, Holtsclaw was serving as the deputy assistant for the Western Region of the Air Transport Association. Within a week of the crash, Holtsclaw received the radar tape directly from an NTSB investigator frustrated by its suppression. "The tape shows a primary target at 1200 knots converging with TWA 800, during the climb out phase of TWA 800," swears Holtsclaw on the Lahr affidavit.

In fact, before the investigation was through, authorities would introduce five different explanations to rationalize away that "blip." This obvious dissembling may explain why investigators felt the need to smuggle out evidence. Holtsclaw's informant would be the first of several – at least four of whom would be either suspended from the investigation or arrested.

Within weeks of the crash, the FBI would interview more than 700 eyewitnesses. By its own count, 270 of them saw lights streaking upward toward the plane. Defense Department analysts also debriefed some of these witnesses, 34 of whom, according to the FBI, described events "consistent with the characteristics of the flight of [anti-aircraft] missiles." There were also scores of witness drawings, some so accurate and vivid they could chill the blood.

About four weeks after the crash, Clarke reports in "Against All Enemies," he met with O'Neill, who told him that the eyewitness interviews "were pointing to a missile attack, a Stinger." Given what the FBI knew at the time, this much seems credible.

"[TWA 800] was at 15,000 feet," Clarke allegedly responds. "No Stinger or any other missile like it can go that high." One would think that on so sensitive and contentious a point, Clarke would have made an effort to get the altitude of TWA 800 right or even consistently wrong. He does neither. In his scarily sloppy book, the boastful Clarke finesses credit for the zoom-climb and, in a stunning revelation, seizes full credit for deducing the exploding fuel tank part of that scenario even before the NTSB did.

Clarke, however, has had a hard time keeping his story straight. In an earlier New Yorker article on O'Neill soon after Sept. 11, Clarke tells reporter Lawrence Wright that it was O'Neill who insisted that TWA Flight 800 was out of the range of the Stinger, and O'Neill who believed that the "ascending flare" that the witnesses saw must have been something else, like "the ignition of leaking fuel from the aircraft."

Weiss likewise gives all credit to O'Neill for the zoom-climb scenario, thinking that it is indeed "credit" O'Neill deserves. Weiss contends that O'Neill not only conceived the zoom-climb scenario, but that he also "persuaded the CIA to do a video simulation of his scenario." Under an eight-panel recreation of the zoom-climb in the photo section of his book, Weiss writes that O'Neill used the CIA video simulation "to quash any fears that the disaster was a terrorist event." This last point is tellingly true.

Clarke and O'Neill have not been the only two agents angling for credit. The best-documented claim, in fact, comes from "CIA Analyst 1" during his April 1999 grilling by a few honest, rank-and-file NTSB investigators. As the CIA analyst relates, the zoom-climb insight came to him like an epiphany. He traced the moment of awareness to the precise hour of 10 p.m. on Dec. 30, 1996.

Said the analyst, "There was a realization, having all the data laid out in front of me, that you can explain what the eyewitnesses are seeing with only the burning aircraft." The analyst came to his startling conclusion after reviewing only about 12 percent of the interview statements. The CIA did no interviews of its own.

What puzzled the NTSB guys was just how many eyewitnesses actually saw a plane with a ruptured center fuel tank rocketing upward with burning fuel spewing behind it (especially with the center fuel tank being essentially empty at take-off). The CIA cited only 21 witnesses. But as the questioning of CIA Analyst 1 wore on, it became clear there were fewer still. An NTSB investigator finally sighed in frustration, "If it's only one or two of [the eyewitnesses], it's not representative of all of them."

Analyst 1 then pulled out his trump card, his key witness, the man who had seen everything: "That [zoom-climb] is something that a few eyewitnesses saw. The guy on the bridge saw that." As we have documented on these pages before, the man on the bridge saw no such thing. The CIA or the FBI (or both or Richard Clarke) manufactured an interview with this man, Mike Wire of Philadelphia, out of whole cloth. Wire's "second interview" is the most crucial bit of evidence in the entire investigation, the evidence around which the zoom-climb scenario was created, and it's fully and provably counterfeit.

