Posted on 11/15/2004 6:38:13 PM PST by Laissez-faire capitalist
Democrats, after their embarrassing defeat at the hands of George W. Bush in the 2004 elections, apparently are trying to reframe what "moral values" are.
Voters, when given a choice of what was their primary reason for how they voted and whom they voted for picked moral values as the #1 reason. This can be found at http://www.pollingreport.com
The attempt by Democrats to reframe "moral values" is now being used to encompass such issues as poverty, while apparently excluding such issues as same-sex marriage.
Why would Christ be for same-sex marriage, when Christ was involved in the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah?.. but we'll get to that later.
While Christ, Himself, stated explicitely that we, as Christians, were to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, and visit the infirm (Matt. 25:31-46), the Bible also states that if one can work, and willingly chooses not to, that person should do without. (2 Thess. 3:11) "..if any would not work, neither should he eat."
This even includes mothers who wont work and yet want to live off of taxpayer-subsidized apartments, AFDC checks, and food-stamps.
Remember, Christ called Paul the Apostle; Paul even declared this. Christ appeared to Paul the Apostle on the road to Damascus. Paul stated that the things which he wrote in the New Testament were given to him by Christ. (Galatians chap. 3)
Those who are for hand-outs to those not willing or wanting to work, be they Democrats or Republicans, are going against scripture.
Now, suprisingly to some, Christ had alot to say concerning same-sex marriage. In Matthew 5:31, 19:4-6; Mk. 10:1; Luke 16:18) Christ stated such things as: " For this cause shall a man shall leave his father and mother and shall cleave to his wife, and the twain shall be one flesh." Never once did Christ state that a man was to leave his father and mother and cleave to another man, or a woman leave and cleave to another woman. As well, not one scripture from the beginning of the Bible, Genesis, to the end, Revelation, ever condones same-sex marriage yet alone same-sex relationships.
What does the Bible, though, say about same-sex relationships?
To answer this, one must first start back at the beginning of the Bible, the book of Genesis. In Genesis 13:13 it states that "the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the Lord exceedingly." The Bible even records that God appeared to Abraham to tell him that he intended to destroy Sodom (from whence the term Sodomy is derived) for its wickedness.
In Genesis chap 19:4-9 it states that the men of Sodom came outside of Lot's(Abraham's nephew) house and asked Lot if they could have sexual relations with the two male guests who appeared in the gates of Sodom at dusk and were lodging with Lot that night. The two guests were actually angels as the Bible declares. Lot emphatically declared to them no. Then, after being told no, they stated their intention to gang-rape Lot: Gen. 19:9. Lot offered his two virgin daughters to the sex-crazed sodomites, knowing that as homosexuals they wouldn't want them, anyway.
Just why did God destroy Sodom, though, as Genesis chapter 19 declares?
Some say it was for inhospitableness or attempting to gang-rape Lot or even desiring the angels. While these may be additional factors, the Bible says in Genesis 13:13, long before the two angels even set foot in Sodom, that "the men of Sodom were wicked and sinners before the Lord exceedingly." Even Ezekiel 16:46-50 states why God destroyed Sodom.
Ezekiel 16:46-50: "Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fullness of bread and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strenghten the hand of the poor and needy. And they were haughty and committed ABOMINATION before me. Therefore I took them away as I saw good."
What abomination could this be? Sodomy.
Leviticus 19:20 "Thou shalt not lie with mankind as with womankind; it is abomination."
Now to the part about Jesus helping in the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. 1.) Genesis 19:24: "Then the Lord rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the Lord out of heaven. This was after Lot had made it safely to the caves, with his two daughters, as per the angel's instructions.
2.) Jesus said in John 10:30 "I and my Father are one."
3.)Now, it was either the Father and the Son, Jesus Christ, or the Father and the Holy Ghost, or the Son and the Holy Ghost which destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah. Even if the Father and Holy Ghost were the two who destroyed Sodom, Jesus was still involved since He and His Father are one, as He, Christ Jesus, in John 10:30 declared.
As well, numerous scriptures in the New Testamnet declare that homosexuality is an abomination in God's sight.
Romans 1:27 states that "men left the natural use of the woman and burned in their lust one with another, men working with men that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves the just recompense for their error.". The preceeding scriptures talk about women with women being a sin in God's sight, as well.
All of this clearly shows that Christ Jesus is against same-sex relationships as well as same-sex marriage. They are an abomination in God's sight.
