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Did Chinese Intelligence pickup on Iraq moving WMD to Syria? ( Based on FR document translation )
FreeRepublic and Security Watchtower ^ | March 28, 2006 | By C.S. Scott

Posted on 03/28/2006 10:56:21 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach

FreeRepublic Thread with ?Translation :

Saddam Regime Document Dated January 2003: The French and German Connections (Translation)

*******************************************

In this document ISGZ-2004-028179 there is a report by the Assistant of the Iraqi Intelligence Director to his boss “The Director” dated January/23/2003 regarding the visit of one German and one Frenchman to Iraq and these two guys talk about their strong relation with the top government officials in both France and Germany. In this letter the German that German Chancellor Schroeder was totally opposed to the idea of the war in Iraq and it his opposition to the possible war that made him win the German elections held in 2002. Also there is an important part of the letter where it mention the visit of German Chancellor to meet with the Chinese Prime minister and that the Chinese PM told Schroeder “about the information that was obtained by the Chinese intelligence and it says that Iraq has moved his mass of destruction weapon to Syria and the German Chancellor told him that the German intelligence did not indicate this. And after two days the US state secretary went to Damascus to check on this with the Syrian government that in turn denied this news.” Also in the letter it show the fear of the French to join the war because of the heavy losses that will suffer..

Beginning of the Translation of 4 pages report in document ISGZ-2004-028179

*****************************AN EXCERPT from Security Watchtower************************

According to a Free Republic translation of an Iraqi Intelligence document, Chinese Intelligence had picked up information that Iraq had moved their weapons of mass destruction to Syria. The document reveals Chinese Prime Minister Zhu Rongji had held a meeting with German President Gerhard Schroeder and told him "the information that was obtained by the Chinese intelligence and it says that Iraq has moved his mass of destruction weapon to Syria and the German Chancellor told him that the German intelligence did not indicate this. And after two days the US state secretary went to Damascus to check on this with the Syrian government that in turn denied this news.”

The trip by Colin Powell to Syria in February 2001 may be what the document is referring to. According to the report, Secretary Powell announced a last minute, unscheduled visit to Syria, saying he was "going to be stopping in Damascus, Syria, to meet with President Bashir Assad" in order to hold talks and "present a report to President Bush as to what we should be doing."

***********************************************

Closing

*****************************************

The report also notes that "in April 2001, Hanning told the Welt am Sonntag newspaper that Iraq was developing a new class of chemical weapons, reiterated his alert on Iraq's missile and nuclear programs, and said that several German companies had continued to deliver to Baghdad components needed for the production of poison gas."

Two unanswered questions remain.

1. What led Chinese intelligence to believe that Saddam Hussein may have moved weapons of mass destruction to Syria?

2. Was Schroeder's denial of Iraq moving WMD largely a result of his own knowledge that Iraq still had weapons of mass destruction in their own country?

Posted by C.S. Scott at March 28, 2006 12:44 AM


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: china; iraq; iraqiintelligence; prewardocs; russia; wmd
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1 posted on 03/28/2006 10:56:24 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach
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To: jveritas; eyespysomething; Marine_Uncle; Coop

Good presentation of some questions arising from the document translated by JV.


2 posted on 03/28/2006 10:58:23 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Freepers: doing the work the MSM used to do.


3 posted on 03/28/2006 10:58:34 AM PST by LS (CNN is the Amtrak of news)
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To: LS; Grampa Dave; Jim Robinson; Brad's Gramma; Peach; Mo1; Cap Huff; Dog

AMEN!!!


4 posted on 03/28/2006 11:01:47 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Oil for food folks trying to cover their a**! they got busted anyhow!


5 posted on 03/28/2006 11:05:59 AM PST by Echo Talon
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; Chena; Valin; M. Thatcher; DocRock; Calpernia; Madame Dufarge; Txsleuth; ...
Thanks for the ping Ernest_!