Whether Clarke or O'Neill or the CIA analyst were responsible for the zoom-climb scenario individually or together is not relevant to technicians like Ray Lahr. Nor has he focused on how an FBI middle manager like O'Neill could have breached the historic wall between the two agencies and enlisted the CIA in a project that would take at least 11 months from conception to execution. No, what most troubles Lahr is how three men with no discernible aviation or engineering experience could possibly have used any science whatsoever to arrive at such critical conclusions.

The truth of the matter proves elusive. The CIA analyst lied shamelessly in his testimony. Richard Clarke lies shamelessly throughout his book. The jury is still out on O'Neill, but the evidence is not encouraging. As Weiss well documents, O'Neill maintained a wife and two children in New Jersey and simultaneously cajoled at least three women in three different cities into thinking that he was going to marry them. What is more, despite maintaining two households, O'Neill somehow managed to live extravagantly on a government salary. In an otherwise flattering profile, Weiss concedes of O'Neill, "He always seemed to be lying about some aspect of his life."

Whether O'Neill helped conceal the demise of TWA Flight 800 remains unclear. Although Weiss attributes both the zoom-climb scenario and the final TWA 800 report to O'Neill, no reporter made this connection while he was alive. In her book on the crash investigation, "Deadly Departure," CNN reporter Christine Negroni does not even mention O'Neill. In her FBI-friendly book, "In The Blink of an Eye," AP reporter Pat Milton pays O'Neill little heed, but she does reveal that upon hearing the news of the crash, John O'Neill's first call went to none other than Richard Clarke, and it is O'Neill, Clarke's best friend in the FBI, who plays the role of tragic hero in "Against All Enemies."

Ray Lahr will leave it to other courts to establish who was the architect of the greatest peacetime deception in American history. His interest is the zoom-climb scenario itself, according to Weiss, "the most significant part" of the final case-closing FBI presentation.

"A little basic physics," adds Weiss naively, "helped explain what witnesses saw and heard in the summer skies off Long Island." Lahr is hoping that the federal courts will finally force the NTSB and CIA to explain finally what those "little basic physics" are.




TOPICS: Editorial; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: clarke; clarketreason; clarkeweasel; concpiracy; conspiracy; klintonkommies; richardclarke; treason; twa800; twaflight800
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Typing in caps and repeating silly questions does not cover up the fact that your last post was essentially a lie. Furthermore, aviation history is absolutely full of accidents caused by unique events. Using your logic, the cause of the Alaskan Air MD-80 crash off the coast of California couldn't have been caused by the jackscrew in the rudder, because despite decades of flying by hundreds of similar aircraft in airlines around the world, such an incident had never happened before, and hasn't happened since. But to answer your question, there have been two 737's that exploded due to overheating in their centerline fuel tanks. The last was in 2001. In addition, the Air Force had already identified overheating in the centerline tanks of its 747's as a problem years before TWA 800 exploded. And exploding fuel vapor in fuel tanks has been blamed in 9 incidents since 1958, nullifying the often posted theory that jet fuel vapor isn't explosive.


161 posted on 07/17/2004 7:26:41 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: Tazlo; muawiyah
Your time line is all off. The Olympic Park Bombing happened in 1996, BEFORE the other bombings in 1997 (clinic and night club) and 1998 (Birmingham).

Duuuoh! You're right. My bad.

162 posted on 07/17/2004 7:30:24 AM PDT by Vigilantcitizen
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
Actually, exactly none of them said that.

The center title of the ad says:

"We Saw TWA Flight 800 Shot Down by Missiles And We Won't Be Silenced Any Longer"

The quoted excerpts are just that - excerpts. All the people quoted in the ad gave their permission to be quoted, and they knew what the ad was going to say.

