UFOs flew over Phoenix in '97, Symington says

ARIZONA DAILY STAR ^ | 3/23/07 | Tom Beal

[Quix]

THERE WAS ONLY, as I understand it,

ONE EVENT IN ANY GIVEN AREA FROM WELL NORTH OF PHOENIX TO TUCSON.

There were no second chances.

Also, there is reportedly ET ability and probably ours by some technology to discourage folks from thinkng about cameras.

But, given a certain level of awesomeness, most folks just want to not miss a second and keep observing.

And, evidently the highest quality most impressive video really was confiscated by the MIB.

But, hey--if first hand observers of great training and experience are not your thing--enjoy the TYPE II ERROR risk. There are lots of hazards with that risk, too. But it seems to be much more in keeping with your bias.

[Quix]

Methinks there's a high probability you were jaded coming out of the womb.

[Quix]

I don't think your biases would allow you to recognize proof if it bit your right arm off at the shoulder.

[Rokke]

"ONE EVENT IN ANY GIVEN AREA FROM WELL NORTH OF PHOENIX TO TUCSON."

That took place over a four and a half hour period? As the crow flies that is a distance of about 300 miles. You could drive a car that fast. And nobody in that period of time, over that distance, across the two largest cities in Arizona could grab a camera and record the event?

"Also, there is reportedly ET ability and probably ours by some technology to discourage folks from thinkng about cameras."

Good grief.

"But, given a certain level of awesomeness, most folks just want to not miss a second and keep observing."

Have you seen the countless video's of the World Trade Center being struck and tumbling down? Some of it filmed from just below the crashing buildings?

"And, evidently the highest quality most impressive video really was confiscated by the MIB."

I'll assume you are being sarcastic here.

"But it seems to be much more in keeping with your bias."

A person attributing extra terrestrial manipulation and men in black intervention to explain why millions of people somehow managed to not record a slow moving, three mile long spaceship passing a couple thousand feet over their heads is not entitled to accuse ANYONE of bias.

[Central Scrutiniser]

I don't give a rat's ass what you think of my home page, I didn't design it for you.

I did it to have some fun, show some pics I took underwater.

If it offended you, then it served its purpose.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Also, there is reportedly ET ability and probably ours by some technology to discourage folks from thinkng about cameras.

Proof? Reports? Evidence? You really are mentally a child aren't you?

[Central Scrutiniser]

I don't think your biases would allow you to recognize proof if it bit your right arm off at the shoulder.

I wouldn't know, you have yet to produce any proof. Show me a UFO parked in the middle of a large metropolis. Show me some actual proof, not your kook wank material.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Quix is what they what they would, politely call "a nut".

No proof, no evidence, just pure gullibility mixed with ignorance. I almost feel sorry for arguing with him, as there really isn't much there.

Mut he keeps asking for it.

"A certain level of awesomeness"

Who the hell writes like that?

[Quix]

"And, evidently the highest quality most impressive video really was confiscated by the MIB."

I'll assume you are being sarcastic here.

= = =

No. I think that was one of the witnesses Mike Fortson interviewed and was convinced the guy was telling the truth.

I have biases honed from 45 years of studying the topic and having a relative work around such craft. But they are not blind biases.

The disinformation is so heavy in the field, it's hard to tell where the truth lies most of the time in most respects.

But the AZ transit of these big craft seems to be well represented by high quality witnesses from beginning to end. Yes, 30-40 mph is not fast. Yes, it's logical to think there should be lots of photos. The cameras 10 years ago were less available and less high quality unless film than what we have now.

However, since coming back from being in Asia for 15 years, I think most Americans are just not very observant and often just don't give a rip about much of anything--keep their noses down and focused on their own narrow world.

Anyway--if I find other better photos, I'll ping you. But I personally don't have to see high quality photos. I know that given a certain number of well interviewed quality witnesses, the truth is not that divergeant from a distillation from such an investigation.

But I'm not as cynical as so many seem to be that come to such threads to be derisive and throw rocks.

I mostly collect puzzle pieces and wait to see what's confirmed. I've held the Phoenix lites as an unknown for a long time--not knowing what to think. But I talked to my sis who lives there not too long ago. And I talked extensively with Mike Fortson. I'm not convinced on the side of the large UFO craft.

I wouldn't be surprised if it was ours or if it was ET's or a joint craft.

Mike had a simulation video a friend had created which was very educational. The dark grey sky and the black ship were dramatic but could have been easily missed by a lot of people depending on how and where they were looking.

But the retired military officers and airlline pilots flying above the craft looking down on it--those were impressive sightings, to me.

Seems like FREEPERS would normally respect such military observations--except on a UFO thread. Go figure. Arrogant cheeky cynics, imho.

[Quix]

I didn't feel offended. You failed on that score.

It was kind of . . . sad, somehow.

[Quix]

I think you must be slipping.

