THE KEY WORD HERE IS ILLEGAL

Sierra Times ^ | 4/14/2006 | Al Benson, Jr.

[Wil H]

It has NOTHING to do with race.

No one is protesting the immigration program that has been ongoing for over a century and a half. Providing that they are of good character, we continually accept people of all races and colors with open arms - THROUGH THE FRONT DOOR !

What is being protested is that thousands of people of all races are pouring into the country and we don't know who they are, if they are criminals or not, if they wish to cause us harm or not, and if they are going to be an asset or burden to the community. Who cares what race or color they are, - it's not the point.

[r9etb]

But all the estimates I've read are around 1000+ per month.

That'd be only 12,000 per year -- which is a bit low. Did you mean, perhaps, "per day?"

[P-40]

wouldn't it make more sense to make the best of it?

It makes sense to at least try but it will be an uphill battle. So long as the "they pay taxes" and "they are only doing the jobs that Americans won't do" kind of crap is in all the MSM 24/7/365 then most American voters and the people they elect to represent them will never understand the problems well enough to actually do anything about it.

[r9etb]

It has NOTHING to do with race

For you and me....

What is being protested is that thousands of people of all races are pouring into the country and we don't know who they are, if they are criminals or not, if they wish to cause us harm or not, and if they are going to be an asset or burden to the community.

Now we're getting somewhere -- your complaint here centers on "knowing who's here and why." That's something specific that can be addressed.

Many of these folks cross the border because there's a demand for their labor -- and one could argue that those people are an asset.

The "guest worker" idea addresses this: you could match willing workers with employers; you'd have a means whereby they could be tracked; you'd have a means of taxing them; you'd have a means of detecting false IDs; you'd have a way of auditing American employers; and you'd cut down on the incentive to cross the borders -- which makes the border enforcement problem more manageable.

[r9etb]

"they are only doing the jobs that Americans won't do" kind of crap

This one is legitimate, though. Americans can do better on welfare, than they can doing (e.g.) agricultural work or other manual labor.

It's no accident that the white migrant workers in my hometown disappeared at the same time the Great Society programs started ramping up.

[trubluolyguy]

I'm sure, at this point, someone will rise to accuse both Williams and Sowell, who are black, of being racist because they oppose illegal immigration.

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I happen to agree with both of these men, but lets not pretend that black people are incapable of racism.

[trubluolyguy]

And what nation's leaders, in their right minds, would allow a flow of illiterate human debris from a third-world country like Mexico to dilute the national IQ and add to the burgeoning welfare case loads?

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Apparantly our nation. Apparantly the party that supposedly loves this nation. Apparantly a lot of them just love money.

[mo]

There's no shortage of issues arising from illegal immigration...but in the end, the core issue is collusion on the part of American leadership with Mexican leadership to offload Mexico's problem onto the backs of the American middle-class. Understanding the financial dynamics behind this is essential to disrupting the process.

[trubluolyguy]

That would work if he was insinuating that ALL Mexicans are stupid ignorant scum. He wasn't. You inferred that he was due to your own predispositions.

[P-40]

Americans can do better on welfare

If they take welfare and work "off book" they can do really well. I've seen some welfare fraud schemes that were frankly amazing.

The Great Society was one of those programs that may have had good intentions but was not very well thought out. It created the entrenched sense of entitlement that is growing daily. Welfare drains the soul of the person receiving it and the pocketbook of those giving it.

[r9etb]

That would work if he was insinuating that ALL Mexicans are stupid ignorant scum. He wasn't. You inferred that he was due to your own predispositions

He insinuated nothing -- he came right out and shouted that the Mexicans coming north are stupid ignorant scum.

[upchuck]

Did you mean, perhaps, "per day?"

OMG, thank you. YES, per day.

Here's me: J

[r9etb]

The current state of the nation is strongly reminiscent of Rome in its declining years. Bread and circuses for the lower classes; a fawning devotion to prurient pursuits; reliance on outsiders for menial tasks; widespread disdain for the military; cynicism and corruption in the ruling classes....

IMHO, illegal immigration is probably symptomatic of a more general "bubble" in American wages and other employment costs, that drives outsourcing of production, as well as this "insourcing" of low-cost labor. A lot of unintended consequences out there, just waiting to make themselves known.

[Rockitz]

Congress needs an enema. Flush the turds out!

[Abundy]

What, in that case, would be Williams' complaint?

How about the effects on our economy for starters?

[Abundy]

To focus on the word "illegal" is ridiculous, however, and for some folks, also dishonest. The same people who will pile on to that word in this thread will foam at the mouth over any suggestion that Congress (which has the power to decide the definition of "illegal") will simply make border-crossing legal, via amnesty or some other means. I don't think the word "illegal" has much at all to do with this debate.

So, if your state decided tomorrow to make legal writing a bad check so long as it is less than $350 and made the law retroactive would you be so cavalier?

How about retroactively changing the law with respect to consentual sex between a 23 year old male and your 14 year old daughter?

Would you advance the same specious argument?

The bottom line is people are breaking the law and those charged with supporting and defending the law are ignoring both the illegal acts and their own oaths.

So now you can call me racist too I guess, since you won't have any logical means to refute my point.

[r9etb]

How about the effects on our economy for starters?

Which effects? And who is responsible for those effects?

[r9etb]

I'm saying that you'd still have the same complaints, even if Congress made them all legal tomorrow.

Focus on the actual complaints, rather than the word "illegal."

[B-Cause]

Bump

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