How is that "exactly none?"

I NOTICE YOU STILL HAVEN'T COME UP WITH AN EXAMPLE OF A SINGLE OTHER SPONTANEOUSLY EXPLODING JET FUEL TANK IN THE HISTORY OF AVIATION.

163 posted on 07/17/2004 7:33:30 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
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To: Rokke
Using your logic, the cause of the Alaskan Air MD-80 crash off the coast of California couldn't have been caused by the jackscrew in the rudder, because despite decades of flying by hundreds of similar aircraft in airlines around the world, such an incident had never happened before, and hasn't happened since.

Jet fuel is not flammable under the pressures and temperatures in jet fuel tank.

And as long as you saw fit to call me a liar, I will call you a liar for saying that jet fuel is flammable except under extreme pressure and temperature.

164 posted on 07/17/2004 7:39:08 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
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To: Rokke

Show me the links to your evidence. Surely you have some.


165 posted on 07/17/2004 7:40:23 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
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To: JohnHuang2
On Monday, Aug. 2, Lahr and his attorney, John Clarke of Washington, will square off against the NTSB and the CIA at the U.S. District Court in Los Angeles.

Anybody going? Is there any easy way to confirm that this is really on the court schedule.

166 posted on 07/17/2004 7:40:54 AM PDT by InterceptPoint
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To: muawiyah; All
What does happen circa July 17 or 18 every year is that the Earth travels through the ancient debris trail of a comet. Rocks fall in seeming to travel from East to West. The first rocks have a very flat trajectory and actually appear to streak UP from the horizon.

I'm still putting my money on a boloid that also hit flight 800.


TIN FOIL HAT ALERT!!!
167 posted on 07/17/2004 7:44:15 AM PDT by demkicker
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Like your post, the headline of the ad is an unsupported lie. It is almost funny that the authors of the ad couldn't even find quotes to support their own misleading headline. The simple fact is, not a single person in the ad says they saw a "missile" hit TWA 800 or any other aircraft.


168 posted on 07/17/2004 7:44:36 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: demkicker
Looks like we have another one who still has problems with the concepts of rocks falling out of the sky.

Hey, astronomy already happened so we don't have to invent it again!

169 posted on 07/17/2004 7:46:13 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: sine_nomine
When Kahlstrom first faced the media, he mentioned that terrorism was possible. Later, when he did the center fuel tank commedy routine, his expression said that he did not believe a word of it.

I remember the same thing. I really liked Kahlstrom and thought he was credible until he put on the dog and pony show.

This is my theory. They all knew what did it - a terrorist missile or maybe a bomb. They thought it would wreck tourism and air travel to admit the truth. I think the same scenario was true when the jet crashed in NY after 9/11. Soon after the mad shoe bomber was caught trying, and we have been scanning shoes ever since.

You and I think alike. I have the very same beliefs and as evil as Clinton is, I really think Flt 800 was covered up because he and the airline industry knew it would cripple the industry and severly damage our economy to throw everyone in a panic. And I think the same thing happened with the jet that crashed in NY after 9/11 too.

Whatever happened to the cover-up being worse than the lie?
170 posted on 07/17/2004 7:55:32 AM PDT by demkicker
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To: Rokke
Like your post, the headline of the ad is an unsupported lie. It is almost funny that the authors of the ad couldn't even find quotes to support their own misleading headline. The simple fact is, not a single person in the ad says they saw a "missile" hit TWA 800 or any other aircraft.

I notice you supplied no links.

171 posted on 07/17/2004 8:05:06 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Drug prohibition laws help fund terrorism.)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
"And as long as you saw fit to call me a liar, I will call you a liar for saying that jet fuel is flammable except under extreme pressure and temperature."

Then you ought to apologize, because first, I never said anything about jet fuel. I said jet fuel vapor. Big difference. And here is what Boeing says about it...