Your assaults are getting weaker and less viscious.

Are you well? This chest congestion junk going around can really take the energy out of you. I hope you're not coming down with it.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Nope, I've asked you for proof.

You keep wussing out.

Come on, show some proof.

You can't.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Another poster said that I shouldn't bug you, that you were regarded by this board as being mentally ill.

I didn't believe them till now.

Satan, UFO's, NWO!!!!!

What does Santa and the Easter bunny have to do with it?

(BTW, you haven't shown any proof yet)

[Quix]

Ask for the moon if you wish.

I don't really have much motivation to give you much of anything.

You certainly haven't earned the right to get anything from me but my used toilet paper.

[Central Scrutiniser]

Nice way to puss out.

You have nothing, or else you would have provided it.

Typical conspiracy theorist.

Make crazy accusations, but don't have the guts to back it up.

No proof.

As usual

[Pro-Bush]

NEC creates a new standard of storage

There is a lot going on with storage now. Some companies get the next-gen technology to leak into the private sector.

[Alamo-Girl]

Truly, the whole discussion of end times prophesy belongs on the Religion Forum – not news.

Nevertheless, since it has been posted here, and you two are engaged in this bitter sidebar - I will offer a few tidbits for the discussion.

Enoch never made it into the canons because of the theme: the nature and deeds of the fallen angels. Filastrius condemned it as heresy and Rabbi Simeon ben Jochai pronounced a curse upon those who believed it. So it fell into disfavor and was lost for a millennium.

This even though some of the earliest Church Fathers embraced the book: Tatian, Irenaeus Bishop of Lyons, Clement of Alexandria, Tertullian, Origen, Lactantius and so on.

Even so, Enoch was cherished by the church in Ethiopia and a few other places. And in 1773, James Bruce obtained a copy of Enoch from the Ethiopic church.

One of presuppositions of scholars who investigate ancient manuscripts is that prophesy cannot happen. Therefore if a manuscript refers to something which is a verifiable bit of history then it had to have been written after that date.

Because Enoch refers to Herod and includes many references to Christ (“The Elect One” - see Luke 9:35) – the scholars dated Enoch after Christ.

But then Enoch was found at Qumran (Dead Sea Scrolls) and was carbon-dated there to around 200 BC.

So naturally something had to give – but it could not be their presupposition, so it had to be their interpretation. That’s a real knee-slapper to me, btw.

But I digress….

Basically, Enoch expands on this passage of Scripture leading up to the Noah Flood:

And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they [were] fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. And the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also [is] flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare [children] to them, the same [became] mighty men which [were] of old, men of renown. – Genesis 6:1-5

In Enoch, the Watchers are the angels – the “sons of God” in the above passage whose job was to care for Adamic man. Instead of caring for Adamic men, they taught mankind all kinds of things he was not to know. Worse, they slept with mortal women having offspring which were ravenous, murderous giants.

This was the provocation leading to the Noah Flood. The Watchers were captured and incarcerated in heaven for judgment in the end of this heaven and earth (before the new heaven and earth.)

And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. - Jude 6

Their children – along with Adamic man and every thing and every one they polluted was destroyed in the Noah Flood. It is believed that the spirits of their children may have survived and are what we commonly call “demons.” Justin Martyr certainly thought so.

The Book of Enoch goes on to say that the Watchers themselves were very, very, very sorry for what they did. And God took Enoch from mortal life to be their advocate before Him. But it did them no good, they remain incarcerated.

And Enoch walked with God: and he [was] not; for God took him. – Genesis 5:24

Enoch is Noah’s grandfather, by the way.

The bottom line is that the Watchers cannot be released until God permits it.

Personally, I do not believe the Watchers have been released to torment the earth again. If they are the ones referred to in Revelation 9, they won’t be released until we are in the full blown tribulation.

And I do not believe the demons (their offspring) would appear like unidentified flying objects. In the Scriptures, the demons are grounded:

But when he saw Jesus afar off, he ran and worshipped him, And cried with a loud voice, and said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, [thou] Son of the most high God? I adjure thee by God, that thou torment me not. For he said unto him, Come out of the man, [thou] unclean spirit. And he asked him, What [is] thy name? And he answered, saying, My name [is] Legion: for we are many. And he besought him much that he would not send them away out of the country. Now there was there nigh unto the mountains a great herd of swine feeding. And all the devils besought him, saying, Send us into the swine, that we may enter into them. And forthwith Jesus gave them leave. And the unclean spirits went out, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the sea, (they were about two thousand;) and were choked in the sea. – Mark 5:6-13

[Central Scrutiniser]

Blah blah blah.

UFO's and fallen angels, etc.

Seriously, get a grip

[Alamo-Girl]

LOLOL!

[Central Scrutiniser]

The thread was kooky enough before you butted in with bible quotes.

Thanks for adding nothing.