Boy scouts cutting public ties, Fear lawsuits over 'God' in oath

NorthJersey.com ^ | 01.20.06 | DEENA YELLIN

[Coleus]

The fear of lawsuits from the American Civil Liberties Union has driven 216 Boy Scout, Cub Scout and related troops across the state - including 35 in North Jersey - to sever their charters with public institutions.

Many of them, including Troop 124 in Northvale, have enjoyed a long friendship with municipalities that have sponsored the Scouts, provided them with funding and offered a comfortable meeting space. But an ACLU threat has sent troops scrambling for new sponsors.

The Boy Scouts of America issued a directive last April for all troops to transfer their sponsorship by the end of the year from public organizations to private entities, such as religious groups, fraternal organizations or parent-teacher clubs. The intent was to protect taxpayer-funded institutions from litigation.

The ACLU has argued that government sponsorship - which includes funding - of the Boy Scout troops violates the constitutional guarantee of religious freedom because the Scouts swear an oath that includes affirming duty to God.

"In order to participate in Boy Scout activities, you have to swear an allegiance to God. You can't have a directly government-sponsored activity which says you have to swear to faith in God," said Ed Yohnka, an ACLU spokesman.

To be in compliance, the Northvale troop will reluctantly dissolve its ties with the borough in the next few weeks and rewrite a charter with St. Anthony Church on Walnut Street in Northvale. The local troop had held meetings in the basement of the public library for the past six years. Now all that may change.

Trip McMillan of the Northern New Jersey Boy Scout Council said local troops have handled the change with few problems. "We've easily been able to find community organizations willing to support us," he said.

Scouts may continue meeting at schools or borough halls because of the Support Our Scouts Act that clarifies federal law so no local, state or federal agency can deny Scouts access to public government property, Yohnka said. "The Boy Scouts have the right to use the borough hall for meeting space if everyone has equal access to the facility," he said.

This is not the first time the ACLU has gone after the Boy Scouts. The ACLU has questioned the Scouts' exclusion of girls and avowed homosexuals and atheists from its membership. A Supreme Court decision in 2000 affirmed the organization's right to establish its own standards for membership and leadership that would include belief in God and heterosexuality.

In this case, rather than strike God from their oath or put public entities at risk for expensive lawsuits, the Boy Scouts have yielded to ACLU demands. "This could sap thousands of dollars from schools that are already financially strapped to provide education to children," said Greg Shields, national spokesman for the Boy Scouts of America. "Obviously, we wouldn't want that to happen. We want to protect our partners so we are moving them to other, private organizations."

Threat angers leaders

Jose Gomez, scoutmaster of Troop 171 in Teaneck, was infuriated when he discovered this month that he would have to change sponsorship from the Whittier School to the PTA. "It's ridiculous," said Gomez. "There are many more important issues and they are wasting time worrying about this. This is a group that helps kids behave better and do their homework and listen more to their parents. That's what people should focus on, instead of about where we are having meetings."

Even Scout leaders of troops that did not have to make any changes were angered at the ACLU for picking on the Boy Scouts once again. "The ACLU is dead wrong," said Ed Lindey, assistant scoutmaster in Upper Saddle River. "The Boy Scouts is one of the most wholesome institutions in the world. We teach our boys to be kind and respectful of other people."

As for boys who do not believe in God, said Lindey, whose group meets in a church, they have the choice to join or stay away. But moving some troops to houses of worship could cause concern among families whose religion differs from the sponsor.

Norman Kasser, a scoutmaster in Hoboken, said the parents of Scouts in his three troops - two mixed-religion units that meet in churches and one that meets in a synagogue - don't mind that the meetings are in houses of worship. But he did admit that the rabbi and some members of the synagogue were initially uncomfortable sponsoring an organization that appears to discriminate.

Rabbi Robert Scheinberg of the United Synagogue of Hoboken, where the troops meet, objects to the Scouts' anti-gay policies. However, the synagogue agreed to the sponsorship "because of all the good that the Boy Scouts manage to do and, second, because I know that our scoutmaster also strongly objects to the Scouts' anti-gay policy."

Others join the fight

The ACLU is not alone in this issue. California-based Scouting for All, a national non-profit educational and advocacy organization, reaches out to gay youth and is trying to get the Boy Scouts to rescind its policy against gays and atheists.

"Any organization that discriminates against any American should not be allowed to use public facilities. They should not be given taxpayer funded monies," said Scott Cozza, Scouting for All's president.