Did Chinese Intelligence pickup on Iraq moving WMD to Syria? ( Based on FR document translation )

Release/Translation of Classified PreWar Docs ping. If you want to be added or removed to the ping list, please Freepmail me.

Please add the keyword prewardocs to any articles pertaining to this subject.

Operation Iraqi Freedom Documents

Also here

Documents from the Harmony Database

jveritas’s blog

6 posted on 03/28/2006 11:06:18 AM PST by eyespysomething
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; LS

The MSM has given up. So we've taken over for them.


7 posted on 03/28/2006 11:06:43 AM PST by Peach
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To: LS

Nah, the Old Media never did this.


8 posted on 03/28/2006 11:07:41 AM PST by MeanWestTexan (Many at FR would respond to Christ "Darn right, I'll cast the first stone!")
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To: eyespysomething; jveritas

Whomever is helping jveritas with this blog - THANK YOU!!!


9 posted on 03/28/2006 11:10:42 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach
The MSM has given up. So we've taken over for them.

I don't think they gave up. I think they couldn't rationalize their position on the war with what was contained in the documents. Psychologists might call this cognitive dissonance. I call it selective ignorance or plausible deniability (a concept made popular by Bill Clinton).

10 posted on 03/28/2006 11:11:02 AM PST by Ben Mugged (labor unions are socialism's shock troops)
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To: Ben Mugged

Oooh - good points.


11 posted on 03/28/2006 11:11:50 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach
The MSM has given up. So we've taken over for them.

Don't you just love it.....seems so RIGHT!!!

12 posted on 03/28/2006 11:12:47 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Help spread the word about jveritas's blog:

Freeper jveritas, who was interviewed by the NYT and The Boston Globe, has a web site now with the help of someone.

http://iraqdocs.blogspot.com/



13 posted on 03/28/2006 11:13:34 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach
Oh thanks, I didn't catch what you were talking about.....

Good Move by JV....

14 posted on 03/28/2006 11:15:59 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

I'm going to try and post that on the various threads as I come across them.

He's doing such fabulous work; I'm proud of him.


15 posted on 03/28/2006 11:16:44 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach

Bookmarked!


16 posted on 03/28/2006 11:17:25 AM PST by tiredoflaundry (I'll admit it , I'm a Snow Flake !(Snoq) The rest of my tagline redacted by court order.)
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To: tiredoflaundry

Hi, tired. Let's try and remember to post that info about jveritas's blog tomorrow on the Tony Snow thread.


17 posted on 03/28/2006 11:18:30 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach
The permalink to the specific document on his Blog:

Tuesday, March 28, 2006
Document: The French and German Connections in January 2003

18 posted on 03/28/2006 11:19:01 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Peach

Good idea!


19 posted on 03/28/2006 11:19:52 AM PST by tiredoflaundry (I'll admit it , I'm a Snow Flake !(Snoq) The rest of my tagline redacted by court order.)
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To: Peach


Thanks for info.


20 posted on 03/28/2006 11:20:20 AM PST by jazusamo (Excuse me Helen, I'm answering your first accusation. - President Bush)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Thank you, Ernest. That's a much better link.

I don't know how to link and then change the words to reflect the title the way you did.

bbl


21 posted on 03/28/2006 11:20:25 AM PST by Peach
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To: jazusamo

You're welcome; I've bookmarked it.


22 posted on 03/28/2006 11:20:56 AM PST by Peach
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To: Tony Snow; Peach; jveritas

Tony, for your crack research staff.
http://iraqdocs.blogspot.com/


23 posted on 03/28/2006 11:22:07 AM PST by tiredoflaundry (I'll admit it , I'm a Snow Flake !(Snoq) The rest of my tagline redacted by court order.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

Can a small group of Freepers go to Syria and pick up those weapons?


