Yep!Bye, ainitfunny.
"He/she/it's dead, Jim!"
Posted on 02/08/2005 10:48:57 PM PST by ainitfunny
Fair use for education/discussion purposes:
Yahoo! News News Home - Help AFP CIA renditions of terror suspects are 'out of control:' report
Sun Feb 6, 5:57 PM ET
WASHINGTON (AFP) - The Central Intelligence Agency (news - web sites)'s 'rendition' of suspected terrorists has spiralled 'out of control' according to a former FBI (news - web sites) agent, cited in a report which examined how CIA (news - web sites) detainees are spirited to states suspected of using torture.
Michael Scheuer a former CIA counterterrorism agent told The New Yorker magazine "all we've done is create a nightmare," with regard to the top secret practice of renditions.
In an article titled 'Outsourcing Torture' due to hit newsstands this week, the magazine claims suspects, sometimes picked up by the CIA, are often flown to Egypt, Morocco, Syria and Jordan, "each of which is known to use torture in interrogations."
The report said suspects are given few, if any, legal protections.
Despite US laws that ban America from expelling or extraditing individuals to countries where torture occurs, Scott Horton -- an expert on international law who has examined CIA renditions -- estimates that 150 people have been picked up in the CIA dragnet since 2001.
The New Yorker report said that suspects in Europe, Africa, Asia and the Middle East "have been abducted by hooded or masked American agents" and then sometimes forced onto a white Gulfstream V jet.
The jet -- marked on its tail by the code N379P which has recently been changed to N8068V -- "has been registered to a series of dummy American corporations ... (and) has clearance to land at US military bases," it said.
Maher Arar was arrested in 2002 by US officials at John F. Kennedy airport and then claims he was put on a "executive jet" which flew him to Amman, Jordan, before he was driven to Syria.
Arar says he was tortured in Syria and told his interrogators anything they wanted due to the beatings He was released without charge in 2003 and is suing the US government for his mistreatment.
He claims that the crew onboard the Gulfstream identified themselves as "the Special Removal Unit" during radio communications on his flight to Jordan.
"The most common destinations for rendered suspects are Egypt, Morocco, Syria and Jordan, all of which have been cited for human rights violations by the (US) State Department," the report said.
By holding detainees without counsel or charges of wrongdoing, the administration of US President George W. Bush (news - web sites) "has jeopardized its chances of convicting hundreds of suspected terrorists, or even of using them as witnesses in almost any court in the world," the report said.
The article cited Dan Coleman, an ex Federal Bureau of Investigation counterterrorism expert who retired in July 2003.
Coleman told The New Yorker that torture "has become bureaucratized," by the Bush administration, and that the practice of renditions is "out of control."
Scheuer said there had been a legal process underlying early renditions, but as more suspects were rounded up following the September 11, 2001, attacks, "all we've done is create a nightmare."
Abductees are effectively classified as "illegal enemy combatants," by the US government, which is how it also classifies the estimated 550 'war on terror' detainees held at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
Such a classifiction, the US argues, exempts such detainees from the protections of the Geneva Conventions, part of which govern the treatment of prisoners.
The report also cited the former British Ambassador to Uzbekistan, Craig Murray, as saying Washington has accepted intelligence from Uzkbekistan that was "largely rubbish."
[B]The ambassador claims to know of at least three individuals rendered to Uzbekistan by the United States, where cases of the authorities boiling prisoners' body parts have been documented.[/B]
Washington has admitted it is holding some suspects, including top Al-Qaeda operative Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, but it does not say where he is detained.
Mohammed has reportedly been "water boarded" during interrogations: So called 'water boarding' refers to a practice whereby a detainee is bound and immersed in water until he nearly drowns.
Copyright © 2005 Agence France Presse. All rights reserved. The information contained in the AFP News report may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or r[edistributed without the prior written authority of Agence France Presse. Copyright © 2005 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved. Questions or Comments Privacy Policy -Terms of Service - Copyright Policy - Ad Feedback
Book them a flight on that mysterious gulf stream. I for one hope the story is true. I hope people with no names working for agencies that don't exist are busy dealing with these scumbags in ways that I couldn't even dream up and if we don't have the stomach for it, let the Egyptians do it for us.
ainitfunny is history.
"The wheels of justice grind slowly but they grind exceeding fine."
Total fabrication made up by someone who has no clue what he is talking about. Moral issues aside, torture is the worst way to get information. The best way is to develop a relationship with the individual and then key in on what motivates him. Information obtained through torture is totally unreliable. This story is classic "axe to grind" sourcing.
Sounds good to me Sam.
Where do you start with this cr@pola?
Yep!Bye, ainitfunny.
"He/she/it's dead, Jim!"
I don't doubt this story. I recall an interview just after the AbuGrieb flap erupted. They were asking a former spook about what sort of methods were used for extracting information. One of the tactics that was cited, was that they would blindfold the prisoner, fly him around in circles for awhile, then land at the same place they left from. They would then take the prisoner into a room where there would be US officials dressed as whichever country they wanted the prisoner to think they had flown him to, complete with flags of the "host" country and such. The whole purpose was to lend credibilty to threats of torture by making the prisoner believe he was in a country that actually allowed torture tactics. All this and they didn't even have to jolt him once. The psy-ops guys are tricky, eh?
sounds like a plan.
a very good plan. ship them back to countries that understand the mid-eastern mind set and "rendition" .
Thanks for the update!
It was because of the counter-terrorism restrictions imposed during the Carter and Clinton administrations that we're in the situation now. Carter made sure the intelligence communities couldn't take to each other. Then Clinton made sure that during counter-terrorism "investigations" the agents couldn't talk to "dirty people". (I'm somewhat paraphrasing)
I know this from personal experience ...
I would believe that...
My thoughts as well. ;)
I believe you. Our intelligence capability, especially humint, was gutted and left to rot.
Good Lord. This was going the rounds a month ago. Mysterious jet tied to torture flights It must not have gotten enough traction so they'll bring it back.
So we're outsourcing torture?
Stifle yourself junior.
Despite US laws that ban America from expelling or extraditing individuals to countries where torture occurs
Expelling or extraditing? If they were picked up outside the U.S. they have not been expelled, or extradited.
By holding detainees without counsel or charges of wrongdoing, the administration of US President George W. Bush (news - web sites) "has jeopardized its chances of convicting hundreds of suspected terrorists, or even of using them as witnesses in almost any court in the world," the report said.
I don't want to try them, or their colleagues. I want a team of guys in ninja suits to kick in their doors and double tap them in the head. This is war, not a criminal investigation.
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