Boy Scout officials say the transition over the past year has shifted sponsorship of the vast majority of troops to private groups rather than public entities such as boroughs, fire departments, police departments and public housing complexes.

Yohnka, the ACLU spokesman, said the movement came after the Pentagon agreed in November 2004 to halt sponsorship of Scouting groups by military facilities after the ACLU filed a lawsuit. In April 2005, the ACLU of Illinois threatened litigation against other public institutions sponsoring Boy Scout programs.

"Government is supposed to be neutral with regards to religion," he said. But some Northvale officials are enraged by the ACLU's threat. They complain that the rights advocacy group is "picking on" an organization that influences young men to become better students and law-abiding citizens.

"We should be able to encourage good values in our kids. This left-wing agenda is taking God out of the country," said Northvale Mayor John Rooney, who added that he wanted to fight the issue in court but fears it would be costly to taxpayers. The nearly 70-year-old troop in Northvale has been sponsored in the past by the Redman Club, which is a fraternal organization, and by the Veterans of Foreign Wars, but the troop outgrew those quarters.

The troop, which is 30 members strong and growing, has been sponsored by the town for the past six years. Northvale has given the troop funds, as well as space in the library basement for its bimonthly meetings and activities. The new sponsor, St. Anthony Church, lacks space to handle the troop, so leaders hope to obtain permission to continue meeting in the library.

The Northvale troop didn't have any trouble finding a new sponsor, but hard feelings remain. "The town loves us," said Joe Kraus, a seven-year assistant scoutmaster. "It's sad that we have to sever that union."

[SandRat]

Scout week is 4 - 12 February.

The DC is my former boss at work and the DE is an eager young fellow (newlywed too). He's going to be alright I think. Has a lot to learn yet but he's coming along nicely and willing to learn and help.

The line for the Communications MB is understandable as it's a required one for Eagle.

Keep an eye on their progress and age towards Eagle and contemplate challenging them to go for the Hornaday Conservation Award once Eagle is done. That's a MAJOR Award for after Eagle and tough to earn.

From the sound of how they came home they'll sleep well tonight and be in bed early.

[sausageseller]

I always counsel scouts seeking to be Eagle scouts to get it done early and leave room to solve problems that may arise.

That is what happened to me. ended up with not enough time to get Eagle. "Life" and a 73 World Jambo were great accomplishments for me.

[Myrddin]

Let me know how your nephew does..you were amazing to reach Eagle at 15. Did you get Palms after that? My son wants to get 3 Palms - we're assuming it's ok to get the merit badges now..

My dad earned 42 merit badges...just because 21 was the minumum requirement. I moved on on DeMolay after making Eagle. Served as 7th Preceptor, Senior Councilor and Master Councilor. They needed some leadership. I was able to double the size of the chapter and keep folks active. I headed off to UCSD at age 17 and didn't have much time for Scouts or DeMolay. 18 to 22 units per quarter doesn't leave much free time. I graduated in June 1972 at age 19 with a degree in Molecular Biology.

The broad range of skills acquired in Scouts via merit badges and leadership positions continues to pay dividends. Attaining a particular rank is like getting a gold star on a spelling test. It's what you learned on the way that matters.

[nygoose]

I will at least double my annual contribution.

[livius]

Many people will. When a group accepts government money, it sells its soul to the Devil.

I don't think it's always badly intentioned on the part of the govt - Bush's plan to give money to churches for various social services is certainly not intended to harm the churches. But another President or a crazed judge comes along, and suddenly this money (which is not even much, usually) means that the church or private organization in question has to give up all its core beliefs and distinctiveness and adopt the bizarre PC ideas of a government that is increasingly at odds with the beliefs of its citizens.

[Myrddin]

I wanted to go to Philmont, but that never happened. My nephew did get to go. My parents could only manage to get me to scout camp once when we were in Virginia. That one time netted advancement to 2nd class, swimming merit badge, cooking merit badge, rowing merit badge, canoing merit badge and a mile swim patch. The Goshen scout camp was really first class.

My two favorite "jamboree" events were at Yorktown in 1968 and the 200th Anniversary in San Diego. The area where I camped at the 1969 event was about 1/4 mile from where the house I purchased in 1983 was built.

I had the pleasure of standing on the tarmac at Miramar Naval Air Station as the first F-14 Tomcat arrived with the Secretary of the Navy in the RIO seat. That pre-dated the formation of the Top Gun school. It was also the event that grow into the annual Miramar Air Show. My troop had been invited to pass out the airshow schedule flyers.