2 Peter 2: 7-11 declares why the Bible in Genesis 13:13 calls the men of Sodom "wicked and sinners before the Lord exceedingly. It states "and [the Lord] delivered just Lot vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked."
vexed. Gr. Kataponeomai. Translation: To wear down. filthy. Gr. Aselgeia. Translation: Lustfulness Conversation Gr. Anastrophe. Translation: Conduct
Translation of 2 Peter 1:27: God rescued just Lot, who was wore down from the lustful conduct of the wicked sodomites, who, according to Ezekiel 16:46-50 were destroyed for the abomination of Sodomy as Levitius chap. 19, Romans 1:27, and Ezekiel 16: 50 declare.
Christ says in John 14:15 that "if you love me you will keep my commandments."
Christ commanded that men only marry women, not men marrying men or women marrying women. If you are for same-sex marriage the you are against his commandments, and cannot possibly love Him. Christ, as well, destroyed the Sodomites for their wicked, lustful lifestyle, as John 10:30 and Genesis 19:24 show. Why would he then, again, condone a same-sex relationship yet alone a same-sex marriage?
If Christ Jesus doesn't condone homosexuality, as Genesis 19:24 declares, why should we?
Christ spoke and we have the Scriptures.
If one will not have Him as Savior, he will have Him as Judge.
"Whosoever shall fall upon that rock shall be broken but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder." (Lk. 20:18).
Don't take Christ's longsuffering for weakness. and don't think He chuckles at sodomy or any other sin.
God cares.
FACT: Mohammad is a false prophet and allah is a false god.
PROOF: The wordwide hate and destruction at the direction of "allah". This is nothing but an idol worshipping cult whose sole aim is the death of anyone who does not convert and worldwide domination.
It can not be compared even rhetorically to Christianity.
Jude 1:7 as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them, in like manner to these, committing fornication, and going away after other flesh, laid down an example before-times, undergoing vengeance of everlasting fire.
I think Jesus would say something like this:
Mt 19:4
And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
But of course the fact that He said it won't make people believe it.
There is no "might have said" where Jesus is concerned. If you read the entire Bible, you will see that Jesus was present in the Old Testament and those words were His. Yes, His words that are highlighted in red are all about love, but so were His words from the beginning. It's all about the love for God.
God doesn't need us...we need Him.
In fact, I explicitly said that Christians are better off speaking where the Bible speaks and remaining silent where the Bible is silent.
Speaking where the Bible speaks certainly includes St. Paul. Why would I exclude him?
2 Corinthians 5:17-20
17. Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; the old has gone, the new has come!
18. All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation:
19. that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men's sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.
20. We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us.
We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God
You've gone to the scriptures and discovered Jesus had already said something on the subject, albeit inferrentially, but clearly targeted.
That is not the same as sitting down and saying to yourself "Now, let me pretend to be Jesus (God) and come up with something Jesus might say or do concerning the issue."
NO society has every permitted homosexual marriage, or even treated homosexuality as equally acceptable to heterosexuality. Men have always been expected to marry women and sire children. Some societies (such as the Muslims) condone homosexual activity, but never the homosexual lifestyle. In other words, homosexuality may be acceptable as a side dish, but never as the main course.
No doubt it's founders in Damascus and Yemen got it all wrong!
"No society"? The Classical Greeks certainly encouraged homosexuality. In fact, they felt heterosexuality should be reserved solely for procreation.
Thanks for posting.
But that pronunciation comes from Scripture, not any secular authority. And no state authority should be responsible for enforcing Scriptural law. So any retribution exacted against homosexuals must come in the form of Divine punishment, not anything meted out by mere mortals. We, alone, are unfit to judge.
No, gay Americans apparently aren't "sick of it". They feel compelled to try an change well-established social norms which have existed thousands of years. Norms such as marriage between one man and one woman...all to satisfy theire need for acceptance....even if it mens forcing it upon the majority of Americans who are sick of their demands.
Gay demands...that is what Americans are sick of!
And they're sick of seeing their(gay people) need to force their lifestyle choice upon us all.
Just look at post #38 and the pictures. Most Americans are sick and tired of this!!!
I was sick of this gay crap during the "Ellen" garbage, then the disgraceful TIME "Lesbians" cover, and it just got worse from there. I wish they would just keep their perversions to their own bedrooms and out of my family's face.
It's been argued that what's interpreted as homosexual relationships would simply be very strong friendships. Either way, men were expected to marry women and father children. In Sparta, citizens had a duty to wed and have children.
Men who were full-time homosexuals were despised as effeminate and the objects of mockery in ancient Greek plays.
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