"The flammability of the center tank ullage is a function of the temperature of the center tank fuel puddle (a thin layer on the bottom of the nearly empty tank) as well as other factors (e.g., fuel composition). Our analysis of the JFK fuel temperature data (spikes that approach actual fuel temperature), together with data from the Marana test (see below), lead us to conclude that the fuel temperature of the puddle of fuel at the time of the TWA 800 event was approximately 130°F to 140°F. Based on this temperature estimate and the jet fuel test data, we conclude the CWT was well within the envelope to be considered flammable. "

And here is the link to a source listing fuel tank explosions...Fuel Tank Explosions

172 posted on 07/17/2004 8:06:24 AM PDT by Rokke
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To: Non-Sequitur
The Navy doesn't conduct live fire exercises anywhere near that area for the simple reason that it is the most heavily travelled air corridor in the world, and the chance of accident would be unacceptably high.

I read all the conspiracy theories with an open mind, and their point is that night they were testing the AEGIS system (I think that is what it was called) specifically as some final test to show that it was sophisticated enough to operate in a very busy warfare situation.

I don't want to believe anyone would be that cold, but then again they did test chemical agents on ordinary citizens in the subway system so who knows.
173 posted on 07/17/2004 8:07:43 AM PDT by JayNorth
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To: Tribune7
Dubya's biggest mistakes were keeping Clarke & Tenent.

...and Mineta!
174 posted on 07/17/2004 8:09:41 AM PDT by JayNorth
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To: redhead
My question has always been, WHY did they cover this up? Or OKC? I guess I'm just not a politically-savvy observer. What did the government stand to lose by revealing the truth about TWA800, etc?

Read my post #170. Clinton's policy toward terrorism was to ignore it. If he acknowleged it, that meant he'd have to DO something about it. Even after we were attacked the first time in our own country, the man never once even visited the World Trade Center. He ignored terrorist attacks on US embassies and military property all over the world, using the "out of sight, out of mind approach" As long as he kept his poll finger in the air and the economy was perking along, he didn't want to be bothered with anything else but mugging for the camera everyday and thinking about his other head.

(I joined FR too late to get in on the meatiest discussions....)

You should never think that way. FR is a great place to discuss anything and everything.
175 posted on 07/17/2004 8:11:03 AM PDT by demkicker
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To: nonkultur
We've had the Achille Lauro, the Munich Olympics, the pipe bomb at the Olympics in Atlanta, the TWA 800, the bombing of embassies, and it's not going to disappear overnight.

Didn't George Stephanopoulos slip and say something similar, grouping TWA 800 with some other events we know for sure were terrorism?
176 posted on 07/17/2004 8:16:53 AM PDT by JayNorth
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To: muawiyah
Looks like we have another one who still has problems with the concepts of rocks falling out of the sky.

I know rocks fall out of the sky, but there should at least be some evidence if that was the cause of Flt 800's demise. There isn't, and the "official" reason stinks. Witnesses speak of an object going UP and hitting the plane, not falling DOWN onto the plane.
177 posted on 07/17/2004 8:20:42 AM PDT by demkicker
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To: demkicker; sine_nomine
I agree with you both. I've thought that since that whole cockamamie spark-in-the-CWT theory was pushed as the cause. There's a lot of good reading at TWA 800's site.
178 posted on 07/17/2004 8:28:57 AM PDT by 7.62 x 51mm (• Veni • Vidi • Vino •)
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To: 7.62 x 51mm

Thanks for the link.


179 posted on 07/17/2004 8:33:51 AM PDT by demkicker
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To: Ken in Denver

How would you know if anyone took credit for it, if the release of videos or transcripts of those taking the credit would be handled by the govt, and in Arabic most likely?


180 posted on 07/17/2004 8:34:36 AM PDT by jeremiah (Sunshine scares all of them, for they all are cockaroaches)
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