24 posted on 03/28/2006 11:23:18 AM PST by woofie
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To: holdonnow

Mark, share this with Sean and Andrew.
http://iraqdocs.blogspot.com/


25 posted on 03/28/2006 11:24:46 AM PST by tiredoflaundry (I'll admit it , I'm a Snow Flake !(Snoq) The rest of my tagline redacted by court order.)
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To: tiredoflaundry

Thank you!


26 posted on 03/28/2006 11:26:00 AM PST by Peach
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To: Peach
Glad to help, they have done a nice job on the Blog....I like this:

Monday, March 27, 2006
What is a patriot? One who loves, supports, and defends one's country.

******************************************************

jveritas is the man behind this blog. He is a true patriot. For now, I am helping him by taking a tiny part of the work load from his shoulders by doing these posts. He has been scouring the newly released documents the US intelligence community is releasing. There are millions of documents. This is a big job. We could use your help.

27 posted on 03/28/2006 11:27:05 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Peach

Your welcome!


28 posted on 03/28/2006 11:27:47 AM PST by tiredoflaundry (I'll admit it , I'm a Snow Flake !(Snoq) The rest of my tagline redacted by court order.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

I think a few other freepers have helped translate documents, but I don't remember their names.


29 posted on 03/28/2006 11:29:16 AM PST by Peach
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To: woofie

You'll need a turbin, AK-47 and an RPG launcher,....might need some friends too....I'm too old to travel so count me out!


30 posted on 03/28/2006 11:30:15 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

type....turban.....I think.


31 posted on 03/28/2006 11:31:37 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach
This document at least shows that the Chinese intelligence believed that Saddam had WMD. It is important for the political debate because a document like this demolish the "LIE" of the Left that President Bush lied to get us into war. He did not lie to us because every intelligence agency in the world thought so, including many in Saddam top military and intelligence leadership.
32 posted on 03/28/2006 11:34:13 AM PST by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: jveritas; Peach

Exactly right.....nice Blog you got going....just excllent!


33 posted on 03/28/2006 11:36:20 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Peach; LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget
Great thanks to freeper "LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget" who came up yesterday with this blog idea and set it up for me. All the credit should go to him.
34 posted on 03/28/2006 11:36:48 AM PST by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget

Thank you :) Please see post 34 because all the credit goes to freeper "LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget" an excellent software engineer who built the whole blog in matters of hours.


35 posted on 03/28/2006 11:39:27 AM PST by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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To: MeanWestTexan

Yah, they did, but you have to go back about 70 years.


36 posted on 03/28/2006 11:40:17 AM PST by LS (CNN is the Amtrak of news)
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To: jveritas; LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget

LTGM built that web site in a matter of hours? You'd never know -- it's very professional.

Kudos to you both and thanks again.


37 posted on 03/28/2006 11:41:29 AM PST by Peach
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To: jveritas

Well there are going to be a load of newsapers trying to get credit for your work. Well done my FRiend.


38 posted on 03/28/2006 11:44:25 AM PST by mware
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To: neverdem; Tolik; MEG33

iraq runup ping


39 posted on 03/28/2006 11:44:27 AM PST by King Prout (many complain I am overly literal. this would not be a problem if so many were not under-precise)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

I know a guy with a Humvee...and my neighbor is a good shot


40 posted on 03/28/2006 11:48:38 AM PST by woofie
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To: jveritas

It is a lot easier than you think. Even a lib can blog. ;-)


41 posted on 03/28/2006 11:53:00 AM PST by LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget (God punishes Conservatives by making them argue with fools.)
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To: woofie

ROFL!


42 posted on 03/28/2006 11:55:15 AM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach (History is soon Forgotten,)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach

My wife started Freeping after she realized I knew all events long before she did.


43 posted on 03/28/2006 11:57:39 AM PST by bmwcyle (We got permits, yes we DO! We got permits, how 'bout YOU?;))
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To: eyespysomething

SARINDAR


44 posted on 03/28/2006 12:02:37 PM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: Ernest_at_the_Beach; eyespysomething
2. Was Schroeder's denial of Iraq moving WMD largely a result of his own knowledge that Iraq still had weapons of mass destruction in their own country?

