Posted on 09/08/2004 7:44:19 AM PDT by Tacis
While interesting, your hypothesis is entirely groundless and counterproductive. Kerry's fitness reports are available and are, run-of-the-mill sterling with respect to how the Navy was generally rating all of its officers with the exception of the pure dirtbags at the time! Go after Kerry on his after-the-Navy exploits and record of the past two decades. His Vietnam service is a sure loser for us because, (with excepted due respect to the SBVFT) according to his Navy rating superiors, he did his job and did it well!
DD 214 is only for active duty separation. There is another form for fulfillment of reserve obligation.
Roger that. Poor fitness reports (OER's) are one thing, BCDs, DDs or Dismissals are entirely another. I seriously doubt there is any way he could ever have hid getting courts-martialed. So, whatever he has, has to be administrative. Otherwise, a CM conviction is a matter of public record like any conviction and easily traced.
ping
Pinging sKERRY's misdeeds happens so often that my keyboard sounds like the hour-bell at school.
FREEP THIS POLL!
"How do Vietnam War combat veterans who returned to America and then spoke out against the war deserve to be regarded in history?"
http://www.thehistorynet.com/
Just an example of stupid and easily refutable statements:
We know Kerry was issued a DD 214 in March 1970 even though his military obligation wasn’t supposed to end until March, 1972, a total of about 6 years (there is an issue of whether his agreed upon total obligation was 6 or 6.5 years). It may be they “turned him loose.” We also know that Kerry received a discharge in March, 1978 but have not seen any associated DD 214.
A DD-214 is issued whenever a service member significantly changes status. Hence, when Kerry finished OCS, he received a DD-214 releasing him from his enlisted service to accept a commission. When he left active duty, he received another DD-214, and when he completed his service obligation altogether, he would have received yet another DD-214.
Somewhere in my own files I have three similar DD-214s: when I was released from the enlisted reserve to accept a reserve commission, when I completed my two years on active duty, and when I completed my entire service obligation. What's so hard for people to understand about multiple DD-214s?
Kerry would not be eligible for a pardon under Proclamation 4483--any offenses committed by Kerry were against the Uniform Code of Military Justice, not the Military Selective Service Act (which only concerned itself with conscripted induction into the armed forces; once the recruit swore the oath, he was under the UCMJ).
Also, a BCD or dishnorable discharge is the result of a court-martial sentence, and cannot be imposed by a commander in the absence of a court-martial conviction. It is evidence of a felony conviction. There would be recollection of such an event by Kerry's peers and subordinates.
There's plenty of reason to despise Kerry; this one's not gonna hunt.
I simply cannot fathom an officer being issued a BCD for anything but the most serious of offenses. I saw nothing in your post that referenced any evidence of even a possibility of a BCD. Also, at least back in those days, hardship and medical were not separate discharges, but were either honorable or general under medical or hardship conditions.
Nevertheless, I believe that there are likely serious issues to address in Kerry's unreleased records, which may possibly be unfavorable performance reviews, letters of reprimand, etc. I would like to see those records, but will refrain from making any unsubstantiated assumptions until then.
Hell, I have two DD-214s and two honorable discharges: one each from my reenlistment and from my final discharge.
Kerry gave an anti war speech at his graduation in 1966. During an interview, I believe while protesting in the Mall, he said he had been to Viet Nam in '68 for a stop-over (Da Nang). He told of the horrors of seeing dead Viet Cong all over, along with Vietnamese citizens. He said then, that he realized we were occupiers. Remember, this was 1968. He said in '71, "I wanted to go back and see what was going on but I didn't really want to get involved in the war, " so he volunteered for Swift Boat duty because they were used just for patrol. Two weeks prior, the policy was changed and he became an overnight hero.
Release your complete military records, Ketchupman! And twerpy te-RAY-za--release your complete IRS records. What have you two got to hide, America's #2 dipsticks. Since you're #2, you gotta try harder. And who is America's #1 dipstick--why the clintoons. YYYaaaaayyyy!!!
Does your line of thinking also apply to the Bush was AWOL charges? Because it sure doesn't seem to apply for the MSM. Bush has released all his records, and still there is the BIG CONSPIRACY.
Lets compare track records of just one thing. Both major candidates for POTUS both served in the military during the same era, for comparible periods of time. Has either one released their military records? If so WHICH ONE? That is the man who HAS PROVED his forthrightness to the country.
As POTUS one of the most important qualities to have is trust. Some people will be partisan no matter what the proof. These are shameful people not worthy of this country. But who has proved his trust worthiness by releasing his records, while another hides behind his.
You are correct that there are many other issues to go after Kerry. But none of them are as important. KERRY IS THE ONE who has made an issue of his service. Kerry is the one who conspired with the VC. Kerry is the one who testified to the Senate, of the memories of Cambodia SEARED, SEARED into his memory. Either evrything he talks about is real, and happened, for which he is a hero. Or he is a little man trying to prop himself up as larger than life because he has a low self esteem. THAT IS NOT THE TYPE OF MAN WHO SHOULD BE IN CHARGE OF THE MOST POWERFUL MILITARY, ECONOMY, AND INFLUENTIAL COUNTRY OF THE WORLD.
Make no mistake. This is not a small matter. In the big picture, if he IS NOT what he claims to be, then this is the MOST IMPORTANT ISSUE. It affects our national security, and our national sovereignty. Economics and domestic and foreign issues are small potatoes to this one issue. In fact they all hinge on national security and sovereignty.
Rant off
The March 1970, actually 03 Jan 70 effective date, is the release from active duty. You won't see a DD 214 from the transfer from inactive reserve to standby reserve. That's a mere administrative transfer within the reserve component. Officer really aren't "discharged", because they never "enlisted". Also no DD-214 upon release from the Standby reserve. There should be something, which I haven't seen, indicating resignation of his commission. They don't just "discharge" you, you have to resign your commission.
You're trying to make too much stew with one oyster.
One of the poll responses is "they're traitors". FREEP it.
We know Kerry was issued a DD 214 in March 1970 even though his military obligation wasn’t supposed to end until March, 1972, a total of about 6 years (there is an issue of whether his agreed upon total obligation was 6 or 6.5 years). It may be they “turned him loose.” We also know that Kerry received a discharge in March, 1978 but have not seen any associated DD 214.
Wrong. You receive a DD 214 when released from active duty.
Here’s my hypothesis. Kerry did not turn bad without reason. Just as Benedict Arnold turned bad when he did not receive the recognition he felt he deserved, so to, I believe, did Kerry respond to some slight, real or imagined by the Navy. His true record will show, I believe, some action/inaction by the Navy (passed over for promotion/assignment?), then his request to be released to run for Congress, the 3/70 DD 214 and transfer to the inactive reserve, and then, in 1970, 1971 or 1972, a bad conduct discharge (or “Big Chicken Dinner” as one respondent described it). Maybe, it was a bad “spin” number, but then that would not explain the seemingly strange dates and 12 year period of military service.
You are making something up out of whole cloth. Kerry was transferred into the Inactive Standby Reserves on July 1, 1972. The Navy convenes boards to decide who should be retained in the Standby Reserves and who to let go with an honorable discharge. I know from personal experience. I resigned my commission and was released from active duty in 1972. I received my honorable discharge in 1978 dated Feb 16, the same date as Kerry's.
I agree Kerry should authorize release his service records, but not for the reasons cited by you.
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