[Coleus]

Thank you and please bypass the United Way and give directly to your local scouting council.

[MarMema]

and contemplate challenging them to go for the Hornaday Conservation Award once Eagle is done. That's a MAJOR Award for after Eagle and tough to earn.

OK, that's it! We were just upstairs talking about this an hour ago. You either have a camera in our home or you need to go get a lottery ticket. :-)

I am wondering why you said "after Eagle", though.

My oldest son is interested in it now.
He has two of the bold MB requirements - Env Science, and now Forestry.
And he has two of the non-bold MBs - Fishing and Nuclear Science.

So all he needs is Fish and Wildlife, which he just got a signed blue card for....and to do the project.

We were also talking about the World Conservation Panda. My oldest son just needs Fish and Wildlife for that as well.

Glad to hear you like your DE!

[MarMema]

That one time netted advancement to 2nd class, swimming merit badge, cooking merit badge, rowing merit badge, canoing merit badge and a mile swim patch.

That was one busy and wet week! We've been looking at Rowing for my youngest son, but it's not offered much out here and looks pretty tough.

[MarMema]

It's what you learned on the way that matters.

Yep. That's what I love about merit badges. My oldest son has 21 now, and my youngest has 15. I hope to keep them going getting as many of them as they find interesting and possible to complete. Even the ones like Bird Study are just incredible for general knowledge and opening their little teenage minds to new things. :-)

I know you meant more than merit badges, too, but I'm just the mom and not really involved in other parts of their Scout lives like my husband is...

[Myrddin]

The music and bugling merit badges were a piece of cake. I was in the habit of practicing my trumpet 3 hours per day to stay in the first seat. The electricity, radio and electronics merit badges were easy too. I eventually parlayed that experience into an Extra Class ham license and First Class Radiotelephone license. Mastering Morse code in scouts made that part of the ham license dirt simple.

I surprised my mom by earning the Firemanship merit badge while she was on a 3-day visit to Honolulu, Hawaii to see my dad during one of his cruises.

The merit badge counselor for the Markmanship merit badge was also the local examiner for the hunter's safety exam required to get a hunting license in California. I passed the hunter's safety exam and the merit badge requirements in one sitting. The shooting part was dead simple. Five groups, 3 shots per group at 50 feet. Each group must be small enough to cover with a quarter. I do that at 100 yards and cover it with a dime today.

This was my sighting in target to see how close the scope was to center. I still have 15 rounds in the box of 20 to finish moving the group to dead center.

[nygoose]

...please bypass the United Way

I always bypass United Way and The American Red Cross. Go Salvation Army!

[tflabo]

LJ.....thats my prayer too....that this bully trouble-stirring organization ACLU gets utterly crushed and destroyed for the evil deeds done. Targeting the Boy Scouts makes them worse than stank diarrhea.

[Flavius Josephus]

While it tilts the odds in your favor, you still have to perform.

Unlike so many resume enhancers, you have to learn *How* to perform to get this one. I miss scouting. It would have been nice to have had a child to re-experience it with.

[Flavius Josephus]

Charleston SOUTH Carolina

That's ok, on another thread today a poster rather huffily proclaimed "I wasn't there to see Grant's march to the sea either, but it doesn't mean I can't have an opinion on it!" Reminds me of that line from Animal House "Did we give up when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor???"

[SandRat]

The Hornaday requires 4 separate projects that are equal to Eagle in 4 separate areas of conservation/nature/wildife/forestry etc. Carefully check out the requirements. It's available on the web and if you can't find it let me know and I'll send you the link.

And no, I don't have a spying device in your house! Scouts Honor! LOL!!!

[Coleus]

Go Salvation Army! >>>

they're set for life, Ray Kroc's wife too care of that.

[Sometimes A River]

Boy the "tolerant" Liberals never give up, do they.

[Sometimes A River]

* has become * ?

Friend, the communist ACLU has long been an enemy of the USA.

[twidle]

My family was Scout family. We were told by our leaders
that Scout Groups should be organized from natural play
groups in the neighborhood and to meet in one another's
homes. This worked pretty well except the jewish children
would not speak up when we celebrated Christmas and other
holidays and parents got upset when we sang Christmas Carols. Communication is important from the parents because
leaders want their Scouts to be compatible and to learn to
get along.
The group began to fall apart at age 13 when the boys
began to feel that Scouts was "baby stuff". Our boys grew up to be well educated professioals and polite to others and with outdoor skills they would not have had without Scouts.
More effort needs to be made to get along, among the
parents as well as the boys.