It's probably already been pointed out a dozen of times, but in the great tradition of Freepers everywhere I am posting without reading the thread.

How did Iraq find out about this conversation between Germans and Chinese? The Germans told them.

The Germans, like the Russians and French, were double dealing with the Iraqi terrorist-supporting, weapons of mass destruction moving Regime.

Our good friends in the UN security council were up to their eyeballs in it. The beans have spilled and the Germans and French and Russians have been exposed.

Therefore, whatever Schroeder told the Chinese (or the U.S. for that matter) is highly suspect and most likely disinformation to help cover his own tracks.

45 posted on 03/28/2006 12:06:34 PM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: jveritas
JV - your work is some of the most important being done to preserve the reputation of the United States and the Bush administration as true champions of freedom. Thank you for you efforts.

You might find it interesting to pick up a copy of "The Secret History of The Iraq War" by Yossef Bodansky and go to page 438 (in the hardback version) and read what he wrote in early 2004 about movement of Iraqi WMD to Syria - and Russian involvement in Iraq before and after the war. Page 501 also has some interesting references to WMD.

Given Bodansky's previous key position as Director of the Congressional Task Force on Terrorism and Unconventional Warfare, I find it amazing thet the charges contained in his book did not recieve a huge amount of attention of the administration and congress.

Bodansky's book confirms, in February 2004 (date on the introduction to his book), much of what you and others are unconvering the hard way by translating the Iraqi documents.

46 posted on 03/28/2006 12:08:52 PM PST by HardStarboard
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To: jveritas
JV - your work is some of the most important being done to preserve the reputation of the United States and the Bush administration as true champions of freedom. Thank you for you efforts.

You might find it interesting to pick up a copy of "The Secret History of The Iraq War" by Yossef Bodansky and go to page 438 (in the hardback version) and read what he wrote in early 2004 about movement of Iraqi WMD to Syria - and Russian involvement in Iraq before and after the war. Page 501 also has some interesting references to WMD.

Given Bodansky's previous key position as Director of the Congressional Task Force on Terrorism and Unconventional Warfare, I find it amazing thet the charges contained in his book did not recieve a huge amount of attention of the administration and congress.

Bodansky's book confirms, in February 2004 (date on the introduction to his book), much of what you and others are unconvering the hard way by translating the Iraqi documents.

47 posted on 03/28/2006 12:08:54 PM PST by HardStarboard
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To: woofie
Can a small group of Freepers go to Syria and pick up those weapons?

It'll be Thursday afternoon before I can get away, but I'm toting if that helps.

48 posted on 03/28/2006 12:09:58 PM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: HardStarboard

Does Bodansky refer to the Russian "Sarindar" plan?

http://www.washtimes.com/op-ed/20030820-081256-6822r.htm

"The Soviet bloc not only sold Saddam its WMDs, but it showed them how to make them "disappear." Russia is still at it. Primakov was in Baghdad from December until a couple of days before the war, along with a team of Russian military experts led by two of Russia's topnotch "retired"generals: Vladislav Achalov, a former deputy defense minister, and Igor Maltsev, a former air defense chief of staff. They were all there receiving honorary medals from the Iraqi defense minister. They clearly were not there to give Saddam military advice for the upcoming war—Saddam's Katyusha launchers were of World War II vintage, and his T-72 tanks, BMP-1 fighting vehicles and MiG fighter planes were all obviously useless against America. 'I did not fly to Baghdad to drink coffee,' was what Gen. Achalov told the media afterward. They were there orchestrating Iraq's "Sarindar" plan."


49 posted on 03/28/2006 12:25:42 PM PST by SittinYonder (That's how I saw it, and see it still.)
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To: LesbianThespianGymnasticMidget

LOL...


50 posted on 03/28/2006 12:43:57 PM PST by jveritas (Hate can never win elections.)
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